Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Lakers

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by trowa, Oct 31, 2012.

Tags:

Page 149 of 208

Carl Herrera Member

Joined:

Feb 16, 2007

Messages:

45,153

Likes Received:

21,575

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/62707/the-lakers-wont-win-free-agency

The second reason the Lakers may struggle to get a free agent is that Bryant has gained a reputation as a difficult teammate. The Lakers have been a fine destination of late for role players, but not for would-be stars such as Dwight Howard, Pau Gasol, Shaquille O’Neal and Andrew Bynum, none of whom get the ball as much as they'd like, and all of whom, despite playing well, become targets for media scorn.

“Pau is a two-time champion and a five-time All-Star and he’s one of the most disrespected players ever,” notes one agent. “He gets bad press all the time.”

Another agent says: "The Lakers are Kobe. You have to understand that. It's not the organization for you if you want the ball or the spotlight. All that glitters ain't gold."

I asked a third agent, who has a Lakers client right now, if he thought Bryant might be a sticking point for free agents. His immediate response: "Uh, duh. Yes."

This might sound like a lot of rumor spreading, but players already have declined the option to play on the Lakers alongside Bryant. Howard turned down more guaranteed money to move on to a less celebrated franchise.

And don’t forget the fascinating case of Ramon Sessions. He was the toast of the Lakers for a brief spell -- and when he reached free agency there was every chance he could have returned as the Lakers’ starting point guard.

Instead he declined the Lakers' offer and opted to become the backup point guard for the Charlotte Bobcats, who were coming off the worst season in league history. Sessions has never expressed the slightest hint of regret.

The multiyear deal Charlotte offered was part of Sessions' calculus. But sources with knowledge of his thinking say tricky Lakers politics, where the blame tends to fall everywhere but with Bryant, was also on his mind.

The theory of finding a star to play alongside Bryant hinges on the notion that such a star would find joy in doing so. But who’s the role model for that? Here’s a Nash quote, from an interview this summer on Grantland:

I knew it wasn’t gonna be the same. I felt like I was going to try something new, and that I was going to adapt — and to accept that, and embrace it. I think it’d be nice to find a middle ground where he does his thing but the ball still can move for great parts of the game. Hopefully we can find that this season. But I knew it wasn’t going to be the same. When you play with Kobe Bryant, the ball is gonna be with him most of the time.

Does Nash sound joyous to you?

Bryant is the face of the franchise, a huge moneymaker and a global icon. It would take tremendous guts for the Lakers -- whose embattled lead decision-maker, Jim Buss, has already been belittled publicly, many times, by the likes of Phil Jackson -- to rile up Lakers fans by parting ways with Bryant.
Click to expand...

#2961 Carl Herrera, Sep 11, 2013

dobro1229 Member

Joined:

Feb 16, 2010

Messages:

25,677

Likes Received:

22,399

J.R. said: ↑

How the Lakers should rebuild

[rquoter]The Los Angeles Lakers don't rebuild. That's been true since their early days back in Minneapolis, when the franchise nickname made sense, and it's been true through the eras of George Mikan, Jerry West, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Magic Johnson and Kobe Bryant.

The latest projection from my ATH system has the Lakers with 34 wins in the coming season, and the system's most recent round of simulations had Los Angeles making the postseason in three of 1,000 replays of the season. ESPN.com's Summer Forecast also has the Lakers finishing 12th in the West, much to Bryant's chagrin. In other words, Los Angeles could be headed for their first single-digit draft slot since taking James Worthy first overall in 1982. If you think my projection is an aberration, be aware that I've seen other projections. It's not.

That's just scratching the surface of the Lakers' woes. Depending on how the standings fall, Los Angeles could be without its first-round picks in 2015 and 2017, and wont' have a second-round pick in three of the next four seasons. The team's top three players -- Kobe Bryant, Steve Nash and Pau Gasol -- have a combined 46 years of NBA mileage under their collective belt, and all three have undergone some kind of surgery over the past year.

On the bright side, before he was hurt last season, Bryant was as good as ever, averaging 27.3 points on the third-best true shooting percentage of his career. And the Lakers' long-clogged salary cap is about to finally come unstuck, with only Nash due significant guaranteed money after 2013-14. The coming flexibility will coincide with what could be a major shuffling of power in the NBA, with the loaded 2014 draft class and a sparkling free-agent market in the offing.

With a roster headed by three future Hall of Famers, it's certainly not out of the question that L.A. outperforms its dire statistical forecast. However, if and when the season goes south, how can general manager Mitch Kupchak bring the luster back to Los Angeles?

1. Recognize Pau Gasol and Kobe Bryant as the foundation.

This isn't a move, but a recognition of the franchise's situation. Bryant's presence is what dictates everything. As perhaps the greatest Laker of them all, rebuilding is not an option after what will be 18 seasons with the team. With Bryant's contract expiring, Kupchak will have the opportunity to structure a roster and payroll, in cooperation with Bryant, that will give him one more window to chase title No. 6, while setting up the Lakers for the long term.

As for Gasol, the paucity of quality big men in the league, his track record of success with Bryant and, most importantly, his own expiring contract all combine to make him a solid fit to remain a Laker. Gasol's knee problems are a concern, making his production an important issue.

2. Trade Steve Nash for future assets.

Nash still has plenty left in the tank. He averaged 18 points and 10 assists per 40 minutes last season during the minutes in which he didn't share the court with Bryant. When teamed with Bryant, Nash was a lower-volume, higher-efficiency player. In a vacuum, that's fine. However, just as important as any awkwardness on offense, it's not a tenable defensive backcourt.

With a reasonable contract and a valuable skill set, Nash would be a welcome acquisition for most contenders in the league. The Lakers would not take back any money beyond next season in such a trade, and would only ask for a late first-round pick or, more likely, a couple of second-rounders in return. Under the reality of the new CBA, even the Lakers can't continue to ignore the draft.

3. Keep the 2014 draft pick

A Nash deal wouldn't come down until the deadline, by which time it's apparent that 2012-13 is a lost season. Gasol rumors would be rampant by that point, but we've already established that we're keeping him barring a blockbuster deal. So the next chance for Kupchak to set himself up for 2014-15 will be on draft night.

A 48-loss season would give the Lakers an outside shot at lottery magic. And let's face it, this is one franchise that is used to good fortune. Even if the Lakers don't move up, a pick at Nos. 7 or 8 (in one of the deepest drafts ever) would still put them into position to grab a future All-Star. Chad Ford has the Lakers selecting raw but talented Kansas big Joel Embiid at No. 10. The selection could also be a key trade piece down the line.

4. Sign Bryant and Gasol -- quickly

Bryant and Gasol will have massive cap holds on the Lakers' books upon hitting free agency -- a combined $52 million. Until they are resolved one way or another, Kupchak's offseason agenda will be choked.

Here's the strategy: Sign Bryant and Gasol to one-year deals for as low as the veteran's minimum.

Under this arrangement, the Lakers would open up massive amounts of cap space. After renouncing the other free agents, accounting for Bryant and Gasol's minimum salaries, the guaranteed money due to Robert Sacre, CBA-mandated minimum-player holds and the hold for the first-round pick, the Lakers still only have about $11 million of the cap accounted for -- easily enough room for two max-contract free agents.

It would be an extreme show of faith by the Lakers' stars. Kupchak could offer both players huge pay increases after 2014-15 using their Bird rights, in essence giving them an average salary commiserate with their current-day talents. However, this can't be agreed upon beforehand. Even if Bryant and Gasol can get past the ego issues of the pay cuts, there is still the risk of injury to scare them off. It's tough. Kupchak would be tasked with making a sales pitch without overtly making the sales pitch.

5a. Sign two max free agents

It's so simple, right? With all of this cap space, Kupchak opens up the check book, signs LeBron James and Carmelo Anthony, and lives happily ever after. I'm not sure anyone really wants to see Bryant and Anthony on the same team, but besides those two, Paul George and Chris Bosh are the only potential free agents I see as possible max-type targets.

We've also seen that, these days, having an attractive talent core may be more important to elite free agents than max money, or a glitzy locale. The Lakers learned that first hand from Dwight Howard this summer. Still, you have to roll out the red carpet, especially for James.

5b. Sign two next-tier free agents to short-term deals

This is the lesson I took from the blockbuster Nets-Celtics trade on draft night: If you signed an OK player to a bloated contract -- like Gerald Wallace -- you can use his salary slot to acquire a better player.

If the Lakers strike out on the heavy hitters in the next free agent class, the next level of available players would be targeted. We're talking about players like Paul Pierce, Andrew Bogut and Luol Deng. Landing two of those players on short-term contracts for eight figures per season not only adds on-court talent, but it locks down two high-dollar salary slots.

The key is to keep the duration of the contract short, or else you risk ruining the trade value of the player. The eventual target would be a top-10 player who decides he can't continue in his current situation.

Who knows who will be the next disgruntled superstar? Maybe if things go bad for the Thunder, Kevin Durant will seek brighter lights. Maybe Chris Paul doesn't like playing for Doc Rivers, or things go bad for Blake Griffin. Perhaps Kevin Love wants out of Minnesota, or LaMarcus Aldridge bails on Portland, or the Kings tire of DeMarcus Cousins. We never know when these situations will crop up.

By locking down two decent players with sizable, but moveable contracts, the Lakers would become a team capable of dangling near-term cap space for an opponent hitting the reset button. Packaging one or both of the free-agent signings with the aforementioned prized draft pick will sweeten the pot that much more.

This is just one of many paths Kupchak can take to return the Lakers to relevance. The scheme requires luck, faith, failure, guts and cunning. Getting a team to the championship level always does, and when you can't truly rebuild, a few things are going to have to fall your way. If this plan seems desperate to you, well, that's kind of where the Lakers are at.[/rquoter]

Click to expand...

This crap writer cant be serious can he??? -

#1- Kobe and Gasol BOTH signing for the VETERAN MINIMUM.... you have to be kidding me right???
#2- Getting a first round pick AND taking back ZERO salary for the carcass of Steve Nash???

#2962 dobro1229, Sep 11, 2013
J.R. Member

Joined:

Jun 30, 2008

Messages:

114,025

Likes Received:

175,728

It's ESPN. You don't expect anything different do you?

#2963 J.R., Sep 11, 2013
cheke64 Member

Joined:

May 12, 2009

Messages:

25,776

Likes Received:

17,711

I agree, they definately need to sign kobe and pau fast. Make it 5 years pls.

#2964 cheke64, Sep 11, 2013
Johndoe804 Member

Joined:

Jun 24, 2010

Messages:

3,233

Likes Received:

147

Bradford Doolittle is a moron. I could write a better article. Kobe's not signing for the Vet Min. He already said so!

#2965 Johndoe804, Sep 11, 2013
mr. 13 in 33 Member

Joined:

Oct 23, 2010

Messages:

10,617

Likes Received:

636

A_3PO said: ↑

IMO, Carmelo will go to MIA and join LeBron if he leaves the Knicks (which is doubtful).

Paul George's extension with the Pacers should be finalized before the season starts.
Click to expand...

That's true because if Melo wants to win a ring he'll go to Miami

#2966 mr. 13 in 33, Sep 11, 2013
IzakDavid13 Member

Joined:

Jan 2, 2011

Messages:

9,958

Likes Received:

801

J.R. said: ↑

How the Lakers should rebuild

[rquoter]The Los Angeles Lakers don't rebuild. That's been true since their early days back in Minneapolis, when the franchise nickname made sense, and it's been true through the eras of George Mikan, Jerry West, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Magic Johnson and Kobe Bryant.

The latest projection from my ATH system has the Lakers with 34 wins in the coming season, and the system's most recent round of simulations had Los Angeles making the postseason in three of 1,000 replays of the season. ESPN.com's Summer Forecast also has the Lakers finishing 12th in the West, much to Bryant's chagrin. In other words, Los Angeles could be headed for their first single-digit draft slot since taking James Worthy first overall in 1982. If you think my projection is an aberration, be aware that I've seen other projections. It's not.

That's just scratching the surface of the Lakers' woes. Depending on how the standings fall, Los Angeles could be without its first-round picks in 2015 and 2017, and wont' have a second-round pick in three of the next four seasons. The team's top three players -- Kobe Bryant, Steve Nash and Pau Gasol -- have a combined 46 years of NBA mileage under their collective belt, and all three have undergone some kind of surgery over the past year.

On the bright side, before he was hurt last season, Bryant was as good as ever, averaging 27.3 points on the third-best true shooting percentage of his career. And the Lakers' long-clogged salary cap is about to finally come unstuck, with only Nash due significant guaranteed money after 2013-14. The coming flexibility will coincide with what could be a major shuffling of power in the NBA, with the loaded 2014 draft class and a sparkling free-agent market in the offing.

With a roster headed by three future Hall of Famers, it's certainly not out of the question that L.A. outperforms its dire statistical forecast. However, if and when the season goes south, how can general manager Mitch Kupchak bring the luster back to Los Angeles?

1. Recognize Pau Gasol and Kobe Bryant as the foundation.

This isn't a move, but a recognition of the franchise's situation. Bryant's presence is what dictates everything. As perhaps the greatest Laker of them all, rebuilding is not an option after what will be 18 seasons with the team. With Bryant's contract expiring, Kupchak will have the opportunity to structure a roster and payroll, in cooperation with Bryant, that will give him one more window to chase title No. 6, while setting up the Lakers for the long term.

As for Gasol, the paucity of quality big men in the league, his track record of success with Bryant and, most importantly, his own expiring contract all combine to make him a solid fit to remain a Laker. Gasol's knee problems are a concern, making his production an important issue.

2. Trade Steve Nash for future assets.

Nash still has plenty left in the tank. He averaged 18 points and 10 assists per 40 minutes last season during the minutes in which he didn't share the court with Bryant. When teamed with Bryant, Nash was a lower-volume, higher-efficiency player. In a vacuum, that's fine. However, just as important as any awkwardness on offense, it's not a tenable defensive backcourt.

With a reasonable contract and a valuable skill set, Nash would be a welcome acquisition for most contenders in the league. The Lakers would not take back any money beyond next season in such a trade, and would only ask for a late first-round pick or, more likely, a couple of second-rounders in return. Under the reality of the new CBA, even the Lakers can't continue to ignore the draft.

3. Keep the 2014 draft pick

A Nash deal wouldn't come down until the deadline, by which time it's apparent that 2012-13 is a lost season. Gasol rumors would be rampant by that point, but we've already established that we're keeping him barring a blockbuster deal. So the next chance for Kupchak to set himself up for 2014-15 will be on draft night.

A 48-loss season would give the Lakers an outside shot at lottery magic. And let's face it, this is one franchise that is used to good fortune. Even if the Lakers don't move up, a pick at Nos. 7 or 8 (in one of the deepest drafts ever) would still put them into position to grab a future All-Star. Chad Ford has the Lakers selecting raw but talented Kansas big Joel Embiid at No. 10. The selection could also be a key trade piece down the line.

4. Sign Bryant and Gasol -- quickly

Bryant and Gasol will have massive cap holds on the Lakers' books upon hitting free agency -- a combined $52 million. Until they are resolved one way or another, Kupchak's offseason agenda will be choked.

Here's the strategy: Sign Bryant and Gasol to one-year deals for as low as the veteran's minimum.

Under this arrangement, the Lakers would open up massive amounts of cap space. After renouncing the other free agents, accounting for Bryant and Gasol's minimum salaries, the guaranteed money due to Robert Sacre, CBA-mandated minimum-player holds and the hold for the first-round pick, the Lakers still only have about $11 million of the cap accounted for -- easily enough room for two max-contract free agents.

It would be an extreme show of faith by the Lakers' stars. Kupchak could offer both players huge pay increases after 2014-15 using their Bird rights, in essence giving them an average salary commiserate with their current-day talents. However, this can't be agreed upon beforehand. Even if Bryant and Gasol can get past the ego issues of the pay cuts, there is still the risk of injury to scare them off. It's tough. Kupchak would be tasked with making a sales pitch without overtly making the sales pitch.

5a. Sign two max free agents

It's so simple, right? With all of this cap space, Kupchak opens up the check book, signs LeBron James and Carmelo Anthony, and lives happily ever after. I'm not sure anyone really wants to see Bryant and Anthony on the same team, but besides those two, Paul George and Chris Bosh are the only potential free agents I see as possible max-type targets.

We've also seen that, these days, having an attractive talent core may be more important to elite free agents than max money, or a glitzy locale. The Lakers learned that first hand from Dwight Howard this summer. Still, you have to roll out the red carpet, especially for James.

5b. Sign two next-tier free agents to short-term deals

This is the lesson I took from the blockbuster Nets-Celtics trade on draft night: If you signed an OK player to a bloated contract -- like Gerald Wallace -- you can use his salary slot to acquire a better player.

If the Lakers strike out on the heavy hitters in the next free agent class, the next level of available players would be targeted. We're talking about players like Paul Pierce, Andrew Bogut and Luol Deng. Landing two of those players on short-term contracts for eight figures per season not only adds on-court talent, but it locks down two high-dollar salary slots.

The key is to keep the duration of the contract short, or else you risk ruining the trade value of the player. The eventual target would be a top-10 player who decides he can't continue in his current situation.

Who knows who will be the next disgruntled superstar? Maybe if things go bad for the Thunder, Kevin Durant will seek brighter lights. Maybe Chris Paul doesn't like playing for Doc Rivers, or things go bad for Blake Griffin. Perhaps Kevin Love wants out of Minnesota, or LaMarcus Aldridge bails on Portland, or the Kings tire of DeMarcus Cousins. We never know when these situations will crop up.

By locking down two decent players with sizable, but moveable contracts, the Lakers would become a team capable of dangling near-term cap space for an opponent hitting the reset button. Packaging one or both of the free-agent signings with the aforementioned prized draft pick will sweeten the pot that much more.

This is just one of many paths Kupchak can take to return the Lakers to relevance. The scheme requires luck, faith, failure, guts and cunning. Getting a team to the championship level always does, and when you can't truly rebuild, a few things are going to have to fall your way. If this plan seems desperate to you, well, that's kind of where the Lakers are at.[/rquoter]

Click to expand...

This is quite possibly the worst article ever written. It is a fantasy based on someone's lucid dream whilst high on some sort of hallucinogenic drug, probably multiple.

#2967 IzakDavid13, Sep 11, 2013

mr. 13 in 33 Member

Joined:

Oct 23, 2010

Messages:

10,617

Likes Received:

636

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p>Y! Sources: Los Angeles Lakers free agent guard Darius Morris finalizing a deal with the Philadelphia 76ers. <a href="http://t.co/SnWnBuHtKC">http://t.co/SnWnBuHtKC</a></p>— Adrian Wojnarowski (@WojYahooNBA) <a href="https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/statuses/378183714687053825">September 12, 2013</a></blockquote> <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

#2968 mr. 13 in 33, Sep 12, 2013
J.R. Member

Joined:

Jun 30, 2008

Messages:

114,025

Likes Received:

175,728

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p>You asked for it, we listened. Introducing the new <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23HollywoodNights&src=hash">#HollywoodNights</a> uniforms: <a href="http://t.co/ylOZHbaUmp">http://t.co/ylOZHbaUmp</a> | <a href="http://t.co/oepqqspMDC">pic.twitter.com/oepqqspMDC</a></p>— Los Angeles Lakers (@Lakers) <a href="https://twitter.com/Lakers/statuses/380421005279121408">September 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

#2969 J.R., Sep 18, 2013
Mr. Dominant Member

Joined:

Dec 17, 2007

Messages:

9,743

Likes Received:

5,262

J.R. said: ↑

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p>You asked for it, we listened. Introducing the new <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23HollywoodNights&src=hash">#HollywoodNights</a> uniforms: <a href="http://t.co/ylOZHbaUmp">http://t.co/ylOZHbaUmp</a> | <a href="http://t.co/oepqqspMDC">pic.twitter.com/oepqqspMDC</a></p>— Los Angeles Lakers (@Lakers) <a href="https://twitter.com/Lakers/statuses/380421005279121408">September 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Click to expand...

WHY CAN'T THE ROCKETS HAVE BLACK JERSEYS! I'VE BEEN WANTING THEM FOR YEARS NOW!

#2970 Mr. Dominant, Sep 18, 2013
J.R. Member

Joined:

Jun 30, 2008

Messages:

114,025

Likes Received:

175,728

You asked for new uni's! We haven't listened.
You asked for black uni's! We haven't listened.

-@HoustonRockets

(I doubt the NBA would approve any kind of black uni's for the Rockets. The Lakers? Well, they're the Lakers. NBA would approve any uni's for them.)

#2971 J.R., Sep 18, 2013
Carl Herrera Member

Joined:

Feb 16, 2007

Messages:

45,153

Likes Received:

21,575

Mr. Dominant said: ↑

WHY CAN'T THE ROCKETS HAVE BLACK JERSEYS! I'VE BEEN WANTING THEM FOR YEARS NOW!
Click to expand...

The color of the jersey doesn't matter, the color of what's inside the jersey is what matters.

#2972 Carl Herrera, Sep 18, 2013
Mr. Dominant Member

Joined:

Dec 17, 2007

Messages:

9,743

Likes Received:

5,262

J.R. said: ↑

You asked for new uni's! We haven't listened.
You asked for black uni's! We haven't listened.

-@HoustonRockets

(I doubt the NBA would approve any kind of black uni's for the Rockets. The Lakers? Well, they're the Lakers. NBA would approve any uni's for them.)
Click to expand...

Why wouldn't they approve?

Carl Herrera said: ↑

The color of the jersey doesn't matter, the color of what's inside the jersey is what matters.
Click to expand...

What do you mean?

#2973 Mr. Dominant, Sep 18, 2013

RV6 Member

Joined:

Aug 21, 2008

Messages:

25,522

Likes Received:

1,109

In other words, no one listens to us.

#2974 RV6, Sep 18, 2013
Mr. Dominant Member

Joined:

Dec 17, 2007

Messages:

9,743

Likes Received:

5,262

RV6 said: ↑

In other words, no one listens to us.
Click to expand...

You want black jerseys too?

#2975 Mr. Dominant, Sep 18, 2013
IzakDavid13 Member

Joined:

Jan 2, 2011

Messages:

9,958

Likes Received:

801

I love this thread... I can't wait to see my 'Laker Fan' friends jumping ship halfway through the season.

#2976 IzakDavid13, Sep 21, 2013
A_3PO Member

Joined:

Apr 29, 2006

Messages:

46,510

Likes Received:

11,780

IzakDavid13 said: ↑

I love this thread... I can't wait to see my 'Laker Fan' friends jumping ship halfway through the season.
Click to expand...

You really think they'll last halfway through the season? Give 'em a week and a half. Unless something weird happens, Lakers will start the season 1-5 (at best) after losing to the Rockets.

#2977 A_3PO, Sep 21, 2013
supdudes Member

Joined:

Feb 9, 2009

Messages:

2,530

Likes Received:

126

A_3PO said: ↑

You really think they'll last halfway through the season? Give 'em a week and a half. Unless something weird happens, Lakers will start the season 1-5 (at best) after losing to the Rockets.
Click to expand...

You wanna start a betting jar?

#2978 supdudes, Sep 21, 2013

Mr. Dominant Member

Joined:

Dec 17, 2007

Messages:

9,743

Likes Received:

5,262

A_3PO said: ↑

You really think they'll last halfway through the season? Give 'em a week and a half. Unless something weird happens, Lakers will start the season 1-5 (at best) after losing to the Rockets.
Click to expand...

I'm a one lovin' team type of guy, and that's my rockets.

But for some reason, maybe mental, psychological, or divine; I feel that the lakers will make the playoffs this year, Kobe will still be top 3 in points scored per game as he was in the 2012 season, and he'll be playing as if he was never injured.

However, they won't be going anywhere in the playoffs because they will be swept away by the rockets in the first round (rockets being number 1 seed and lakers number 8).

#2979 Mr. Dominant, Sep 22, 2013
Mr. Clutch Member

Joined:

Nov 8, 2002

Messages:

46,550

Likes Received:

6,132

It looks to me like the Lakers are going for the #1 pick if they don't make anymore roster moves.

#2980 Mr. Clutch, Sep 22, 2013

(You must log in or sign up to post here.)

Page 149 of 208

Share This Page