Probably... But he's top 5... Durant Lebron CP3 Melo Beard That is how i would rank them. His offense is leagues ahead of George's. They are not even close when it comes to that. PG still relies on streaky shooting
There is nothing valid about defensive win shares or defensive rating Let me repeat this, Absolutely nothing whatsoever. It's drawn from play by play data, the problem with this is that whilst i know when you shoot the ball, you can not in any way draw a valid number from your opposing players results. So George's man missing shots, is that because of George? because of Hibbert's tower in the middle? because of helping from Lance? You don't know, and this is why Evan Turner's defensive rating in Indiana is 100, Evan freaking no d ever Turner, because it credits you with your man's result even if its nothing at all to do with your defense.
What are you arguing? Everything you said flips when comparing their defense. 1) George is top 5, or better 2) Their defenses aren't close Turner's d-rating dropped significantly (111 to 100) since joining IND. Using your theory, that stat alone says teammates don't help a guys d-rating. PHI is ranked last in the league in both PA and FG%. Turner switched from literally the worst def team to the best, then his rating fell significantly. Not saying teammates don't help, just using your theory.
Howard, Asik, Hibbert, Sanders, Iguodala, Gasol are better defensive players. Harden and George's defenses aren't close. Neither are their offenses. They are both very good players and close in skill. Defensive rating...the lower the better. Turner's d rating matches his team.
Just to chime in here on your overall viewpoint of player evaluation, elite individual offense is more valuable than elite individual defense for a perimeter player every time. Who's a better player, Steph Curry or Tony Allen?
No surprise it took mostly centers. Perimeter-wise Iggy LeBron George Paul's offense is much better than Harden's defense. ----- The better defenders on IND all have better ratings. The top 10 players include Bogut, Noah, Duncan, Hibbert, George. DRating is far from perfect, but it's not useless.
It's not fronting when he ways Paul George is not as good as harden. The dudes been avg barley 20 a game on 17 shots shooting 40% from the field over his last 30+ games. Sorry he is what he is a nice young player but not a superstar. He def not on Lebron and KD level let alone even hardens.
The best stat for defense is the eye test...and the eye test clearly says one is better than the other.
Did you read the part where I said "Harden is better?". Laughable The poster "fronted" when he downplayed George's defense. IND's being good defensively is NOT the only reason George is #1. Agreed Not everything shows in stats. (i.e.- Harden's half-assed attempts at transition defense.... sometimes it's 1/4-assed)
If you put Harden on Indiana, his defensive rating would improve dramatically. If you put George on Houston, his offense would still be heavily reliant on his streaky jumper.
Wouldn't be anywhere near George's, though. IND wouldn't have 4 players in the Top 6 either. George's efficiency would improve dramatically with better offensive players around him. Same time, faster pace maintains his PPG. I bet 1/3 of our live-ball TOs would stop. Rockets forced more and allowed less points THIS season without James. Not saying we're better without Harden, just offering some info you probably wouldn't guess. Must underline before people bypass simple words on a screen.
Exactly. Elite offense beats elite defense nearly every time. That is why PG may never get past Miami... Lebron shot like over 50 percent against his defense.. Also though, defensively PG is ahead of the curve. Beard can still vastly improve as a defender. PG improving his offense to be top 5 will be a serious challenge. You just don't get those skills over night
Harden's offense (especially PPG) would also improve with the Pacers because he would be the sole primary option on that team, as opposed to having to share that role with Dwight. Pacers' big men both have a decent mid-range shot, meaning Harden is given even more room to operate in the PnR. The PnR would also be focused on getting Harden free as opposed to getting the shot to the rolling big man (which is mostly the case on this team with Dwight). Furthermore, having better offensive players around you wouldn't all of a sudden make your shot more accurate unless your USG% drops by a decent margin. James Harden for example has maintained a similar TS% despite the addition of Dwight Howard. Kobe Bryant, a jump shot heavy player similar to Paul George, maintained a similar TS% despite the addition of Gasol during his championship seasons.
Good post. Something to note here. Over the offseason, Harden's mid range game has improved tremendously. He has gotten better from an offensive stand point. His numbers are actually a bit lower and that has something to do with adding Dwight Howard. If Harden was the sole number one option on a team right now, he would probably be around 27 to 28 points per game right now.
According to stats.nba.com and 82games.com, Rockets scored more and allowed less points THIS season WITH James on a per possession basis.
Paul George all day everyday, especially when Harden plays his matador AAU D and allows his man to easily get in the lane and put pressure on D12 and TJ. Defense wins championships period!!! George's D is light years ahead of Harden's.
Paul George is Trevor Ariza with a better shot. Tight hips, lacks later explosion, but can get south to north(jump) pretty quickly. I have seen plenty of his games, and for those who actually think PG is better, than you are clueless.
Depends on the offensive players. Rockets have good spacing generally which has helped wing players shoot less contested shots and increase their FG%'s. Harden seems to be the exception, but his usage rate took a steep jump. While not a wing, Patterson is a good example of how environment affects shooting. Percentage went down when he went to Sacramento. Percentage is back up in Toronto. I've not seen him play in Toronto, but I expect Toronto does a decent job of getting him open looks.
