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Why are Rockets fans in love with Cousins yet hate Josh Smith?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by OlajuwonFan81, Jan 17, 2013.

  1. kooguyjohn

    kooguyjohn Member

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    this was less than a week ago
    [youtube]F6pERQcPnhU[/youtube]
     
  2. J.R.

    J.R. Member

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    Why are Rockets fans in love with becoming the Atlanta Hawks of the West(or the Memphis Grizzlies)? :p

    If you're gonna spend anywhere from $10 to 15 mil on player, make it worth your while(or money)! Yeah, getting a superstar(let alone star) or elite player is few and far between but what good is it to have a capped out roster, where the ceiling is [maybe] the 2nd round?

    With all due respect to these players, I just don't get the love affair with the Josh Smith, Al Jefferson, & Paul Millsaps of the world.

    "We got 15 million in cap room, hurry, go throw it at Josh Smith!" <---PASS.
     
  3. stefanb

    stefanb Member

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    Meh, just because a few people make some posts about Cousins doesn't mean that we're in love with him. "If you love it so much then why don't you marry it?" hehe
     
  4. coachbadlee

    coachbadlee Member

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    It's because Cousins is still very young and has so much more potential to realize than Smith. Smith is what Smith is.
     
  5. OlajuwonFan81

    OlajuwonFan81 Member

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    Agreed.......it just seems clutchfans make every excuse for cousins because of his raw talent. They want to overlook his inefficient scoring, inferior defense, not to mention he's a mental headcase.
     
  6. Arthurprescott2

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    Would seriously love to roll the dice on Cousins - he's also on a SUPER reasonable contract while Smith will likely want MAX. Smith is good - much better than our "power" forwards but he is an idiot and is inefficient as hell w/o having a back-to-the-basket game. He's the type of athlete we want though.

    Cousins has that athleticism, is as good a defender, and can literally do anything as a big man. Shoot jumpers - yes. Post-up game - yes. Defend/block/alter shots - yes. Handle the ball even - YES! He's also an idiot and a headcase. But Harden/Lin/Cousins/Parsons would be an amazingly fun experiment to watch. One would hope McHale or Harden or Lin could reign Cousins in a bit, but with his talent, Cousins should be a top 15 player.
     
  7. OlajuwonFan81

    OlajuwonFan81 Member

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    Some of your analysis is just flat out wrong. I have watched over 50 kings games and cousins is not as good of a defender. He also has no post up game. His basketball IQ is also awful. I understand the raw talent, but at least be real about his production and current skill level.
     
  8. haoafu

    haoafu Contributing Member

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    1) Cousins is so young that he's eligible for 2013 draft had he stayed in college(yes, he's that young). The upside is tremendous. And he can grow with our young core together.

    2) He's on the rookie contract(with team option next year), so we can still add another max player with some cap room manipulation. It's easy to trade or get out of his contract if things don't work out.

    3) His PER last year and this season are above 21(none of our players achieved that except harden), which means his production on court is already on star level at such a young age under rookie contract.
     
  9. Arthurprescott2

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    Yea his IQ is terrible, but Synergy says Cousins has a post-up game. 25.1% of his plays are post-ups; total 171 possessions; 0.82 ppp.

    The rest of his offense is spread out between (~10-15% each) ISO, Spot-up, Roll man, and offensive rebounds. Cousins has 118 offensive rebounds this season.

    Cousins is actually a very good defender when he wants to be. When you see bad defense from him, it's cause he's sulking about calls or what not.

    His Synergy defensive numbers: overall 0.78 ppp, good for 59th in the league.

    And he's got great post defense: 0.69 ppp, good for 29th in the league (107 possessions in total).

    He's got bad spot-up defense - he is huge - can't quite close out; maybe too lazy at times: 1.03 ppp, 197th in the league.
     
  10. OlajuwonFan81

    OlajuwonFan81 Member

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    I am not sure what synergy says and to be honest could care less. I have watched enough of cousins to understand what he is good at, and what he lacks.

    He isn't very athletic and when you combine that with a player that isn't motivated defensively you get a very average to below average defender. It is clear to anyone who watches him that he isn't very good defensively. He has trouble moving his feet and staying in front of people and i don't think he will ever learn how to do that.....

    As far as post game, he has no fade away, no jump hook, isn't athletic enough to just roll around or go baseline on the opposing defender consistently. When the double team comes it usually ends up as a turnover because his IQ is so poor. The guy turns the ball over in critical situations time and time again. Let me be clear, his low post game is highly inferior.

    The one thing i will give him is his faceup game from about 12 feet. It is solid because he has decent handles for his size and once on the move he can just bully his way to the basket. Once near the hoop he can finish or get fouled.

    I know advanced stats might tell you otherwise, but one cannot just look at advanced stats and come to legitimate conclusions.
     
  11. Arthurprescott2

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    I probably do need to watch more Cousins and will make a point to do over the course of the next few weeks. But you can't just discount Synergy stats by saying they are just "advanced stats." Synergy is just the compilation of data by a group of ppl pouring over game tape. When Synergy says Cousins has 171~ post-up possessions, it means a guy in a room watched ALL of Cousins and made a note on every single time Cousins posted up. Some advanced stats like PER or WS/48 might be misleading. But I'm not even referring to those, I'm purely looking at # of possessions, types of possessions, and if he scored. That's not advanced stats, that's having someone else watch the game for me.
     
  12. thumbs

    thumbs Member

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    Cousins reminds me of Eddy Curry -- and we already have Royce White. Josh Smith is a PF with a SF's mindset. We have enough of those too.
     
  13. OlajuwonFan81

    OlajuwonFan81 Member

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    I don't discount your stats, however i don't change my opinion based upon a stat when i have watched the guy for his whole career. Stats help prove your point and i understand that, but when you break down a player in terms of his skills and abilities you will come to the same conclusions as I did.

    Nice discussion.
     
  14. Arthurprescott2

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    And you definitely don't need to change your opinion. I was just making my opinion known. Fun discussion :grin:.

    last little nugget: (it doesn't say much, it's just a highlight reel; but he does have some game in the post ;)).
    <iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/hw0tsEmlyWg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
     
  15. smr6

    smr6 Member

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    Age and potential sums it up.

    Smith is what he is, which is a good player but he wont get any better. What concerns me with Smith is that even after all these years in the league he still doesn't have to ability to recognize what he can and cannot do out there and makes needless mistakes and bad plays.

    Cousins on the other hand is off-court drama waiting to happen for the most part. He's young and can still mature, but his actions aren't predicating that as of right now.

    Not a huge fan of either one in all honesty, but I would be happy if the Rockets picked up either since both make our team better.
     
  16. OlajuwonFan81

    OlajuwonFan81 Member

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    I watched the first 3 minutes of the "highlight" reel and it proves my point. He is much more comfortable with his face to the basket and on the move. He has no real go to moves on the block. It is mostly just his brute strength. In any case no need to ruin this convo with a highlight reel. :)
     
  17. Arthurprescott2

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    Oh it's definitely not the most polished game. He's still young and has time to learn. He hasn't been in the best of environments in SAC in his defense. But also he's just not that motivated either - chicken and egg problem. His body should be more jacked. But imagine that body, that strength, and his handles + McHale giving him some moves. :eek:

    Most big guys early in their career just won't have those post moves. Very rare - part of the reason Sullinger was interesting in the draft. I think KG early in his career had it, but he learned that as he went along. Only Cousins' 3rd year.
     
  18. OlajuwonFan81

    OlajuwonFan81 Member

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    That is fine, i do agree that he has the ability to develop a low post game, but you can say that for many players.

    As of right now though his low post game is inferior. That was what sparked the discussion....you said in your earlier post that he had a good low post game. That is where we had our disagreement.
     
  19. Mr2Hos

    Mr2Hos Member

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    can you make posts that correlate to your username
    Cousins plays better with his back to the basket, sure he can face up for the short jump shot, but his expertise is with his back to the basket.
     
  20. Mr2Hos

    Mr2Hos Member

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    he has a good low post game, better than Dwight, calipari coached him well in that department.
     

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