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Jeremy Lin needs to be the sixth man

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by iam, Oct 9, 2013.

  1. novaman

    novaman Member

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    Most will view moving Lin to 6th man as a demotion. But in terms of what works best for the team, this might be the best move. Like it has already been said, Lin is a playmaker and he was able to create looks for the one dimensional players on the second unit. With Harden and Howard, and to a lesser extent Parsons, you don't need a playmaker, you just need someone to hand the ball off to them and go stand in the corner, hit a few open threes, and play defense, all of which Beverley can do well.
     
  2. torocan

    torocan Member

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    That's actually a terrible comparison.

    Lin's contract is more like a negotiated construction contract, but with balloon payments toward the end.

    The contract is for 3 years of services for a total remuneration of $25m. If the contract was $1, $1, and $24.999999M would you say that Lin was expected to perform like a $25M player? That would be ridiculous wouldn't it?

    Lin is expected to perform like an $8.3M player this year and next year. He's not expected to perform like a $15M player unless you think Lin believes he should be expecting $15.5M per year on his next contract.
     
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  3. 34to11

    34to11 Member

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    So it's not about how well the team does or even how Lin performs, it's all about the minutes?
     
  4. strifed169

    strifed169 Member

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    well you cant have a player with that contract limited to 20 mpg
     
  5. Knickskiller

    Knickskiller Member

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    lol imagine if Lin posted up the same numbers that Beverly got in the opening game. The 2nd unit is so weak now. For some reason they just clicked and did well.
     
  6. flamingdts

    flamingdts Member

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    So if the 2nd unit is "so weak now" because Beverley isn't with the 2nd unit, are you implying that Beverley is a much better offensive player than Lin?
     
  7. Knickskiller

    Knickskiller Member

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    sorry i didn't explain myself properly .

    Just imagine if jeremy posted the same numbers that Bev did from the first game with the 2nd unit.

    jbench (pacers) vs bev bench (pelicans)
     
  8. Fighton

    Fighton Member

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    the real question is - what do we need out our bench?

    the starters are set. whether it's bev or lin, not a big difference in outcome. with dwight your D will be that much better, and with harden and company, offense is not an issue.

    the bench, though, needs to be better on both offense and defense in order for us to contend. do we need bev's defensive pressure on the 2nd unit? keep in mind he's only 1 player. he can play awesome one-on-one D but if the other 4 guys aren't doing their part, it won't amount to much (see preseason game 1). or do we need a pg to control the offense and get everyone else easy scoring opportunities?

    i can't say i know for sure, but based on small sample size of two games, i'm leaning towards the latter.
     
  9. BallWiz

    BallWiz Member

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    Ill let the coach and team decide who does what. Ill play my role and watch the rockets till the bitter end.
     
  10. CXbby

    CXbby Member

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    'Fit' isn't why Lin should come off the bench

    I think people are looking at this from the wrong angle. If you believe Lin is better equipped to run the second unit, there is no reason why he can't do that and still start:

    1st quarter

    6:00

    Lin goes out for Beverley

    2:00

    Howard goes out for Asik

    0:00

    Harden out

    2nd quarter

    12:00

    Lin starts and runs the second team

    8:00-6:00

    Bring Harden and Howard back in. Depending on how Lin is playing, either close out the half with him, or bring Beverley back in for him.


    Rinse and repeat for 2nd half.

    1. Coaches do not employ 5 man substitutions in real games. One out of Harden, Dwight, or Lin can be in the game at all times, even if Lin starts. Lin can still run the second unit, even if he starts.(as shown)

    2. Dwight and Harden are going to play 35+ minutes a game. Unless Jeremy is going to be relegated to 12 minutes a game(highly doubtful), then he is going to play alongside those two one way or another, whether he starts or comes off the bench. There will only be around 12 minutes a game, max, when both the stars are out. Jeremy can run the team during this time, whether he is starting or coming off the bench.(as shown)

    ------------------------------

    So if 'fit' is not a worthwhile reason to bring Jeremy off the bench, what is? Because by experimenting with this throughout the preseason, the coaching staff is telegraphing loud and clear that there is legitimate debate over this.

    Well, I can think of a couple reasons why the coaches may feel this way:

    1. Confidence.

    The coach's confidence in Jeremy, and Jeremy's confidence in himself.

    It is no secret that Jeremy is a 'confidence player', meaning he runs hot when he is confident and runs cold when he loses it. There are plenty of examples of this type of player in the league, and I'm not sure how it is debatable that Lin is one of them. I mean, this is a guy who admitted on record that he was at the brink of tears last season, due to fears of being benched. This is a guy who admitted on record that he was close to quitting his rookie year.

    Where I am going with this is not that it's why he should start. The opposite: this is exactly a good reason why he should come off the bench.

    Jeremy's crisis in confidence is the source of his inconsistency on the court. I've said this numerous times, this is by far his biggest weakness. Not his outside shot, not his defense. When Jeremy is on he can be a highly effective player, but when he is off he can look flat out lost. Over the long run, this may average out to still be a net positive on the court, even a sizable net positive.

    However, on a team looking to contend, the coaches are looking for dependability from its starters. Consistency and reliability. Not variance. They have to be able to TRUST you.

    In that sense, Jeremy's up and down play is a perfect fit as a spark off the bench. The coach's have the option of riding him on days where he is hot, and sitting him more when he is off. Assuming Lin is still improving, he should be 'on' more often than not, so he will have plenty of opportunity to play big minutes still. But to start off the game, you HAVE to know what you are getting from your starters. Every night.

    We are contenders now. There is no more time for development and babying.

    2. There is another minor reason to bring Lin off the bench, or rather, to start Beverley. Listening to McHale talk about leaders the other day, something stood out. He was saying how sometimes the players follow the best players, but other times they follow the vets, or just the guys who go the hardest. Well, we don't really have any vets on this team, and if they are following Garcia then we are going nowhere. The one name that stood out was Beverley.

    Just from his demeanor on the court, his tenacity, the maturity that he plays with: Beverley is a natural leader. In fact, it is weird that he is about the same age as Jeremy, because he plays as if he is a 10 year vet. The other day in the scrimmage footage Beverley slapped Harden upside the head, playfully. I don't care if that's just a tiny anecdote, it shows me who is the Alpha. Trust me, Jeremy is not smacking Harden. In any situation, playful or not.

    Darrell Armstrong was the leader and heart and soul of that Orlando team with Tmac on it, and he was never close to being their best player. I see a lot of Armstrong in Beverley.

    In conclusion:

    There are legitimate reasons to bring Lin off the bench. But I don't see 'fit' being a big factor.
     
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  11. hbomb

    hbomb Member

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    So, you are saying that Lin can be a bench player because Beverly is a natural leader and because Lin needs the confidence that will arise from scoring on scrubs/other bench players.
     
  12. SC1211

    SC1211 Member

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    Unnecessary and provoking thread filled with the leadership narrative BS that media hacks love to stress. Fact is that Beverley being "feisty" has very little to do how motivated the other guys are. Any time a media guy says **** like "mental toughness", "leadership" or "setting the tone" I tune out. Yeah, don't act like an idiot and have guys that are knowledgeable about the game, but come on. It's all about fit.
     
  13. CXbby

    CXbby Member

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    If Lin's production is dependent on his confidence level, which sways like the ebb and flow of the tides, then he may be better served coming off the bench. Because as contenders we need consistency, at least to start off the game.

    That is what I'm saying.

    BTW, as a younger player, Lin can still overcome his inconsistency, which I hope he does. In which case he should start.
     
  14. ShiniKashi

    ShiniKashi Member

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    I could just as easily argue that confidence can stem from consistent playing time, and having a freer-er rein in the offense. Per 'Linsanity' and D'Antoni.

    "Lack of Confidence" or "Full of confidence arguments" are subjective and silly imo.

    I think Lin should be a 6th man with consistent minutes to get into his rhythm.

    He's very much a rhythm player.
     
  15. Knickskiller

    Knickskiller Member

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    lol lin is like a harden backup now
     
  16. CXbby

    CXbby Member

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    It's weird that that's what you took away from my post. "Leadership BS" was only a tiny fraction of why I think they want to bring him off the bench. His inconsistency is the main issue.
     
  17. Horry4theWin

    Horry4theWin Member

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    Lin's confidence level could also be contingent on his role. His confidence level was sky high level during Linsanity for obvious reasons and a big reason was that he had a coach that was reliant on the PG.That in itself and the differences between teams is part of the fit.

    Even if Lin doesn't start, he can still close out games. From what we've also been seeing and why Dwight was telling everyone the reason he came to the Rockets was to work on his post game. They've been trying some of that in the pre-season at least.

    Given the amount of focus Harden and Howard are going to get, that leaves less opportunities for Lin to create. I think it's win-win. It gives Lin another chance to play his style and be a PG.

    Another thing, whether people think Beverley is a top defensive PG in the league or think he's vastly overrated, he'll also get his chance to prove his worth. This is a great opportunity to see both players maximize their talents and if they're the real deal.
     
  18. Horry4theWin

    Horry4theWin Member

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    Bottom line: Take it as a challenge not a demotion.
     
  19. strifed169

    strifed169 Member

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    Lin should be the 6th man and be backup pg AND sg
     
  20. CXbby

    CXbby Member

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    A coach's confidence in you is EARNED, not given. You show consistency first, and then the coach trusts you. No coach in the league will do it the other way around.

    Unless he is on the hot seat about to be fired, the team is falling apart, and he is literally out of options...

    McHale is not D'Antoni. His job isn't close to being in jeopardy. And he has plenty of options at PG. It is on Jeremy to earn the coach's trust, this time around.
     

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