[Chron] Rockets’ oft-criticized Lin promises improvement

Agree that it's a shame Lin missed this opportunity to battle in the playoffs in a substantial way.

Beverley will definitely be better for it but looking at his max production games, and the potential of Lin based on Lin's max production games (non-playoffs of course), it seems much more unlikely for Lin to stink up next year's playoffs, and more likely be near his current year averages. It seems highly illogical except in the eyes of haters for him to perform as poorly as he did in his playoff appearances this year.

As for the "what have you done for me lately" comment, I don't think Reggie Jackson will have any shot at getting the starting PG role for the Thunder next year when Westbrook is back despite eye opening performances by Jackson.

 

Hmmm, not sure if you read my post or maybe you just didn't understand my point.

Anyway, as for your point about sample size, unfortunately in this case, it was the playoffs. Irregardless of how badly Lin was injured, he was a no-show in the playoffs while Beverley stepped up. The goodwill among haters that Jeremy had built up until the playoffs dissipated REAL FAST. Again, it's about what have you done for me lately.

Next season is a fresh start but I'm sure these playoffs are gonna be used as a knock against JLin just like how OKC fans said Harden choked in the finals.

Time for the Rocky's routine!

Hearts on Fire, Jlin!
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Thats that same kinda thing of "T-Mac in party at Vegas - Y HE NO REHABING injury?" blame.

Reports indicated Lin worked out at gyms while on these trips, and does have a shooting coach. And as indicated, Lin was still limited by his injury some.

David Lee's an established vet, but went on a same trip and he became an All Star. His play didnt suffer.

There is those other things like Linsanity movie stuff that have to be a distraction. Though its not like Lin is about the groupies and the party lifestyle either. Or just toning the body lifting weights like Terrence Williams instead of working with a shooting coach.

 

Dear Kwame,

Lin is from California and is not "going back" to Taiwan.

And Lin IS a celebrity there. And he trained while in Asia too. Last year, on the day of his arrival, he hit the gym a mere 2 hours after checking into the hotel, and that's after a 12-hour flight.

Get your facts straight before you post, so you are not attacking just for the sake of attacking.

 

This is why it's a good idea to pay out a little more money to hard working players. Because they are more likely to improve with their salaries.

Glad we have Lin. He didn't say anything you wouldn't expect him to say, but I do believe him. I sincerely hope that he doesn't try to improve EVERYTHING in the offseason. Probably pick 2 or 3 critical areas which he needs to improve and focus on those. I would hope his main focus would be off the ball movement, defense and 3-pt shooting (since he's already stellar at driving to the basket).

His improvement from the first half of last season to the second half of this season was fantastic. If he can maintain half that pace of improvement for a couple of more years, the dude will be a deserving starting PG.

 

I was skeptical at first, but I've grown optimistic that Lin will become an above average pg. In Morey I trust.

 

I'm going to ignore the first two paragraphs because that doesn't explain anything that wasn't already obvious about your opinion. You actually did bother to list players later so at least people can respond to that.

And I don't think anyone was actively arguing that Lin is a superstar in this thread. As I pointed out, you were responding to the sig of a Lin fan. Unless you plan on responding to that sig every time the guy posts anywhere, you might want to tone it down. This is exactly the kind of thing that has been pervading these boards for the past year+.

Again, stop putting words in people's mouths about who is saying he's a superstar. Try reading what people are actually saying and responding to those things instead. Someone disagreeing with things you are claiming doesn't mean that person is part of some crazy fan cult. That might make it easier for you to dismiss what they are saying, but that doesn't make it any more true, and it doesn't make your arguments any better.

Your list of names are all good players are all good, but I'm curious how you came up with them. Did you just go by gut feeling or reputation? Like, have you actually watched all the NBA games to know who is and who isn't a "superstar"?

Both you and eMat seem to be arguing that a superstar really holds some kind of rarified air that transcends All-Star status or even "Franchise Player" status (whatever that means). Fine, I can go with that. But you do realize that the number of players you are limiting this group to are all candidates for the Hall of Fame?

Just FYI, based on 2012-2013 numbers, here are the players who are all higher than the lowest-ranked player on your list in Win Shares (who played at least 20 games):

Marc Gasol
Stephen Curry
Deron Williams
Blake Griffin
Mike Conley
George Hill
Carmelo Anthony
Serge Ibaka


Here's the list for Win Shares/48 Minutes:

Jeremy Evans
Tyson Chandler
Chris Andersen
Marc Gasol
Tiago Splitter
Blake Griffin
Brook Lopez
Tim Duncan
Amar'e Stoudemire
Deron Williams
Carmelo Anthony
Chris Wilcox
Serge Ibaka
Stephen Curry
David West
George Hill
Chris Johnson
Chris Bosh


Same list for PER:

Carmelo Anthony
Brook Lopez
Tim Duncan


Offensive Rating
This list is too long - Russell Westbrook is ranked 88th on the list, D.Wade and Kobe don't fare much better at 81st and 82nd, respectively.


Defensive Rating
Again, too long - Kobe is at 244th. Tony Parker and James Harden are at 209th and 210th, respectively.


Net Rating
Even this list is too long. Kobe shows up at 107th. Westbrook is at 73rd. Wade is at 59th. Parker and Harden are at 52nd and 53rd. Only C.Paul (5th), LeBron (6th), and Durant (7th) are in the Top 10.


I'm not saying these stats are at all definitive, but at least they're consistent in a lot of ways. I'm really curious as to why some Hall-of-Fame caliber players like Tim Duncan are being left off the list, but others who are maybe well past their prime like Kobe Bryant are left on? Wouldn't Steph Curry make a better choice than D.Wade, given their respective ages and performances?

What's the criteria here? Just "these 5 guys" and that's it? What's the threshold for performance? Is it just offensive scoring or defensive effectiveness that counts? Or both? Can a guy be a crazy scorer but have horrible defense and still be allowed to call himself a "superstar"?

I'm really curious here, because you're the one who ostensibly seems to hell-bent on everyone else getting superstardom correct, so what exactly is your definition, and how do you apply that to the 450 players in the NBA at any given time?

 

When the three ball is falling, Lin is typically very effective. He just needs consistency and confidence in his long range shot. And let's keep in mind we don't need him to be a 20 and 10 guy, we just need him to be an above average PG. 15 and 7 with 36% shooting from three is more than enough, and he's not far off, especially if his minutes go up next season.

 

Good post. We just need a big that can finish PnRs. I hope Jones could grow into that.

 

Thanks for the info.

 

Its just one of those things we can talk about it all day, but all these lin haters still gonna hate until he does it.

I just hate dealing with it on our own board. I mean its one thing when drones like "clippy" come and invade clutchfans with their idiocy, but most of the lin hate comes from right here.

Lin has enough athleticism to succeed, more than enough basketball IQ to be elite, and has the one thing that separates the good players from the great. That is motivation to get better, and the discipline to put that motivation to action. Just like Yao was for us ... Lin will be just like him.

Here is wishing him well, and I believe next year, you are going to see a new and improved Lin 2.0.

 

One of these is not like the others...... lol

 

Truly surprising, the trade for Kawhi wasn't that bad afterall.

 

If you're going to use "another fans" signature in your post, then that must mean you agree with it to a certain degree, right?

If you associate yourself with something, expect that people believe that you truly believe that.

Roll with pigs, you're going to get muddy.

As for superstardom status, those top 8 I mentioned were just names I threw out there who were in the discussion.

Some guys have been diminished, a la Kobe or Tim Duncan

Some guys are in their primes, Lebron and Durant

And then some guys are clearly no longer superstars, KG and Pierce

Then you have the young Guns, the likes of Steph' Curry and Paul George, clearly, they are on the path to superstar status, but they're just getting started.
Most of the guys I've listed have either been there, are there, or can still turn it on when necessary.

Superstar status isn't something you just do one year, it is something you earn multiple years, or something you prove--countless times in the playoffs.

Is Paul George a superstar? No, he hasn't earned that title, yet, but goodness, he is on his way.

He is a two way player, getting better offensively, and elite defensively.

Clearly we agree and disagree that there is grey area about who's a superstar and who's not.

Allstar, Superstar. Clearly, Superstars are on another level.

Will Lin ever be a superstar? Let's see if he can become an all star, first, before we use 'another fans' signature to insinuate that you believe it.

 

Lin was in HK, Taiwan, China altogether less than 2 weeks, where he trained 3-5 hours per day while on the ground.

I'm sure no NBA player has ever taken two weeks off, or took a two week break to give back to the community while training.

I am pretty sure no other NBA player does that Lin did and gets criticised for it.

 

I think theres alot of truth to this, the manner in which Lin arrived in the nba was so surreal, almost as if even he cant believe it sometimes. Well, hes the freaking starting PG for the rockets. He knows how to play. Hes in the NBA, one of the top players in the world (everyone in the nba is good) and he needs that killer instinct/ruthlessness to go with it.

 

Good grief, you make it sound as if Lin's motivation is rare and that other guys are not as motivated.

Wake up, this is the NBA. Most guys are motivated.
Even Patrick Beverley is hungry to bite at Lin's starting position.

It's sad that people can't have doubts about Lin--without being dubbed--by insecure 'Lin-worshippers,' as a "hater."

Lin needs to earn his stripes, clearly he has not. You guys make it easy to knock Lin off of this high pedestal you place him on when you make him out to be 'God-like.'

Newsflash, he is mortal. He hasn't played in his last 2 opportunities in the playoffs. once as a Knick and the other as a Rocket. he just missed a crucial opportunity to grow with the rest of our young team by not being able to play.

Lin is an average point guard right now. He can get better, but he is not the next Chris Paul, Steve Nash, or Tony Parker. He has an opportunity to be a good starting point guard, but let him cross that threshold before we start dubbing him as a 'star'

 

It is is rare...that drive and work ethic is the only thing that separates the kobes in the world from von wafers. The athleticism and ability are there in both. Kobe has an unrelenting drive to perfect his game.

I believe lin has that and will show it...just like yao...he worked relentlessly on his game.

Its not that you cant have doubts. I admit he is average, and I have some concerns. But I still am pulling for him...he is a good person and I like his game. But most importantly he is a rocket. I would love for him to come back next seasons and be an all star dropping 21 and 7 on 50 fg% amd 40% from 3.

But its like most of you would rather him come back and fail and bust. You can have doubts but still support the player on your team.

 

It is going to be difficult to average 20 ppg. especially with Parsons and Asik breaking out. Lin should be focused on becoming a better decision maker, defender, and a better spot up shooter.

If Lin can average 15ppg and 8 assists, our rockets will be in poll position to take things to another level.

Harden, Parsons, and Asik are penciled in at their positions. They've earned it. We obviously need a PF, and we need Lin to step up and become a more consistent player.

 

Please tell me where I've actually used the signature in any way other than to point out that you were responding to it, and how that was kind of ridiculous and not at all constructive.

Go ahead, I'll wait...

Still waiting...