Official 2013 Budget/Debt Limit/Obamacare Crisis Thread

Ugh I'm sick and tired of this petty game of chicken where the government is held hostage. This is like the third time now? I'm pissed how low information voters threw this country's bipartisanship and focus on the middle class away. I'm pissed how transparent the gerrymandering has been, and how no one bothers to write a letter or email to legislatures, let alone protest in the streets.

Americans deserve the gridlock and dysfunctional Congress we see today. This BS is the result of our apathy, political ignorance, and disrespect for our civic duties. These clowns should never have been voted in. Talk to any campaign manager and you'll see how easy it is for Americans to fall for tricks and soundbites. Say what you will of the GOP, but they know how to talk unlike the p***y Democrats.

[/rant]

 

Great analogy. Sorry I have to spread rep before I give it to you again.

 

Recession is maybe a too overreaching term, the Executive does have the ability to create money supply that inflates the stock and real estate markets, but it has very little influence in creating middle class jobs. Are we in a recession? Well, the market is up, housing is recovering, the auto industry is faring better, the domestic energy industry is booming but the purchasing power for the the largest segments of society is going down.

Strange times, not quite as strange as the "stagflation" years but strange.


heres a new word I learned just now:

portmanteau : a combination of two (or more) words or morphemes, and their definitions, into one new word.

 

All that matters is they made the vote. I am furious with Boehner, I think he is a terrible leader. I am glad they went through with the vote. I know Harry Reid will vote for cloture and all that Ted Cruz can do is try and stall, and push for a 60 vote amendment, but that's all we've got, take it or leave it.

 

Sorry, screwed up those quotes, but I'm sure you can figure it out

Obviously this Red Bull hasn't kicked in.

 

So the Congress has a Constitutional duty to pass spending bills. If you fail your duties in any other job out there, you are fired. If the congress does not perform their duties, shouldn't they all be fired? Or at the very least, Congress should not receive any pay or benifits whenever the government shuts down. There should be direct consequences when they fail to do their jobs, or they would just keep on playing this game whenever they can.

 

In parliamentary systems, this level of gridlock would trigger elections. Unfortunately we dont have such a mechanism.

 

Those who are threatening to shut down the government are doing so because Congress has allowed the federal government to grow at levels that are unsustainable. They have to put their foot down at some point, this is as good as any, because it only gets worse from here.

 

shutting down the govt. does not stop new spending from happening, or the govt. from growing. It just means they aren't willing to pay the bills for goods and services they've already ordered and are in possession of.

If you order something or hire somebody, it's only right that you pay them even if you want to curtail future spending.

 

Refusing to fund the ACA is a step towards bringing the fed back under control. It's only one battle, but it is certainly necessary, imo. Shutting down the government is apparently the only way Democrats are even willing to consider discussions about curtailing federal spending, which has gotten utterly ridiculous. It will benefit this country in the long run.

 

Democrats are not willing to consider unfunding of the ACA. Even with the threat of shutting down the govt. Kicking people off of health insurance will not benefit the nation in any way.

You can curtail federal spending without refusing to pay bills you already owe on what you've already bought or hired.

 

Shutting down the government will not stop ACA from being funded or implemented.

 

Or they’re threatening to shut down the government because both the Supreme Court and the American people have voted to keep Obamacare and the only way for them to try to stop it now is to stomp their feet and scream really loudly and threaten to take down the economy. Of course, we’ve heard from this same crowd since 2009 that it only gets worse from here and it’s only gotten better.

On a side note, I do enjoy the laugh I get at the thought of people who don’t like Obamacare because of the uncertainty that it supposedly creates threatening to make policy decisions that create strong economic uncertainty to try to get their way.

 

The Democrats are recklessly not repealing Obamacare.

 

No, but threatening to shut it down is the mechanism for getting the votes to defund it.

The American people were sold a different piece of legislation. Nothing that was foretold is coming to fruition. It was all a lie. The American people didn't vote on Obamacare, they American people's representatives did not even READ the bill. That's not just Republicans, that's Democratic LEADERSHIP.

What has gotten better since 2009 in regards to the ACA? Premiums are on the rise. Doctors are jumping ship from Medicaid. Insurers are jumping out of the exchanges. 30 million people will STILL be uninsured even with full implementation. Big labor and big business are both being granted delays. The American people don't want this bill. The American people are stuck with this bill until someone stands up and does what is right.

This is not "we COULD see" X, these are things we are already seeing and it hasn't even been FULLY implemented.

This legislation is a train wreck and Democrats don't seem concerned. They would prefer the train keep moving, despite the effects it will have on the American people...at least until Obama is out of office. They care more about protecting his legacy at the moment than they do about doing the right thing for our country. I find THAT laughable, Anticope.

 

This is excellent news for Mitt Romney! I hope he runs on this platform, he may have a chance!

 

Not true.

Not true x 3.

TRUE! They don't vote on any federal legislation.

Not true.

Lots more people from young adults to the poor have access to health care.

True, though that was happening before Obamacare too.

True, though that was happening before Obamacare too.

Out of the exchanges that didn't even exist in 2009? How does that work?

In part due to the Supreme Court making Medicaid expansion optional, but yes. It will take time to insure people - that was fully expected.

There was entire election that was centered on this issue less than a year ago.

Not true; true.

True, and true. Though it should be "because of" instead of "despite".

 

So people are not allowed to stay on their parents’ coverage until they are 26? You will not be allowed to shop across state lines for insurance? People with pre-existing conditions will not be covered? These things were all advertised as being part of the bill in its early stages and they are all coming to fruition. Let me know when you see someone go before a death panel, BTW. The people did not directly vote for Obamacare, however, they did vote in an election that was centered around this issue for the President and the senate that passed this bill.

Premiums have been on the rise for years, but now suddenly it's happening because of ACA? The key provisions in this bill haven’t even been enacted yet, so how is it supposed to have that much of an effect already? You must think highly of the Democrats if you expect their policies to work before they are even fully enacted. Again, you can sit here and talk about what the American people want and don’t want, but they still keep voting for the side that creates the policies that they supposedly despise so much.

 

Yes, true. You may not think it will work, but that is the strategy. That is the end goal.

Yes, true. "The average American family will see a $2,500 reduction in premiums by the end of my first term as President of the United States." Really, because last I heard premiums are sky rocketing across the country. Yes. True.

At least you got this right.

Yes. True. Even Pelosi herself admitted it. Lawmakers on BOTH sides of the aisle have admitted it.

No, you are mistaking access to health CARE with health INSURANCE. Access to care has not improved. Giving people insurance does not equate to access to care.

Yes at and at a higher rate under Obama than the previous administrations.

And more are jumping ship now, as they expand coverage, but don't increase reimbursement rates.

I'm clearly not speaking about 2009.

No, 30 millions will REMAIN uninsured.

One the many issues, and Americans had yet to see the effects. The popularity of the Act was dropping prior to the election.

Really? Sen. Baucus is no longer a Democrat?

You may think so, but the facts and reality say otherwise. This legislation IS a trainwreck, it IS ruining health care in this country, and it MUST be repealed and replaced.

If you are unwilling to accept that the ACA has had drastic unintended consequences and is hurting the American people, you are either stubborn or a troll.