Egyptians resist Morsi; US-supported military to step in on Morsi's side

In the runoff, only Morsi and a guy with ties to the previous regime were on the ballot. A whole bunch of people with no ties to the Muslim Brotherhood voted for Morsi, thinking that he was more middle of the road than he turned out to be, and the best choice left. Those people make up a significant percentage of the folks protesting in the streets that forced Morsi's ouster. Also, Morsi barely got 50% of the vote. I think it's pretty clear that a majority of Egyptians think they were misled by Morsi, and wanted him gone because they feared he was on the road to creating an Islamist state. That's my opinion, anyway.

 

You can read. right and comprehend that i wrote "democracies" I've heard of Egypt in history class before bro but thanks for the heads up

 

Except the constitution also was much more Islamist in nature than the military and others were comfortable with. Keep in mind too this was a whole new Constitution so it wouldn't be the equivalent of striking down a 150 year old amendment in the US Constitution. A better equivalent would've been the Great Compromise.

Leaving aside the constitutional issues you are forgetting that Morsi also fired some high ranking security and intelligence officials and tried to fire the head of the Armed forces Tantawi and Anan the Army Chief. He also said he would annul the Constitutional amendments that restricted Presidential power.

This is only a matter of semantics because you are only looking a couple of issues to declare Morsi a puppet or else like some others just assume that Egypt is ultimately run by the US through the military. The facts don't support either claim.

Morsi and the military made compromises with each other but neither were the thrall of the other. Ultimately the military has the guns and most of the people on their side so Morsi was removed. If the vast majority of Egyptians supported Morsi things might've been different.

I am not wholeheartedly supporting the military removal of Morsi. Morsi clearly had problems and in the long run Egypt is probably better off without him. As I said earlier though I am very uneasy with military rule and fear that Egypt will fall into a cycle of military and religious rule and neither are good.

So far the military has been saying all of the right things (their actions today don't looks so good) so I will wait and see before I condemn or praise them.

 

*chuckle* Hell our politicians lie to us all the time
Welcome to Democrazy, Egypt

Rocket River

 

I may have declared Morsi a puppet, but if you want, we can compromise and say that he knew the military had him on a leash with their weapons and power base. so...i don't know. a half-puppet?

I'm certainly not making the second claim either---I didn't particularly care to condemn or praise America's role in this, because well, there isn't much to condemn or praise. My original claim is to be suspicious of the military---and it continues to be that.

 

Some civilians hugging military figures isn't exactly persuasive evidence---why said civilians should trust a military that has tortured and killed protesters, entrenched their power at every turn, and supported, to varying degrees, Mubarak, Morsi, and their own misbegotten rule on the people, is beyond me.

I know you hate political Islam with a passion, but it is somewhat amusing to see how that bleeds into your other positions, to the point where you have to defend the corrupt to justify your views.

 

ATW, have yourself a good day.

It was nice talking to you briefly on issues of substance, but if that's no longer the case, I can only wish you the best.

Peace!

 

well, guess where Secretary of State John Kerry was during the Egyptian military coup....

yes, indeed, he was on a yacht in the Nantucket Sound.

are you kidding me?

Below is the link where the State Department admitted to this...

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.co...rry-was-on-yacht-day-of-egypt-coup/?hpt=hp_t2

 

And here I was lamenting that a democractically elected head of state was deposed by a military coup...

source


Muslim Brotherhood claimed new Egyptian president is Jewish
Movement's website briefly posted an article claiming Adly Mansour, the judge named Egypt’s interim president, is part of an elaborate conspiracy involving Israel and the U.S.


The Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood’s website briefly posted an article claiming that the country’s current interim president is Jewish.

The article, which appeared Thursday on IkhwanOnline, has since been taken down; a translation is still available online. It claimed that Adly Mansour, the judge named Egypt’s interim president following the removal of Mohammed Morsi from office by the military, is Jewish.

The article claimed that Mansour is in cahoots with Israel and the United States as part of an elaborate conspiracy.

The report was released while enraged Islamists protested against the toppling of Morsi. Tens of thousands of his supporters took to the streets vowing to win his reinstatement and clashed with their opponents in violence.

Late on Friday an Interior Ministry spokesman said the deputy head of the Muslim Brotherhood, Khairat el-Shater, who is considered the most powerful man in the organization, was arrested.

Spokesman Hani Abdel-Latif said el-Shater and his brother were arrested at an apartment in eastern Cairo on allegations of inciting violence against protesters in recent days.

 

This cheered me up:

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/QeDm2PrNV1I" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

This doesn't appear to be the case, based on his willingness to ignore their ultimatums. Either that, or he's extraordinarily stupid.

I don't think anyone here thinks the military is great or not-corrupt. Just that they seem to be working in the interests of the people right now and seem committed to mostly making decisions beneficial to democracy (if you ignore the coup...). The new temporary President and Prime Ministers both seem very competent and reform-oriented. The military has gone out of their way to involve all the different interest groups in the country and has the backing of major disparate opposition groups. The military leadership, even months before the coup, was strongly engaged in reformist efforts and engaging all the different major parties in the country. Etc.

 

This is one of the most fascinating stories of the last year - a story that has historical implications and has very little to do with the US - and all basso can contribute is bizarre, unrelated references to Obama and Kerry? And not even his own at that - just garbage he copies and pastes from other sites? I don't know whether to be annoyed or just sad that he's so obsessed with Obama that he's missing out on history.

 

In my opinion, the military does not care about democracy, and I would not weigh the coup as being the sole indicator of that. Egyptians and the world should be wary to embrace a military that seemed perfectly content to install dictators for decades.

They are not committed to anything else than the preservation of their powers and privileges. This coup just reinforces this, and as soon as another democratically elected candidate decides to rock the boat---guess what will happen?

The military's appointments are dubious too. ElBaradei? The guy is great from a liberal and secular point of view, but he dropped out of the race because he point blank couldn't win. I'm all for appointed positions in technocratic functions---but for prime minster? that's just utterly unworkable if you want the people to have a voice.

It's unfortunate that the voice of Egypt tends towards whichever organization can promote stability. The liberals and secularists have a better message, they just can't communicate it properly. The long-term view, in terms of holding down extremist views, is beating them in elections, in a legitimate fashion. You can't have that if the extremists don't buy into democracy in the first place, now that the military has basically given them no reason to believe in it!

 

I don't know that it is really one of the most fascinating stories. The Arab Spring seemed to be positive at first glance, but has it actually resulted in a positive result anywhere? An internal struggle between a military dictatorship and an Islamist theocracy seems to be a repeating theme. Iran in the '70s, Iraq in '03, Syria now, isn't that just the expected pattern in the Mid East? A struggle between a secular democracy and one or the other of the above would be a novel story in that region. The protests in Iran that were brutally suppressed seemed to be the closest we got to that happening.

 

There's not really a military dictatorship in Egypt, though - you have a powerful military, but they have little to no interest in actually ruling the country. Both the protestors and the military seem to want a secular democracy as much as possible (in the latter case, preferably one that will leave them alone).

But the more interesting part about Egypt 2.0 is that it shows that Egypt 1.0 wasn't an isolated incident. They didn't revolt, have a new-but-different dictator come to power, and go back to business-as-usual with new autocrats. They stood right back up and said no again - that is not something that I can recall happening anywhere else in the region. It gives hope that the aim of democracy and the idea of the people actually wielding power is getting a sustainable foothold in the region. And they've now done it twice (in large part thanks to the military) with relatively little bloodshed. Still a long way to go - and we could very well fall back into the usual pattern - but it's the closest thing we've seen to having the potential for real sustainable change in our lifetimes.

 

Warning, graphic video.

2:20 you see a bunch of kids sitting on a water tank watching the clashes between Morsy opponents and supporters on the street. The kids are most probably about 14-15 years old. A group of Morsi supporters (identifiable by the Al Qaida flag that the bearded man is holding) climbs up. Watch for yourselves and judge for yourselves who is defending "legitimacy" and "democracy"!!!

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/XiXOZFV7RNk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

Masterminds always retain their plausible deniability.
Once he developed and approved the Egyptian's military plan, what did you want him to do, mount up a tank?