Should Jeremy Lin be more involved in the Rocket's offense?

LOL I guess anyone who disagreed with your post is labeled as Lin fan boy. Have you seen any part of my post defended Lin??

Stop being so sensitive! I was just pointing on how faulty PER ranking can be.

 

Lol

And you stretched it by using Howard. A Center. Can you see why some may shake their head?

Now look at guards.I laughed at it because even though it looked none too good I there was only 6 or 7 I would choose over Lin. Maybe a few more if they show improvement next year.

 

To be honest, I have not even looked at the PER ranking for PG's.

Hollinger developed his PER system about 14 years ago. PER metrics is one of the oldest advance metrics and his formula hadn't been updated since. It rewards shot-taking and totally neglects defensively end of the game. Using PER does not drive the point home. In this case, using Dwight did drive my point across.

 

OK

Using Dwight as an example when we are talking Guards was asinine.

 

Actually, you're the one being asinine. You tried to use PER to argue that Lin is an "inefficient" player and not deserving of court time.

Then kuku made the relevant point that using PER to support any argument is difficult, because as a statistic in general it is quite flawed. To support his point, he used centers as the example position.

In this case, it doesn't actually matter if he used point guards, centers, or any other position on the court. His argument is that PER is flawed, and he uses as an example a situation where PER produces results which go against the common wisdom that Dwight Howard is currently the best center in the NBA, because he is ranked 15th in PER. In addition, it lists two players who are clearly not believed to be among the best as the top two.

This is relevant to his argument, whether you like it or not. It's like you arguing that golf balls are smaller than tennis balls because your ruler says so, and kuku pointing out that your ruler also says that elephants are smaller than chihuahuas, so maybe we shouldn't trust your ruler to say much of anything.

It's at this point that you realize you are losing the rational argument so you start resorting to personal attacks, calling kuku a "Lin fan boy" and grouping him with the people who "Blame others or talk bad about others in hopes to pump Lin up".

All kuku did was point out a flaw in your reasoning. He didn't call you stupid. Hell, he didn't even say your opinion is wrong. All he said was that the rationale you used to support your opinion (PER) is flawed and maybe shouldn't be used. Instead of becoming a 12 year-old and degenerating into name-calling when someone points out when you might on shaky ground, maybe you should be an adult, thank them, address the problem, and move on with your life.

If you can't do that, then maybe you should should shut the hell up so the rest of us don't have to hear you lash out and whine about not being wrong because NUH UH UR WRONG I SAID SO BUTT FACE.

 

PER really gets a bad rap. Not perfect especially when you look at players playing less than 30 minutes, but I think it does a pretty good job. Hard to argue too much with the top guys, maybe the exact order and a few guys who don't fit here and there, but still generally has the widely viewed top guys at the top.

Definitely doesn't favor defensive stall worts and like I said before the lower the minutes the less reliable the stat can be, but when used in the right context PER is just fine.

 

Stop quoting Luckytxn please!

 

Lol

It pretty much said that Asik would be playing liked he ended up doing for us and he is a defense stalwart. Face it if the stat showed Lin more favorably Lin fan boys would be all over it.

 

Lol

Thought you said I was on ignore.

 

He can only see your posts if somebody else quotes you in their post.

 

Lol

No I was pointing out how stupid that it was to use a Center as the argument instead of guards like Lin is. The Center is a way different position to judge. Also I did point out that we need to look at other stats like Howard excelled at to understand why he having a lower PER makes no difference. He has stats that make him among the best Centers in the game.

The guards are way closer to stats and there are way more of them then big men. If Centers that we are looking at have stats are around the same then we can go and look at their PER to see more about the player.

Like many Lin fan boys argue that Harden has more TO's then Lin. He does if we look at just game to game. Now if we look at TOV% we see that he actually has less than Lin. If they handled the ball the exact amount of time then saying that Harden has more could stand. Harden handles the ball a lot more.

Now Lins low stats except for assists does not look well. He plays a lot of minutes and his PPG is low for that many minutes. Many of the guards with better PER's than Lin play a lot less minutes so it is hard to judge how they do if they played equal minutes. Per can be helpful. As said before the less minutes played though makes the PER possibly off because if they played more they may be worse or even better. Luckily for us Lin does play enough to show his PER is actually close to being right.

We are talking about guards here and not Centers. Centers are judged on being big men and playing post. Rebounds and blocks are at a premium for them. Now I guess if I wanted to show a stat is off then lets use them as an example for guard play. Sounds asinine to me but I guess if one wanted to show their player in a better light then I would grasp at that asinine attempt.

As said and from your and other Lin fan boys postings if the stat showed Lin in a good light the stat would be used as an example. This is just stupid attempts by idiots at deflection.

 

Lol

Cool.

 

I didn't put you on ignore, lol. I thought about it, but come on man. You seem to have a head on your shoulders. Don't spend so much of your energy being negative. I get that you don't like Lin. Move on. Not all Lin fans are delusional. In fact, it's only a few here and there. The rest do not blame others nor do they put Lin on a pedestal. But you constantly bait then call out anyone who doesn't agree that he sucks. Come on. You're better than that.

 

lpl

OK.

I told you before and I will repeat myself again for you. I don't hate Lin. Never have and never will. I even find some to be Lin fan and not Lin fan boys and they are pleasant to engage.

Now maybe you came in late and didn't read the whole thread but actually said good things about Lin and about the PER. I will castigate attempts at bringing a whole different position that is judged to be successful for reasons a lot different than a different position.

 

I am just going to cover all the bases for another Lin thread.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

Lin is a top pg and can regain Linsanity.

Lin is trash and back up at best.

 

To lucytxn

Offense only accounts for 50% of the game. PER along does not fully measure a player's performance. Even if indicating PER as "offensive stats," it needs to be used in conjunction with player's efficiency to fully gauge a player's offensive skills.

PG's like Isaiah Thomas ot Nate Robinson, who are physically incapable of playing good D, will consisitently have higher PER's than poor shooters like Rubio, who is one of the best defensive PG's in the league.

Defense is difficult to measure but there are sites providing different way of deriving with defense stats. Basketball-reference, mysynergy, and RAPM are some of the ways you can look into a player's impact on D.

Finally, name-calling has no place in GARM.

 

as a LOF I'm actually curious to see how he would play as the 6th man off the bench

 

Can we trade Lin for Kyle Lowry? I remember the days when our point guard could actually finish a play without turning it over

 

You just used up a lot of words to prove that: 1) you have no idea what you're talking about when it comes to basketball statistics, and 2) you're clearly more interested in ad hominem attacks than having an actual discussion with people.

Newsflash: Just because someone disagrees with you, or disagrees with a point you are making, does not make them part of a special group of stupid people (a.k.a. "Lin fanboys") that you can conveniently dismiss without regard.

Whatever, I'm done. The only reason I responded was to make clear to everyone else that you're being an unreasonable douche towards another poster, and you've more than made that point for me twice over.

 

You don't?