The Topic of Gun Control and How it Relates to Recent Mass Shootings

Im not sure why you think its ok for the government to trample all over ones rights. As stated, I am completely for better gun control. I am, however, against ineffective gun control just to make the ignorant masses "feel better". Ineffective gun control only punishes the responsible parties.

Also as I have stated, mass shootings are a very small fraction of the gun control problem. For every mass shooting, there are exponentially more people individually killed by guns. A big chunk of this is due to "responsible" gun owners not being held accountable for their guns. Responsible gun owners tend to obey the law. If there are no laws or repercussions for those individuals who refuse to lock their weapons, then they simply won't do it. If there are laws that state, "If little jonny from next door breaks into your house and steals your unsecured pistol and harms someone, you're going to jail", people will either start securing them or getting rid of them. That law alone will go much much much further than arbitrarily banning assault rifles.

 

Do you not agree there is a limit to one's 2nd amendment right? Why do you think exacting the scope of 2nd am right, like the manner to bear and the type of firearms covered, is "trampling all over one's right"? Please answer.

Why do you think assault rifle and 10 round magazine is so inalienable from 2nd am and banning them is "punishing responsible gun owners". To so many of us, such a ban is just a logical and sensible response. I don't know what else to say. Since you don't see it that way, we just have to leave at that. There are t like 40 some pages on this, and I am really tired of repeating.

Why do you think irresponsible ones will be deterred under your proposal? What are you proposing? Like mandatory sentencing and fines? You mean gun owners dont already know, under the current law, they can go to jail and pay money damages if their guns fall into liltte jonny's hands and harm someone due to their gross negligence?

 

Banning ownership and confiscating 4 million assault rifles is not going to happen. If this is what you are suggesting, then we may as well dream about rainbows and riding unicorns while we are at it. No politician will even touch that subject. There is no point in seriously entertaining that subject.

The 1994 ban prohibited the further manufacturing of these weapons, not owning them. Reinstating this ban is what I call ineffective gun control. It will take decades for this to have any effect. There are better ways to address the issue.

If someone breaks into your house and steals your guns, you are typically not held responsible. Gun owners are not required to lock up their guns. Personally, I think all guns should be required to be locked up in a metal safe, with the exception of shotguns and 1 registered gun per concealed permit. If the law is made black and white, then more gun owners will take gun ownership more serious.

 

Time to arm the firefighters in addition to teachers.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/24/firefighters-shot-webster-fire_n_2358822.html

4 Firefighters Shot, 2 Killed At Webster, New York Fire Scene

WEBSTER, N.Y. -- Authorities say four firefighters were shot, two of them killed while responding to a house fire in western New York.

Officials in the town of Webster tell local media outlets that someone shot at firefighters around 6 a.m. Monday when they arrived at the scene of the blaze just east of Rochester.

CNN reports that two responding firefighters are being treated for gunshot wounds. Two other firefighters were killed, but officials wouldn't elaborate on how they died.

A Webster fire official told ABC that the firefighters were shot at when they pulled up to a house in the 100 block of Lake Road. The crime scene is still active, but officials said there is no active shooter at this time.

Police secured the area by 10 a.m. and firefighters started combating the blaze, which spread to at least three houses, according to the Democrat and Chronicle. It's unclear whether any arrests have been made, or whether anyone was injured in the fire.

SWAT teams on scene have reportedly been evacuating a some nearby residents and taking them out of the neighborhood.

 

Don't care, I enjoy target shooting too much!

 

Interesting... early on in this discussion, a number of people posted reasonable moves to address the gun violence issue. Initial response from the gun lobby (I mean, those resisting reasonable moves to address the gun violence issue) was swift, loud, and predictable: "second amendment!", "pry my guns from my fingers", "not the gun, its the person".

Then when it was clear that the majority of people were ignoring these tired NRA talking points and wanted something done, out comes the NRA and their "spokespeople" and we heard "arm teachers!", "armed guards at every school". These ridiculous positions have backfired, since the public seems even more resolute to address the problem (thank you NRA!).

So now, we are seeing gun owners accepting the very real possibility that something will be done, and are asking folks to be "reasonable", that perhaps some "reasonable" controls can be put in place. Though they still don't want to surrender ownership, and would prefer to strengthen existing penalties for gun use in crimes, or waiting periods for certain types of weapons.

It's a start. And I believe some reasonable compromise can and will be found. I believe certain guns can be outlawed without violating what some believe are second amendment rights. I am more confident that magazine limits, and removable magazines can be addressed. And certainly the gun show loophole can be eliminated.

The NRA can say "won't be able to eliminate existing assault weapons" but I think it is inconsistent to try to limit assault weapon use in crimes while allowing uncontrolled manufacturing such weapons. So you have to address the new supply.

 

You have to address the manufacturing of new assault weapons if you have any hope of reducing the use of such weapons in crime. But curious as to your other suggestions on how to address the issue. Perhaps those can be also done.

Agree... gun owners should be required to do this, regardless f other steps taken.

 

Why couldnt the goverment create a law that would require every gun owner to be licensed? Grandfather the law in and say by 2014 you need to be a licensed in order to own a gun. They would go through the mandatory class and then be licensed. Then make the penalty for having a gun without a license stiff, either with jail time or a heavy fine.

 

There is a certain pattern to how these national gun policy discussions go.

Denial - "...." (silence and avoidance of the issue) > "blame the person not the weapon" > " violent vidyuh games and movies"

Anger - "but, CONSTITUTION!" > "FREEDUM!" > "GUBBERMINT TAKEOVER!"

Bargaining - "You can make a bomb from stuff at Wal-Mart" > "You can't close pandora's box" > "Let's focus on mental health instead"

Acceptance - "Make the regulations reasonable, please?"

 

I simply asked for a quote. Thank you for finally pointing out where it was quoted. Yes, that was a racist, stupid thing for ROXRAN to say, and he should apologize. As for the rest of it, both of you are assholes. Had the quote been posted when I asked for it, none of this back and forth would have been needed, nor would your insults, for which the two of you got some in return. I have no idea why ROX would say something that idiotic. While I don't agree with a lot of his beliefs, he's usually doesn't go that low. He should apologize for saying those things, which have no place here.

Thanks, Vlaurelio, for posting the quotes.

 

I agree and that sounds like a good idea. If Nancy Lanza had taken more care to secure her guns this tragedy might've been avoided. Also two weeks ago a 2 year old was killed in Minneapolis when his 4 year old brother got hold of their father's gun. Making sure guns are stored properly is common sense but it might be good to back that common sense with some law.

 

Yes, I think it had a huge impact.

If you don't agree with that. Then YOU offer a reason me why the shooter did what he did rather than just disagreeing with my opinion.

If you think mental health/lack of social skills is BS, and wasn't a factor, then why did the shooter do such a terrible thing? Also, why is mental health getting more attention on CNN and Fox News since the tragedy?

I was one of those guys who played video games all the time, especially in high school and college. 6-8 hours a day. Shutting out the outside world. Not being social enough. Looking back, I don't think that lifestyle was very beneficial. You are right. Monsters do not happen overnight. I think the shooter was a timid guy, who, by other students' accounts, was a loner for many years and always kept to himself.

But I could be wrong. I'd like you to offer a reason why the shooter did this?

 

I agree that those issues play some part in his role in the shooting of children but also remember it's much deeper than that.. We don't know what the cause of this just pure speculation and interviews...

Part of the factor, not the whole... I mean maybe because he couldn't get laid??? Not having a girlfriend or lack of girls will lead to some sort of distorted behavior...

You are right, I don't know the answer or why he would do something like this, but everything is based on speculation like I said...

 

Maybe that could be it. But not getting any is a result of social isolation.

 

I think this is a perfect example of the assault weapon debate, involving two US Senators on Fox News. Note that one senator addresses the issue directly with his comments, the other talks in vague NRA talking points to the degree the Fox News moderator first attempts to get him to answer then gives up.

 

Someone said something yesterday on meet the press along the line "you guys won the election, won the argument, but still a political pipe dream to put it into law."

We are in that stage now, getting there.

 

Yep and I bet 9 times out of 10 when a dude is socially inept it takes another dude to break the ice and welcomes him to a particular group... You see all the folks being interviewed by major news network and it's usually dudes that know him..

 

Personally, I would like to have more substantial regulations on assault rifles than just "lock them all up at all times if not used or else deal with severe penalties". Attach a gps locator to the assault rifle and subject it to random checks.

Would you agree to a 1994 ban in addition to laws like you proposed?

 

What? Are you an appointed something on this board? No one needs to show you anything. When did I insult you?

The stuff Vlaurelio showed you was in my post you first replied. Those ARE the quotes I took time collecting from multiple pages for someone to read. You were like yallmean wth are you talking about and get your brain examined. You replied all that without having bothered to read what you replied to for like 5 seconds?