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Support for repealing Obamacare plunges to an all time low.

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Raven, Nov 14, 2012.

  1. Raven

    Raven Member

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    No, because I don't believe it will happen. More huffery and puffery from butthurt gougers.
     
  2. treeman

    treeman Member

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    77 Percent Say Individual Mandate Should be Delayed or Repealed

    http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/77-percent-say-individual-mandate-should-be-delayed-or-repealed_742449.html

    Poll results here:

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/156907327/TMC-Tracking-Poll-July-2013-Topline-Results-Final

    Majority still views the law unfavorably, 53% to 42%

    http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/healthcare/health_care_law

    FOX News poll shows majority want either all or some of PACA repealed (hey, it's more reliable than Thinkprogress :rolleyes: )

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/interactive/2013/07/24/fox-news-poll-voters-are-unhappy-with-economy-say-repeal-obamacare/

    Support for repealing President Obama's healthcare law is as high as it has ever been, according to a new poll from CBS News.

    http://thehill.com/blogs/healthwatch/politics-elections/313143-poll-support-for-obamacare-repeal-hits-new-high

    CBS/NYT Poll: More Americans Than Ever Support Obamacare Repeal

    http://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2013/07/25/cbsnyt-poll-obamacare-very-unpopular-n1648062

    I could do this all day but you get the point. The American people still don't like this crap sandwich, and while they aren't enamored with the GOP's futile efforts and theatrics, they aren't exactly excited about having this forced down their throats, either.

    This is going to hurt the Dems in 2014.
     
  3. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Member

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    GP's have been on the decline because insurance companies and medicare have been squeezing more and more out of the doctors. This is not a new trend. Obamacare will only further this problem. Its the constant fight with everyone to get insurance companies and the government to pay. When doctors are forced into survival mode, the quality of health care goes down. Doctors will find even more ways to bill anything to insurance companies and they will be forced to push more patients through their office in the same amount of time. When the internet makes for a better doctor than the practitioners, that is a problem. We also have the ever increasing unhealthy lifestyle habits that are putting a burden on everyone.
     
  4. Nook

    Nook Member

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    No, I don't find "planning" to leave to mean a damn thing. I want hard numbers of doctors with less than 20 years of experience ACTUALLY leaving the profession. Seeing as I work closely with hundreds of doctors a year, and other than female doctors leaving for child rearing, I have known ZERO doctors actually leave because of pay, none in many years of representing them and their interests as counsel.

    It is easy for a doctor with 20+ years in to leave when they have literally millions of dollars in savings, likewise it is easy to say one "plans" to leave. However the facts are that a vast majority of doctors are well compensated.

    Further concerning doctors "rushing" treatment, where have you been for 35 years? They already do rush treatment for a combination of reasons, most of which is financially based... Including pressure from the hospital or practice they work for and INSURANCE.

    My wife graduated from medical school in Chicago. While it is true the malpractice costs are insane, the costs of staff and over head and medical school, it is still an exceptionally lucrative profession.

    Concerning the decrease in medical school enrollment, I am sure the absurd cost of medical school has something to do with it, but that is another discussion.
     
  5. Nook

    Nook Member

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    First, if the Internet is a better physician than your family doctor, I suggest you find a new doctor.

    Concerning your second point, preventative health is huge and is currently an afterthought in medicine. Further the subsidies, GMO food, highly fertilized and then processed foods are a chief culprit, and that has less to do with doctors and more to do with lawmakers on both sides of the aisle (although more Republican) being more concerned with the short term election funding and less interested in the long term health and COSTS of keeping people healthy.

    We have been here and done this with tort reform and caps, which ultimately save corporations money and people like Rove and GW Bush and then the tax payers have to make up the difference.
     
  6. otis thorpe

    otis thorpe Member

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    I dont think ive ever been more depressed by the fox news parade of misinformation. medicare is for retirees so why are you focusing on it. doctors treat a lot more people with private insurances including people blessed to be retired and have both medicare and private. secondly to hear conservatives complain about a govt program actually spending less is the height of absurdity. so now you want the govt to spend all out willy nilly in the name of keeping wealthy doctors in business?
     
  7. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Member

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    I am fortunate enough to have not required a doctor in a long time. I have witnessed the incompetence, especially with the elderly. This incompetence includes the doctors not taking the patient serious and/or sending in inexperience PA's who have no business in the industry. This isn't an all inclusive across the board, but it is becoming more and more common.

    The chief culprit is the complete disregard to ones health. You can blame processed foods all day, and yes, they may not be wonder foods, but the quantity is the persons choice. There are alternatives, but the simple fact is that Americans like their starchy creamy fatty foods.

    Tort reform is not an end all solution. Its just a fraction of the pie, just as is fraud and waste. We need solutions that improve healthcare, not herd more people into the faulty system.

    If I have the flu, I don't need to go sit in the doctors office for an hour running all kinds of tests. Let me walk into a pharmacy with a qualified assistant, run a culture test and give me my medicine.
    Open up general wellness centers where people can come in and get basic checkups for a reasonable cost.
    Give me true major medical insurance at a reasonable price.

    There are a lot of out of the box partial solutions that nobody wants to address.
     
  8. Northside Storm

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    not true for many reasons.

    I'll bring up the easiest one to conceptualize: the food desert.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert

    .
     
  9. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"
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    Just wait for October this year, as the government nears a shutdown. It will be a craptastic sandwich of poopaganda as they try to pin that meltdown on the democrats.
     
  10. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Member

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    Feel free to go shop your local walmart or supermarket. I am not suggesting these 'food deserts' do not exist, but its hardly a primary factor.

    Shop your local whole foods. It is an entirely group of different people. The difference isn't money. Its those who are interested in their health.

    Americans want quick and easy. They would rather a microwave meal than taking an extra hour to prepare a decent meal. Now you can tout that Americans are too busy to take the time to prepare a meal, but when the average american is watching 5 hours a TV a day, that just isn't a feasible answer.
     
  11. otis thorpe

    otis thorpe Member

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    Anyone who thinks wholefoods is affordable for everyone is beyond delusional. walmart grocery stores sell plenty of fresh and frozen veggies and healthy options like frsh talipia for cheap. i shop there all the time it is choice
     
  12. otis thorpe

    otis thorpe Member

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    It is choice in walmart to clarify like any other grocery store. if you think walmart sells nothing but pop tarts jello pudding and coke then you are a snob. you dont need whole foods to be healthy and i take your post as insult to me and the rest of middle america
     
  13. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Are you telling me the cost of goods at Wal Mart and Whole Foods are remotely similar? Someone on a tight budget or food stamps cannot usually afford to eat at Whole Foods.

    I get that you are all for personal accountability, as am I, but the agribusiness coupled with complicity from the federal government is a major reason that America has the level of obesity and medical issues that it does.

    It should not cost less for processed food spiked with high fructose corn syrup, empty carbohydrates and genetically modified structures.. but it does, because of subsidies and the complete willingness of the federal lawmakers to back it.
     
  14. Refman

    Refman Member

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    Really? How odd given that when I started law practice, I seldom saw a doctor filing for bankruptcy protection. In the last two to three years, it has become a regular occurrence. It must be a coincidence.
     
  15. otis thorpe

    otis thorpe Member

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    Totally agree with the corn lobby problem . however regular grocery stores including walmart have plenty of healthy options. for a lot if people its just education. lifestyles beget lifestyles its about breaking a cycle like a lot of other things . lastly for poor. people the bad food options are more related to fast food.
     
  16. treeman

    treeman Member

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    Not gonna happen.
     
  17. Nook

    Nook Member

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    That is odd, then again if they are like the doctors I know that filed bankruptcy, it is atleast partially because they over extended themselves in investments, typically the purchase of property and then the economy went bust.

    I have been chief counsel for a number of hospitals, private practices and even the AMA. They pay me and my associates to get them out of sticky situations. I know what they make and have in savings. It is a hard job and they are compensated exceedingly well in the majority of cases.
     
  18. Refman

    Refman Member

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    Most individuals who have investment properties and the like do not qualify for Chapter 13 and would be relegated to Chapter 11 due to the debt ceiling in Chapter 13.

    I think that we may be talking about different species of the same animal. Most of the doctors that are considering completely folding up shop are in solo or small group practices. It appears that your experience is with large, multi specialty group practices. Those organizations will feel the pinch less because they have numbers and are diversified in their practice.
     
  19. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"
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    I hope you're right. Gridlock seems worse than ever, and built to stay that way, as the GOP house members approach 2014 with only more conservative challengers to fear in their home (redistricted) districts.
     
  20. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    Fact of the matter is that GP's aren't particularly that great or informed. But that's besides the point.

    Interestingly enough, the internet is becoming a powerful tool for people. We did research into forums on how people discussed their cancer treatments - and as it turned out, people would share everything about their treatment with each others and exchange notes on doctors - and quickly learned errors doctors were making and helping people make better decisions. It was quite astounding the sophistication of knowledge and expertise...from patients! The collective knowledge from various patients experiences made them highly knowledgable. We found many examples of a patient having seen a doctor and posting their results and the doctor's diagnosis, having people challenge it, having that patient see a different doctor and finding out that indeed the community was correct!

    It's a changing world.
     

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