Morey does not deserve credit for pulling the trigger and offering a max deal to Harden, because ANY half decent GM would have done so if given a chance. Saying that he deserves all the credit in the world for that is dumb. What Morey does need to be recognized for is how he put the Rockets in a position for such a type of trade to become available to begin with. It annoys me that people simply dismiss that as luck. Yes the fact that it was Harden and not another star that was on the trade block was lucky, but the fact that the Rockets were in the position to make such trades for ANY star had nothing to do with luck. That was the result of hard work and great cap planning. This is the point that a lot of us are trying to make. The fact that Harden was the star available on the block was luck. The fact that we were able to trade for him was NOT luck however.
Sure, but that's true of anything in life given the extent random chance affects everything we do, so unless you want to get into some Calvinist predestination argument I don't really know what to do with this.
We did not intentionally float on the 8th seed. We tried to get a better seeding by playing the players that were more ready to play instead of the younger players. Due to this, we were able to show that we have very decent players and those were the ones we used to trade for draft picks. Without Lamb, the Harden trade might not have worked.
Any half decent GM would not have made that move. That is a lot of money to give to a career 6th man. There are lots of other GMs around the league that would not have been willing to give him a max deal. Apparently there are GMs that weren't willing to trade for him because of that and that is how we ended up with him. There were also commentators and players that said they didn't think he was worth that much. To act like it was a no brainer to max out Harden is the dumb statement.
The biggest pieces were Lowry (raptors pick) and Martin whose values actually went down after last season. Having a higher draft pick would not have prevented us from getting Lamb.
Why does a team trade their 5th round pick in his rookie year? I don't understand.......... Such a dumb move for them (and good for us).
You don't have to do anything with it. I was just pointing out that you were incorrectly implying what i meant when I said lucky/luck.
And this is where I think you are dead wrong. Yes he only played the 6th man role, but when you extrapolate his numbers, it shows him to be a super efficient scorer and player. How do you know there are not a lot of GM's around the league that would not have given him max money? The only one we now of is the Thunder. Did any other GM tell you that Harden wasn't worth it? Do you know what other teams offered or did not offer a trade for Harden? As far as your comments about commentators and players, that is just simply hilarious. First of all commentators are about as credible as you or I. They offer opinions and opinions are like one's anus. As for the players, many of them were shocked that the Thunder would actually let him go and many predicted that he would rampage as the Rockets franchise player.
All we have to go by as fans is what is reported in the media. There were reports of GMs saying that they felt Harden was not a max player. It was reported that the Wizards didn't trade for him in large part because of that. You speak as if you saying that any half decent would have maxed him up is somehow more credible or supported by evidence than me saying that there were GMs that would not have. Morey deserves a lot of credit for taking the risk on Harden.
The rap on Harden was that he was the second coming of Ginobili. I don't know how many teams out there would trade their top scorer and a haul of draft picks for the privilege of giving Ginobili a max deal and building a team around him. Yeah, if you extrapolated Harden's numbers, it was promising. But not every GM can be bothered to do that. After three years in the league, plenty probably thought Harden was what he was in the NBA-- a terrific second or third scorer.
We certainly did. It just didn't result in regular season losses, so a lot of people somehow didn't notice. After striking out on a draft night trade for Howard/equivalent, Morey tanked the roster. Dumped Lowry, Dragic, Lee, Scola, Dalembert, Camby, etc for nothing or pennies on the dollar, with Kevin Martin a lame duck. That's a tank job. Morey dropped a nuclear bomb on our roster. And it worked! He made some savvy moves to pick up Harden, Lin, Asik, and now Robinson. Those moves would not have been possible if he had re-signed Dragic and Lee, and kept Scola and the other guys because those moves were all possible because of the salary cap flexibility afforded by blowing up the roster. Had those subsequent moves not worked out -- if Chicago and New York matched the offer sheets, if Harden had agreed to take less money, if the Maloofs weren't turning tricks just to keep the bank from foreclosing on the house, our roster and our record would have been very, very bad and everyone would recognize the summer moves for what they were -- a tank job.
IIRC, the tanking crowd wanted to let the young guys try to make the playoffs once we got Harden. What is the point of this thread? Before the season very few could say the Rockets are gonna make the playoffs on this forum without getting their heads bitten off.
Uhh, two of those guys were FAs who were replaced by two equally good FAs. Scola was a cap casualty. Dalembert and Camby weren't worth ****, and that's what we got for them. And Lowry got us a high lotto pick, which is great value. What are you on, that you think any of these moves were pennies on the dollar (except Scola cap decision)?
Link me these reports about GM's saying they do not feel he is a max player and just FYI, I don't consider unnamed sources credible. The only one that is actually quoted was the Wizards GM. Are you seriously trying to say that the Wizards front office is competent? Until we have proven reports, where sources are named, of teams declining trades because they do not believe Harden is a max player, there is nothing that supports your argument. We are talking about a young, extremely talented scorer who happened to play on a team with 2 excellent scorers already and was better served with Harden coming off the bench, one that performed great in the playoffs save the Finals and as history showed, anytime you increased his minutes, his output scaled very well as well. All the signs were there that Harden would more likely be great than not.
Things have really turned around for the Wizards, the Cavs, the Kings, the Wolves, the Wizards, the Pistons...
Do you honestly think DM is as incompetent as the GM's for those teams? A genuine top pick would yield considerably different results in DM's hand.
Until we have confirmed pre trade sources that say that almost all GMs would have given Harden a max deal there is nothing that supports your argument. Right now the count is wizards/thunder no and rockets yes.
That's possible. But I think between picks 16 and 18 we could have either moved up to get Lamb or drafted a player the Thunder would have had interest in.
Let's not underestimate Sammy's contract. That was very attractive to other teams - another good Morey move
