I haven't read through the majority of this thread, but I will say that it is hard to take a guy named "the Blake show" seriously.
God man I feel like I'm toying with you here because your basketball insight is incredibly bad. The difference you're citing has nothing to do with what I said. People tend to get caught up in raw numbers increase without understanding metrics or the value of statistics. Malone and Barkley improved statistically year to year because they weren't given the burden and responsibility of rookie Griffin. They came to veteran teams and had to work their way up the later. Griffin on the other hand came in as a near 40 minute per game player with not a ton of help around him and was made the franchise guy from day 1. So it's no surprise that as their minutes, role and totem pole place increase, their production increases. Where as if you take Griffin's raw stats at face value anybody without enough basketball knowledge will say "wow he's declining". When in actuality every valuable stat that actually matters says Blake Griffin is improving substantially every single year. This reminds me of the Paul George vs Blake Griffin thing recently. Griffin in 3 years has been far and away the superior player from start to finish. But because he started off so dominant as a rookie and had little PERCEIVED improvement, where as George had gradual improvement every year; people are quick to say Blake has stagnated and George is turning into a star. It's nothing but deception. This kind of understanding of a player requires actually knowing which stats matter and watching the games, areas you've come up short in obviously. Are you really nitpicking over a difference of 4 percent free throw shooting lol? Malone hit 70 percent in year 3, Blake hit 66. Although again if you dig deeper (which you never do) you'll learn Blake shot 70 percent last year if you take away the horrible first month of the season. He also shot 80 percent from the line in the playoffs. For example in our last game on Friday he shot 8/8 from the line. It's hardly a liability and despite what the percentages say, it's definitely improved a ton. I don't think you understand the difference between production and aesthetically pleasing. I don't care if Blake has the ugliest post game in the league as long as he continues to convert in the post at a high level, be the best finisher in the game outside of Lebron and if you think how a post game looks has anything to do with efficiency, you're not to be taken seriously. Remember you now how Dwight Howard a 10 year vet who still has an uglier post game than Blake Griffin... yet it gets the job done, ugly as it can be. Comparing Chandler to Olajuwon shows how far you're willing to take hyperbole instead of dealing in mature, intelligent conversation. Blake Griffin is a better player than Jefferson in literally every single way and it's beyond a reach to compare them. That would be like comparing James Harden to Kevin Martin. Ever hear of the expression of a million dollar move and a ten cent finish? That's Al Jefferson summed up. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5O0cc0I0vk
So dumb that I can't edit. I said it earlier but Blake's raw production dropped primarily because the Clippers added a TON of talent and ball dominant players in just one offseason. People have the illusion that Paul makes Griffin somehow yet when Paul isn't playing and Griffin gets to have the ball more, his numbers go UP not down. There was a 5 game stretch Griffin put up last year when CP3 was down that statistically hadn't been accomplished since Lebron James. He put up something asinine like 23 ppg, 10 rpg, 6 apg, 2.5 spg. Including a couple near triple doubles back to back against Portland.
You have your roles confused on what pg is supposed to do. Westbrook & Rose are shoot first guards who NEED to score to be effective. CP3 actually gets everybody else involved and picks his spots. Neither Westbrook nor Rose can get you 42pts & 17 assist in one game. They both are better athletes but Paul's a better overall player than both of those dudes
Uh Rose shot like 36 percent vs the Heat in the 2011 finals. Just because he took 26 shots a game or whatever and still put up points doesn't mean he didn't fail. I'm not sure how you weigh playoff success but CP3's furthest run is game 7 of the 2nd round while being a far superior career playoff performer to Rose. He lost to an elite and better Spurs team. Derrick Rose on the other hand lost 1-4 in the next round but mind you that was in the EAST, a much weaker conference. I'd take CP3's best playoff run over Rose's in terms of individually. As for the comparison to Westbrook's playoff success outside of the finals run in which OKC had one of the most loaded teams in recent memory and TWO superstars, what has he done? First round exits and lottery? People get way too ahead of themselves and forget everybody starts at the bottom and things take time. It's a team sport not an individual one.
You said that neither Barkley nor Malone had a 3 year stretch where their efficiency was as good as Blake Griffin's. Absolutely wrong. It's not really nitpicking since it goes to the heart of your argument. You've been going on about Blake Griffin's development as a player and have likened him to Barkley and Malone. Coming into the league, both Griffin and Malone were liabilities at the free throw line. Malone put in the work and improved substantially each year. Griffin did not. In fact, in his second year, his regression at the ft line was embarrassingly bad. I don't think you understand the difference between a "post game" and "scoring points in the paint". Griffin gets a lot of points in the paint due to deep positioning, offensive rebounds, transition offense, and having teammates create shots for him. He doesn't have a legitimate post game. You can't consistently give him the ball 10 feet from the basket and rely on him to score. No, it doesn't. Dwight Howard has a poor post game, but he compensates with elite defense and rebounding. It's an extrapolation of your own logic. You look only at efficiency and ignore the eye-test. Don't get mad at me b/c your argument is flawed. Well, in that comparison, since Jefferson can consistently create his own shot, he'd be Harden. And since Griffin relies more on his teammates to create offense for him, he'd be Martin.
No I said Griffin has a better 3 year start to his career than Malone and Barkley did so people need to relax and give the kid time, big difference. Obviously if you take the prime of either player their 3 best years kill Griffin's (as they should). Stop repeating the TNT/ESPN myths. Griffin has been a reliable scorer since he's been in the league. You sure as hell CAN dump the ball into Griffin 10 feet from the basket and get buckets on a consistent basis. What you WON'T hear from TNT/ESPN is that Griffin as a rookie was actually very clutch and was our guy. The reason you don't see it anymore is because the most clutch player in the NBA was added to our team in CP3. CP3 is such a good clutch player that you don't even WANT the ball in Griffin's hands to begin with anyways. Doesn't mean he can't be clutch or reliable, it's just his teammate being superior in that regard. What you also have to remember is his coach for his first 3 years was the infamous Vinny Del Negro. Blake would regularly have 15/8 type numbers at halftime.. only to inexplicably get the ball maybe 5 times the rest of the game, especially in 4th quarters where he averaged like two shots a game. So the addition of CP3+Vinny are to blame for this misleading perception. You're talking to me about eye test when I haven't missed a single game of Blake's career and have been watching Jefferson since he came out of high school and played for the Celtics lol? Jefferson is better at creating for himself but worse at finishing the play so what value does that have? Griffin on the other hand has unorthodox moves but creates for himself more efficiently because he's converting more.
Give me the better scorer, rebounder, passer, defender, more efficient guy over the guy with million dollar moves who's known as a chucker, atrocious defender and mediocre defender for his size. Nevermind that one is just a 3 year vet the other a what 11 year vet?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67UFfv9y51A I think Blake is far more skilled than the general opinion realizes. I hope he plays the same way he's played the last two games tomorrow and you'll see.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRNf1MOmSOE One of Blake's best games in terms of offensive output+variety of post moves. What's more is he was being guarded all game by Joakim Noah, an elite post defender by all accounts. He ate Noah alive.. with just 4 dunks on 34 points.
Stop presenting facts, Blake Show. These guys don't want to hear them. After all, Barkley said Blake has no post game and Barkley is right 100% of the time (hence his amazing sports betting record). Also, advanced stats are a myth. Blake has never scored a point that wasn't off an oop from CP3 or a lucky offensive rebound. Even during the whole season CP3 wasn't in LA I don't think Blake even scored.
Yea that's true, I better concede to the facts. 1. Blake Griffin scores 20.5 career purely on dunks. 2. CP3 creates everything for him and without CP3, he was nothing. 3. All post moves Blake Griffin uses are ugly and not a single one has ever worked. 4. Blake Griffin never gets double teamed. 5. Blake is a terrible defender. LOL
I don't know what is about the perception of Blake Griffin ... he is either this or that, but my stance falls somewhere in the middle though leaning closer to the Blake Show. From the games I've seen with Blake Griffin, I've seen what Blake Show is talking about, which is the versatility of Blake. Though at the same time, I've seen what other posters are pointing out in his one-dimensional play at times or his willingness to settle on the perimeter or use expansive post moves. I believe he's still a player in development, but a borderline all-star player into a full-blown superstar, not like the run-of-the mill Rockets prospect, though. Unlike most of our young players over the last decade, Blake Griffin is the real deal ... he's realistically a player I could compare to past NBA greats ... unlike Marcus Morris, Patrick Patterson, Donatas Motiejunas, or Nachbar. Wish one of them could turn into BG
TNT/ESPN analysis needs to be banished because it's an abomination. Luckily NBA TV's crew is very fair, knowledgeable and respectful towards ALL teams. TNT and ESPN lets the bias affect everything they say and they like to add a lot of bogus shock value things. Teams like the Thunder, Clippers, Knicks are attacked relentlessly by TNT no matter what they do. Any time they do something right it's brushed off as pure luck. Then you have teams they worship like the Grizzlies, Pacers, Bulls, Spurs etc... where all of the bad performances and beatdowns are swept under the rug, never spoken of again. But if they do well.. the hype train starts. I guess TNT hates big market, flashy teams.
Glad you see a lot of what I'm saying, because although I admit I'm a Blake homer, I'm also very open with my criticism of him. I'm well aware of his flaws. Not having enough go to moves when games get gritty, hesitating WAY too much, being passive on offense. Defensively still has a long way to go. Sometimes tries way too hard to be flashy by over dribbling and making things harder than they need to be, instead of just taking a damn shot or attacking the D. That doesn't change the fact that very few players have come into this league and put up 20.5/10.5/3.5 on great efficiency their first 3 years and work as hard as Blake Griffin. Also it's rare for 4th year players to be able to say they are 3 time all stars, two time selections for the All NBA 2nd team. Blake still has a lot of areas to refine but he's FAR more skilled and better than people give him credit for. One thing he doesn't nearly get enough credit for his is locker room attitude. Blake has endured more change on a personal level than anybody else the last few years on our team. When CP3 came in Blake suddenly wasn't the man anymore and he made big sacrifices for vets like Billups/Butler that he was already much better than. Not once has he complained, always the perfect teammate cheering everybody on and outworking everybody. Chauncey Billups and Grant Hill come from a career of playing with blue collar guys and both called Blake Griffin the hardest working player they have ever seen. Doc Rivers said the thing that stood out most to him about the team this summer that he never knew was how hard Blake Griffin worked. Said that he lives in the gym, first one there, last to leave always.
One thing that is really annoying about casual fans is that they speak in media generated platitudes like "in the playoffs the game slows down". They then use these "facts" to base their arguments (in this case against Blake since he gets a lot of offense in transition). But these aren't facts. The playoffs are no different aside from making adjustments. They aren't lower scoring or slower. Blake has happened to have gone up against an extremely tough defensive team in his two playoffs and that is why he hasn't looked as good as he is. But this would be true of any post player! Even if Blake scores a lot in transition or highlights, so what? Look at the b2b2b oops in the GSW game... no other big in the league could have run the floor so well to get thise "easy" scores. This is a part of the Clipper offense and it won't mysteriously disappear in the playoffs against most teams they'll face. Back when the Suns were contenders they ran the same **** in the playoffs and if not for a horrible call in the Spurs series w the bench brawl, they most likely would have won the title that year. The Clippers can use their current style to beat any team this year because the era of the "grit and grind" is coming to a close (and the Clippers have shown they can beat that style anyway).
People for some reason penalize players for getting the most efficient bucket in basketball. Like you said if 99 percent of players can't do it.. it's an asset. So in other words people are complaining that Blake scores too much of the most efficient shot in basketball? Wow somebody tell that clown to stop already lol! If somebody is good enough to have 5-6 dunk games which are a guaranteed 10-12 ppg... fu**ing good for them. Shaq did the same thing and had some of the greatest efficiency seen in NBA history without a pretty post game. Like you said the only two teams Blake has gone against in the postseason have been Memphis and SA.. the two teams he actually has the worst career averages against and that center their entire D on packing the paint on Blake. Nevermind that he was injured both years in the playoffs. BTW people that argue the dumb sh** "when the game slows down" must not know that teams like the Spurs/Thunder/Heat play at a faster tempo than the competition pretty much every game. These teams get out and run their asses off.
