... ... ... You can't be this blithering naive. You just can't. I won't deny that resources aren't problem. I will deny that if the Palestinians had enough resources that they would leave Israel alone. In the period leading up to the Second Intifada, Palestine was steadily growing more prosperous and was at a level which has not been seen since. Didn't stop them from well, the Second Intifada. Given how that didn't work, why should Israel trust the Palestinians and almost certainly pour their money into them ( which is what will happen?)
Ah, all the way back to that time when everyone was doing the conquering. Today time is different. The world is interconnected, everyone has capability to do serious damages, conquering any people isn't accepted to name a few. Actions of today assuming the condition of the time back then would be very foolish. Both are responsible. You think that if Israel isn't there, the Palestinians would put themselves into a corner. Taking responsible for constantly escalating and creating new generation of hater would be a nice step by the Israel leaders. Allowing the Palestinians a chance of a real future would be another nice step. If you are kept in a corner with no hopes of happiness for you and your family, and all you have is rock and hatred, you probably risk death. It's pretty clear that your viewpoints is one sided (and maybe crazily outdated to the time when the powerful conquer all). The Palestinians are solely responsible (including their babies) for their conditions. Israel is a don't care, whatever they do or don't do. Thus, the only solution is for the Palestinians to completely give up and completely trust that the Israel leaders will allow them freedom, or even if not given freedom, they should be happy and stay happy.
The point is that Israel IS there, it's their land and they aren't going anywhere. Either the Palestinians deal with the reality of the situation or they continue to hurt their own people, simple as that. As to my viewpoint being one sided, I could see how you would think that but let's face it, there is one side that won, one side that lost. There is one side that is weak and harming themselves by acting foolishly, one side that is strong. There's not really another way of looking at it, and that's not a moral take, that's just the reality of the situation. That said, It's good to finally see you talking some sense at the end. The Palestinians ARE solely responsible for their conditions, all people are solely responsible for their people. Israel doesn't care, and they have no reason to, Israel is responsible for Israelis, not Palestinians. And finally, yes, the only peaceful solution is for the Palestinians to completely give up their ambitions of destroying Israel and work towards normalizing relations between the two entities rather than always gearing up for war.
This is true. It is the reality. They own that land now, regardless of the history, and they won't let it go. Well, this is not true. Israel is keeping them in a terrible condition by preventing them from having an economy - essentially they are locked up in a massive prison. So they are not solely responsible for their condition - Israel has some of the responsibility. But you are right that ultimately it is up to the Palestinians to find a way to make for a better life. That is not the only solution. I think Palestinians need to better articulate what they want. Which is a VIABLE state, not a miserable one. There has to be removal of the settlements and restoration of at least the '67 boundaries. I think the "goal of destroying Israel" is more rhetorical and will be given up only if they get what they feel is a fair deal.
people can fight against the nazi invaders for hundreds of years. The human history shows the same story again and again. Palestinians people need to stand strong and fight to the last drop of their blood. Also, Palestinians are not alone any more.
If the Palestinians didn't have such an awful track record of trying to take over any time a country takes them in than they wouldn't be as "locked up". There's a good reason why no one wants them, because countries have gone down that road before and they know where it leads. Again, they are treated the way they are treated because of their action, not because everyone is just being mean to them. Without saying it, you basically said that you think that Israel should just give the Palestinians more of Israel in order to make peace. That's never worked before, why would it work now? Also, what's the incentive for Israel to do so? Rather than having Israel give up more of their land, why not just make that "viable" state in the West Bank? The West Bank is already a quarter of the size Israel is, how much more would they have to give in your opinion?
It's really sad if you "think" like that. That kind of moronic world view is exactly why the Palestinians are living such miserable lives rather than making something of themselves.
They don't want to be part of another country, they want their own country as envisioned by the process of self-determination. Your inferences are laughable. Palestinians are not asking Israel to give them parts of Israel. They are asking Israel to end the occupation of the West Bank, of the Gaza Strip, and of East Jerusalem. The incentive is obviously peace (why would you even ask such a stupid question?). As long as their is an occupation, the Palestinians have a legitimate reason to fight. As to 'why not just make that viable state in the West Bank'.. You clearly do no nothing. Do you think Zone A and B (aka 25% of the West Bank) is enough to create a country in? Zone C is 75% of the West Bank and contains 90% of the West Bank's natural resources and arable land. Israel was supposed to relinquish control of part of Zone C as per the Oslo Accords. Instead they redeployed more troops and built more settlements.
Well the harsh reality is that no one really cares what they want. They don't have the right to what they want and they don't have the power to take it. So you're saying that if Israel completely pulled out of the West Bank and the Gaza Strip, there would be peace this time around? Do you actually believe that? Terms of peace are never set by the losing side, and let's face it, the Palestinians are the losing side. Also, all they are doing by fighting is hurting their own people....since that's all they are accomplishing, they don't really have a reason to keep doing it. Even if they are sad about losing. I didn't ask why would they want more than they have, I asked why they wouldn't work to create that viable state in the West Bank. Unfortunately because of their actions, conditions aren't ideal, but rather than continuing to try and attack Israel, why don't they give that up and try to make a viable country with what they have? Picking the losing side in war has consequences, they should stop picking the losing side.
No one cares? You're delusional. Not one single country recognizes Israel illegal annexation of the occupied territories. Denying it doesn't change that fact. And East Jerusalem. And ended the blockade on Gaza. But that'll never happen because Israel wants Palestinian land much more than any Palestinian wants Israeli land. Terms of peace are not set, they are negotiated... like they have been for the past 30 years. Pay attention. Because a viable state is not possible within Zone A and B... Zone C contains all the resources needed to maintain sustainable growth and uphold a new economy. Majority of the West Bank has also stopped attacking Israel for quite some time. Instead of abiding by what was negotiated at Camp David and Oslo, Israel instead did the complete opposite and continued building settlements (ie - taking more land and then transferring its own civilian population onto occupied territory. For someone who constantly pokes fun at other user's intelligence, you seem to be having a difficult time grasping very simple concepts of history.
Growing prosperity wasn't the problem which lead to the second Intifada, it was Israel not following through on the land for peace they promised. It's odd that after Israel not giving up the land for Peace they had agreed to, you ask how Israel is supposed to trust the Palestinians. For the record Palestinians have broken their agreements in the past as well, so any kind of treaty is going to need verification from both sides. But it isn't really accurate to only claim one side isn't trust worthy.
Oh come on, is that the best you have? Why not make it 10 million? 100 million? 1 billion? You can use pretty much any number in the trolley game and it's the same. I know, that's over your head, it's no big deal.
How nice of you to ignore the initial post directed you (probably because of your inadequacies to know anything regarding the subject). What do you expect from someone who thinking "the Palestinians should just go somewhere else"? ROFL
Classic example of a straw man argument. Okay, and what is their incentive again? Basically if the Israelis agree to all of that they get to stop having to kill Palestinians for a few years till they want more? They are negotiated among equals, they are set by victors.....like has been the case throughout human history. Pay attention. Would that be "needed" or "wanted"? Well that's nice of them, would it make them feel better to know that a majority of Israelis aren't counter-attacking them? Most ops including air strikes and whatnot are relatively small groups of people.
So the Israelis will agree to a truce as long as their invasion force can continue operating in Gaza destroying whatever they want. Seems legit. That's literally about the dumbest freaking thing I've ever heard.
Clearly you do not know what a straw man is. If no one cared, there wouldn't be any news coverage, there wouldn't be any recognition of Israel's illegal annexation. Incentive is peace... Are you really this timid? They are not negotiated among equals... dunno where the hell you pulled that out from. Needed. You'd know this if you had any knowledge on the situation instead of thinking you're some scholar on the subject because you've read a few news reports that contain limited background information. That's a straw man argument. ROFL How embarrassing. The settlers are attacking them and cause hundreds of thousands of damages a year. But that's OK for you, because "Palestinians should just go someplace else".
