IT sets up dialogue between popular characters (Varys and Tyrion). I'm all for it. Isn't Varys non-existent in the books after this part? I'm glad he's getting a larger part. The Illyrio character wouldn't bring much
Jeeeeeeeeeeeesus H. Christ, if some of you won a huge lottery all you'd do is b**** about having to pay the taxes on it. If Marisa Miller offered you free clean cooch, you'd call it off if she had a mole on her thigh. I can be fairly picky but some of y'all need to take into account that this show gives a lot without Peter Jackson budgets.
Varys could replace Illyrio and it could work. In fact I pretty much expected that to be the case as soon as he appeared on the same ship as Tyrion. Kind of sloppy to be hiding Tyrion in a crate, and not hiding himself if he is fleeing though, but I expect the show will ignore that detail. Illyrio hasn't been mentioned since season 1, they removed the detail of him sending Barriston Selmy to Dany with Belwas, and so bringing him back seems rather unlikely. Varys has nothing to do til he kills Kevan. Of course not including Kevan this season is questionable, since he was Tywin's most trusted advisor and I don't know if viewers will even remember he exists. I guess they could say he was running Casterly Rock or something, and have him come back for Tywin's funeral. We shall see.
Ughh, I agree with the complaints honestly. It was understandable how they had to change some things early on, it just made sense (stuff like no Strong Belwas, cutting the other two Tyrell brothers, etc.), which I thought took away from the overall depth of the novels but had to be done for TV. But now they are nearing into this dangerous ground that film-makers get into, where they randomly change things from the original source. I'm not sure exactly why. To make it better? Leave their own mark? It's understandable with an epic like Game of Thrones that you won't be able to make it exact, but don't go out of your way to change it. It might even be cool to see a show that is different then the books to make it interesting/unpredictable to watch, but their changes just haven't made sense IMO.
God I'm growing to hate book readers, so much whining. Tysha played a very small part in the show, key word show. Most show watchers forget tons of details book readers remember. A lot of people had to be reminded what was up with Arya's coin, and that was a fairly significant event, what makes you think they would remember a passing conversation from 3 years ago. They have to try and keep the show streamlined, ergo Tyrion is furious over shae, a recurring character, not a character mentioned once 3 years ago. Varys, an established character, becomes Tyrion's advisor, not a character that hasn't been seen since season one. No Strong Belwas, he hasn't done anything that the countless other men riding Dany's jock can't do. I guess i'm just capable of enjoying a show without expecting a word for word interpretation of what I've already read.
I understand your comments, and can understand them. I also try to watch the show without compairing it to the books (the fight of the hound and Brienne didnt bother me at all). However for me Tysha was very important for the development of Tyrion. Also it was vital in his killing his father and in the breaking with his brother, which both were huge for his development. Also that she doesn't occur in the series leads me to conclude that she will not be that important anymore in the books. So I agree with you in most part, except Tysha was to important for me to leave out.
I agree with arno_ed on the whole Tysha issue. I assume that in the books Jamie and Tyrion will put the item of Tysha behind them, or never meet again - regardless, it can't be a major storyline unless Tyrion finds out later on. I thought it was a HUGE element in Tyrion's character development, so was surprised to see it left out. It was also the major motivating factor for him killing Tywin... I prefer the smaller details in the books of course, but understand the show needs to deviate. I'm thinking that the show is now running into spoiler territory for book readers, as things that have been changed or omitted must not affect the major story-lines, otherwise Martin would have intervened.
Exactly, it was the first thing I pointed out last page. I don't remember correctly, but I think Tyrion actually punched Jaime over it too. The fact his father did that and was caught with a w**** transcended the bounds of hypocrisy, leading Tyrion to kill him.
This thread will probably take a nose dive as the next book is pure and utter ****. I barely remember much apart from Cercei's **** up's/walk of shame.
Master Baiter: On Jon Snow's parentage: The show has not told us about the Tower of Joy at all to my knowledge. I don't believe we have even been given the whole "Promise me Ned" or however it is said in the books line. We don't have the details about Lyana being guarded by the Kings Guard. All the show has told us is that Ned had a b*stard when he cheated on his wife during the war and he keeps it very private. The one character who really discusses it with him (King Robert) says he keeps it private because of his honor, basically being ashamed that he cheated.
I think that you make very good points. I figured you were thinking of the Azor Ahai theories. My thoughts are that most of the Jon Snow theories are just that. Anything that points to it being true (and I do subscribe to this theory) could possibly be the person molding certain events to fit the theory. The fact that there is mystery around Jon being Ned's b*stard and the uncertainty of the Robert, Lyanna, Rhaeger love triangle is enough to at least entertain the Jon Snow theory. Would it be a stretch for a TV Show watcher only to come to that conclusion? Absolutely. Is the theory a spoiler? I think not. My biggest gripe with the TV Show people are their laziness with the material. "I don't remember this being in the show!!! Why do you spoil everything!!!" Bull****, you just don't know that it happened because all you want to see are gore and t***. It isn't like everything is just easily laid out in the books. It takes a lot of work to piece everything together. Perhaps laziness is too strong of a word but I can't think of anything better at this point. Hopefully you get my drift.
In general I think fan theories of book readers should be left out of that thread. A show watcher who knows nothing of the books would not possibility be theorizing that Rhaegar and Lyanna were in love and eloped and had a baby that she died delivering and Ned promised to keep him safe from Robert so he raised him as a b*stard thus making Jon Snow a Stark-Targaryan. (spelling) So why mention it in that thread? Relentless mentioned both that theory and the Azor Ahai theories, neither of which have been talked about at all on the show. The reason they are spoilers is because a show watcher will say "What are you talking about?" They will either get a spoiler by asking or by looking it up. If you mention Azor Ahai to a show watcher who is truly spoiler free, they will have no idea what that is. If they google it they will get a lot of information that hasn't been talked about on the show. The reason that is a spoiler is because if it DOES get talked about on the show, it will not be exciting to them anymore because someone wanting to look smart made some comment in a thread 2 seasons back. That's perfectly fair and I get that. I watch the show very intently and I pick up on most details. That's how I watch a series though, I go total immersion. I think if you aren't going to do that you should avoid the internet all together if you don't want people who do to discuss it.
I think that the way Relentless discussed the theory was out of line. I will also stipulate that my knowledge from the books likely make me biased in the way that I view the TV show. That is why I more often than not stay out of that thread entirely. I think more people should as well. I didn't realize that Relentless discussed the Azor Ahai theory. I know it was touched upon briefly but not enough to come up with a theory about Jon Snow. I think Melisandre seeing Jon Snow through the pyre fire was our first foreshadowing of that. Any discussion of AA and JS at this point is ridiculous. I am the same way with total immersion. When it was hinted that a GoT show was coming I picked up the books and started reading. With as much GoT material out there it would be impossible to not have something spoiled at some point.
As a TV show viewer only, this is a pretty hard show to follow. Like justtxyank, I try and intently watch the show but I found reading a game of thrones wiki about Aegon the Conqueror and Roberts Rebellion (along with current character bios) really sets up the show and all the moving parts. Laziness is barely too strong of a word.
I compare it to when I watched LOST. It was a difficult watch and it was enjoyable to read all of the extras on the internet. GoT has way more material to go through than LOST.
On the Tysha issue - the fact that Tysha hasn't been mentioned since season 1 is kind of the fault of the showrunners, no? Bronn and Tyrion could have had a little discussion on it, Tyrion and Jaime could have talked about her before his trial by combat rather than the beetles.
