Get involved in what, nobody is worth voting for. The only choice is the lesser of two evils. The problem is people like you think then government reflects any of us. The government gave us 2 choices and we get to pick 1. We reflect the government not the other way around. The tea party is not a new party its just a modest form of the KKK.
A true third party is simply not a valid option in human nature. People in general tend to go with the masses...sheeple if you will. As you can attest in this very forum, there are those who actually believe the opposing side is completely wrong and their side is right.
Oh I dunno. European democracies have multiple party platforms. I don't feel like listing them but its easy to find. America has its issues but a lot of literature suggests that America as a whole is more moderate than anything and its elected officials tend to be more extreme in nature. I can provide links if anyone wants.The extremes of the population yell louder and as a result receive more lip service from politicians and more media attention. Also, the extremes donate money, lots of it. I agree with your sheeple part though. If there wasn't a D or an R next to candidates on a ballot people would be lost. They need party ID and a bunch of people telling them what to do.
The thing that's hilarious about Nextup's post, to put it simply, is the sheer EGO behind it. Because in a sense, he's right. One vote doesn't matter. If we freaked out and jumped around off the opinions of every nutjob that we deal with, Congress would never get anything done. Showing up at an election booth once every four years won't change a thing. But if you think that you're such a special snowflake that you believe that your ten minutes at a polling station should change the opinions of a country of 300 million people, then you're an idiot. It takes a lot of a work. Huge amounts of work over years. History itself shows that. How long did the Russian revolutionaries fight against the Imperial Secret police until there was change. While I hate to Godwin, Hitler, for 11 years, fought tirelessly to take down a system which he believed to be corrupt. You want to help change the opinions of an entire country to your opinion? Get down to work on it. And that doesn't just mean rant on a basketball bbs or vote every few years.
Its a different time. Now it takes money to make things happen. Massive amount ts of money. Money has to be on your side. Nobody's vote makes a difference. I'm not attempting to change the entire countries opinion. Many people feel the same way I do but are afraid to deal with the backlash of the bipartisan system. The american system is too powerful, the bipartisan system tears this nation apart. The people fight each other while the government robs us blind. In today's society the Russian revolutionary"s would of been squashed. The media would portray them as some kind of cult. The same thing for Hitler. Any thing that is not status quo gets destroyed.
You know what I read? Cute justifications for giving up before you even try. If the historical examples aren't good enough for you, I'll give you a personal one. A good friend of mine, still in college, and a massive libertarian. If you've read my posts, you know that I think libertarian is a ridiculous philosophy which is essentially right-wing Marxism. But I massively respect this guy. I knew about him before he entered college, but I was surprised by his devotion. The first thing he did? Establish a libertarian organization. Host events on campus. Run a blog. Meet members of the College Republicans, talk to people, and work, work, work for the libertarian ideal. Today, if you're anyone in the College Republicans, you know him, and he's currently running for President of the state CRs. That's work I can respect. That's devotion I can respect for those who really want to change the system. "But he's failed." No doubt you'll cry. "Libertarianism hasn't swept the nation, so his efforts are pointless!" Of course he hasn't. He's just a college student. But he, through his work, has more of a voice in the political system than a whiny brat like you ever will. And if you want to ignore college? Take the people who come to DC, who come to our offices. Do you think that they are all bigshot bigwigs, who hobknob and share fancy appetizers with the representatives? No. I deal with normal people more often than not. Normal people who generally are complete morons, but normal people nonetheless who are working within the political system. Some of them will get their way. Others won't That's how the American political system works. No one is happy all the time, just like life. I may call them idiots, but I respect their devotion and desire to help things. I don't respect people like you, who cry and whine, who fling invectives against the system and think you're edgy when you sit around and do nothing. Hell, go to Europe. Go to that continent where their kids riot in the streets and legitimate Nazis are elected into power. Or go to Japan, where you can REALLY see a country where people do not give a crap about politics whatsoever and no longer have a sense of purpose or ideals, who are really spiritually dying.
Your friend is a supporter of minor party that is an offshoot of the Republican party. He has a voice? Keep living in the fantasy land. Money has voice, big business has a voice without the money their is no voice. The libertarian party is a waste of time. The only party that makes sense is no party at all. Political parties only lead to lack of creativity and the continuance of the status quo. Their is no change, their is no voice. The overwhelming voice is oppression.
Well, thanks for confirming that you really think you are a special snowflake after all. Political parties exist because people will organize themselves into factions no matter what, because - ta-dah! - people have differences on opinions about the best way to manage the country. Basic Government 101. No system on earth, and no government on earth, will ever not have them. If you don't know even that much, then you're not worth talking to anyways since you won't change anything to begin with.
The 2013 cuts amount to $85 billion out of a $3.6 trillion budget. But of that $85 billion, only $44 billion would have been spent this year anyway, amounting to 1.2% of the total budget. You're right that in the affected areas, it is more like 5-8%.
Basic government 101 has been failing the entire world. Your correct, systems and governments will always have parties. That does not make it effective. Cooperation is the key. A party system doesn't allow that. Imagine how much more could get done if representatives didn't have to follow a party line when voting. The system is meant to stifle new ideas and change.
I am going to assume that you are young. The reason I say that is that, in my lifetime (almost 40 years), there have been times when cooperation across party lines has gotten things done. Before my time, in American history, cooperation has gotten things done. The 20th century was a time of great change in this country, and it could not have gotten done without both parties. Any party system is going to have its rancor. However, those party affiliations have more to do with the beliefs in common amongst the members than just a license to disagree. Yours is a defeatist and very bleak view. If everybody took that view, nothing truly would ever get done. It would be a self fulfilling prophecy.
I'm from an older generation that you, Refman, yet we both remember vividly the two political parties working together on crucial issues. Sure, not all the time, but more often that young people today would probably believe if all they have to go on is the last few years of American politics. There's no reason it can't happen again. In fact, I'm sure it will. What we can depend on is that people like Nextup will not be part of it.
Err... Europe is one of the most diverse, heterogeneous geographical references in the world. It's very difficult to say Europe is _____ and have it be true in 3 places. And to continue pointing out the obvious, the scope of both population and landmass managed under one government in America makes it difficult to compare to Europe. Don't get me wrong, I have respect for Europeans and lessons that can be learned from political / cultural discussion with Europeans. But it's silly to make generalizations. At any rate, unfortunately, as soon as someone drops the word 'Republican' or 'Democrat'... the conversation loses any collaborative element and turns to: Spoiler I'm encouraged to hear a generation older than myself, namely Deckard and Refman, suggest that there is a possibility for cooperation to return to American politics. I have my doubts. I think it is going to take something regrettable and shocking to bust people out of their partisan forts.
Is this what our country has come to - accusing those who disagree with us of terrorism? I am a staunch conservative, but I am appalled at the extremism in this country. The partisanship is unbelievable. President Obama has shown no leadership, and we are more polarized now than before he became president. I don't care whether you are Democrat, Republican, Green Party, Libertarian; the fact that we can't come together to fix the sequester issue is a sign of how far off the path we are.
Ironically, I think you could say that some Republicans are terrorists. Some fear monger to advance their agenda. But you could also say that about any major news netowrk and politicians of any political party could be terrorists too.
All of this cooperation between the two parties is a myth. All of the credit for change is being given to the government. Government cooperation was forced by circumstance or by the people forcing it. This so called cooperation took place because people used to protest, people used to fight for their beliefs. People used to understand that going through the system is not always the answer. The media has perfected their craft. I'm old enough to see the difference. When ever their is a protest , the protesters are in almost all cases portrayed in a negative light. Americans are afraid they're afraid to protest they're afraid to go against the status quo. We can debate about so many complex issues but the truth is rather simple. The government works for the top 1% and big business. They attempt to squeeze as much productivity out of us as possible. The truly sickening part is all of the pain and suffering is artificial. If the government decided to make our lives better they could. Why do Americans work so many hours and have so little vacation? How can so manyamericans not have access to healthcare? Why are their so many monopolies? How do countries with so much less then the most powerful country in the world still maintain lifestyles thast are comparable to ours? They do this because the people of america are silent. The people believe the fight is between republicans and democrats but the real fight is the government vs the people. Their is only one way to create change and that is by demanding it. Change has and always will come because the people demanded it not because the system wants it. Remember people the system likes the system, the government, the top 1 % and big business are thriving like never before and they"re more then happy to maintain the status quo. People have become apathetic. We have our cable tv ,internet, and more entertainment choices then ever before. People would rather tweet or Facebook something then get out on the street in the 100 degree houston heat to protest and risk getting arrested for their trouble. Things are only getting worse because the government has lost all respect for the people. They know we're scared, we're scared to lose our jobs, we're scared of the police. Things will continue to get worst until people demand change.
Let me get this straight. You go onto some giant rant on super special Europe and how awesome they are compared to America....and then complain about how American representatives toe the party line too much. Consequently, I'm openly calling BS on your claim that you've been to Europe long enough to actually see how their system works.
Don't worry guys, Nextup, is just another Ronny/Honey Bear account that he created to troll the D&D. Move along.
