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Has Lebron surpassed Magic/Bird in your All Time Greatest List?

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by adobo, May 30, 2014.

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Would you put Lebron above Bird/Magic in your all time greatest list?

  1. Yes

    104 vote(s)
    40.6%

  2. No

    83 vote(s)
    32.4%

  3. Undecided Yet - Need a few more years

    69 vote(s)
    27.0%
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  1. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    Using the first 11 years kind of short changes Lebron. Larry was a 23 year old when he came into the league and Lebron was 19. I think it's more fair to judge Lebron v Bird from the age of 23 to 29. Also, I think TS% should be used instead of simple FG%.

    Either way both guys are amazing players and I'm sure Larry's TS% would be higher if he grew up in the era of the 3 point ball.
     
    #121 robbie380, Jun 5, 2014
  2. Aleron

    Aleron Member

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    Take away both rookie years, I have no idea how the result would end up but i think counting the rookie year ultimately alters the outcome more than anything.
     
    #122 Aleron, Jun 5, 2014
  3. Throttle

    Throttle Member

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    #123 Throttle, Jun 5, 2014
    1 person likes this.
  4. adobo

    adobo Member

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    You don't think it short changes Bird too? I mean he was 33 years old by his 11th season in the NBA + plagued with injuries in his 10th/11th season while Lebron is still 29 in his 11th season. Is it Lebron's detriment that he hasn't had a serious injury? Is it Larry's detriment that he went to college instead of directly going to NBA?

    If we start from age 23, that means Lebron would had already 4 years experience in the NBA and Larry with 0....is that really fair?
     
    #124 adobo, Jun 5, 2014
  5. Air Langhi

    Air Langhi Contributing Member

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    Lebron's 2009 cavs playoff run was probably the greatest I have ever seen. Better than anything even Jordan has done, but his team lost.
     
    #125 Air Langhi, Jun 5, 2014
  6. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    This is idiocy.

    His usage is higher because he is a more productive offensive player.

    "Adjusting for usage" is like adjusting for the scoring champion based on points per game.
     
    #126 SamFisher, Jun 5, 2014
  7. kevC

    kevC Member

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    This. If you adjusted for usage to compare players, Brandan Wright, Chris Andersen, and Kyle Korver would be the best players in the NBA.
     
    #127 kevC, Jun 5, 2014
  8. adobo

    adobo Member

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    LOL man...

    :rolleyes:

    usage rate takes into account how much % a player takes in FGA, FTA and turnovers compared to his team overall. FYI...It's a good guage on how much a player dominates the ball when they have possesion.

    What I'm trying to spell out to you is this....Lebron handles the ball more hence more turnovers (like a Point Guard)....he also shoots more hence higher FGA and also is given a lot of foul calls (even tho Bird plays in the Post more) hence higher FTA which equals higher USG%.
     
    #128 adobo, Jun 5, 2014
  9. CDrex

    CDrex Member

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    I picked "undecided", but my real answer is "yes, assuming he continues to play at an All-Star level for 5 years". With his health history and current dominance that seems a safe assumption, but I don't want to put the cart before the horse. He'll be #2 on my all time list if he continues his current pace and stays healthy until 35.
     
    #129 CDrex, Jun 5, 2014
  10. J Hard

    J Hard Member

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    Not only no, but help no.

    Lebron didnt have the mental toughness of these guys, and they were killas.
     
    #130 J Hard, Jun 5, 2014
  11. WinorLoseMate

    WinorLoseMate Member

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    If he loses this Finals, no. 2-3 Record in the finals? not so great. TD climbs the ladder in terms of greatest players of all time maybe cracking top 8.
    He wins? Most likely will surpass Bird/Magic.
     
    #131 WinorLoseMate, Jun 5, 2014
  12. adobo

    adobo Member

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    I agree. I reckon his level or close to Bird now. If he wins his 3rd ring he will pass him in my books.
    With so many years left he will leave him behindI
     
    #132 adobo, Jun 5, 2014
  13. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    What you're trying to spell out to me is that LeBron is a better offensive player than Bird - thanks for the tip, but I knew that already.
     
    #133 SamFisher, Jun 5, 2014
  14. GoRox2013

    GoRox2013 Member

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    It's funny. Fans and everybody across the world are waiting to see what other superstar Lebron will team up with once he hits free agency. Since when is teaming up with other superstars part of being a true competitor? This is why I think today's nba sucks compared to the days where guys hated each other. The bar of being a superstar was significantly lowered once LBJ teamed up with his friends in Miami.
     
    #134 GoRox2013, Jun 5, 2014
  15. plutoblue11

    plutoblue11 Member

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    They are doing something, right...you are watching. Guys, hated each other...you realize they aren't pit fighters and play a basketball game. Yet, if players really did hate each other and were getting fights, every game. Then, soccer moms and the regressive crowd would talk about how violent the NBA Iis and how many thugs are in the league. To me, it's the immature, entitled, overly criticizing fans who are collectively ruining the NBA...NFL...MLB...college sports.. who don't realize the rigors of being a great athlete.
     
    #135 plutoblue11, Jun 5, 2014
  16. adobo

    adobo Member

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    If you can't understand what i'm trying to say in both of the quotes then your a lost cause



    (hint: You disrespect Bird for saying that his stats are not that impressive if you adjust for pace....i'm trying to tell you he doesnt handle the ball and shoot as much as Lebron....basically im trying to say put the stats into context since he plays like a point forward and Larry plays more like a PF...at the same time i'm telling you that you put too much emphasis on like person A has 1 more assist than person B....if a great player who was the best for his period in his era is compared to another great player who is best in his era you put more weight on their accolades (rings, how long they dominated, MVP finals etc..) since comparing stats across era's are stupid since players adjust their game (i.e. usg) according to how the coach or the team feels he should be and also too many other factors to consider across era's)
     
    #136 adobo, Jun 5, 2014
  17. bullardfan

    bullardfan なんでやねん

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    I agree. He was doing that off of pure talent as well. If he got serious back then, he would have at least 2 more championships under his belt and prolly have surpassed MJ by now.
     
    #137 bullardfan, Jun 5, 2014
  18. Raven

    Raven Member

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    No, in no particular order, I'd rank Kareem, Magic, Bird, Jordan, and Duncan higher than LeDiva. I do place LeDiva higher than Kobe, though.
     
    #138 Raven, Jun 5, 2014
  19. Throttle

    Throttle Member

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    id rank lebron same as olajuwon :D
     
    #139 Throttle, Jun 6, 2014
  20. plutoblue11

    plutoblue11 Member

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    I know people like to scream no respect for Duncan, but I think he's below Wilt, LeBron, Kobe, and Shaq... Moreover, outside of titles, what makes TD better than Olajuwon.
     
    #140 plutoblue11, Jun 24, 2014
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