[BREAKING] School Shooting in Conn. at Elementary School

My friend Brian said this. I agree wholeheartedly.

Guns were not causal. Mental health was. Systemic issues were. More gun control sure. But if people argue about that and only that they are ignoring what is causal, and also further polarizing opponents of gun control while the iron is hot. That's why I just feel bummed out when people are solely focused on guns which are merely the output mechanism for the actual problem. Foremost Neuroscience should be on the table, as well as education and all the other myriad of components at work here. If I lost a child yesterday I would be furious at the ignorance of people clamoring for gun control, not because I oppose it, but because it's only exemplary of the linear thinking that sustains the climate for these horrible things to keep happening.

 

I am just going to link to this post rather than retyping.
http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showpost.php?p=7439623&postcount=24

 

I'm as libertarian as they come, but if mental health issues represent a clear and present danger to all of us, that's justification for collective action.

End the drug war and use that money to build mental health programs.

 

Very sad story and one that I have heard first hand from families with children with mental health issues like this.

For all of those focusing on the issue of mental health I have a question.
Would you support health insurance reform that mandated mental health parity and also increased funding and government support for families dealing with this issue?

 

Best solution would be to have people apply for help and receive a voucher to get treatment somewhere. You'd get treatment centers competing for business and encourage innovative solutions and specialization.

An insurance mandate just drives up premiums for people that may have no need for that type of coverage (i.e. the vast majority of us).

 

Looking at that list of victims...brutal.

Sucks to see a name, followed with 6.

 

You're making it sound easy to root out the true mental disorder of a person or predict their true intentions. Sure some are getting treatment for these disorder but there are millions of people with disordered in America alone that is very hard to detect of which one might be the next. You would think this personal disorder kid would be able to kill 20 plus people with his fists, knives or a bat? There will always be a personal disorder person that will leak through that crack and somehow the system have failed to prevent these kind of people or acting out so the next step that must be taken seriously would be gun control.

 

Most of the mental case are the one that aren't being looked at, help or go undetected and isn't reported by their parent(s). So you are talking about from a small to a large percentage. Best thing is for the school to do a monthly to record from every students to hopefully detect these sign of symptoms. That way they would know who they think could be leading down that kind of path.

 

They changed their report today and said she didn't work there after all. A parent had said she was a teacher or sub and i guess they were mistaken. They can't find a connection between her and the school, but the shooter did attend the school as a kid.

 

We can talk about mental illness and about how people kill people, but there is no argument to be made that the type of gun does not matter. It does. This is the last thing 20 kids saw...

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/M4t8iCXkVcA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

Please understand that these drugs have long-term side effects that alter the chemistry of the brain. You can't just take them and expect the effects to be gone when you quit. They have both short and long-term side effects depending on the duration and how much you're taking. Those who stop taking psychiatric drugs face depression when they stop (and usually end up committing suicide). They become dependent on it or else they become unhappy. Usually that depression phases out after about 1 year, but that's too much to handle for some individuals.

"Colorado shooter James Holmes was under the care of a psychiatrist prior to the shootings, yet no information has been released on whether Holmes, like Colorado shooter Eric Harris, and countless others, was under the influence of psychiatric drugs documented to cause violence, psychosis, and even homicidal ideation."

http://www.cchrint.org/2012/07/20/t...senseless-shooting-another-psychotropic-drug/

He was on drugs. If you need me to find more proof, let me know.

Truth is, we play these video games and we want to shoot these guns. Maybe we should only be allowed to rent them at shooting ranges. It's hard to justify the use for that gun other than pleasure.


EDIT: I found this list on that website:

School Shooters Under the Influence of Psychiatric Drugs
At least fourteen recent school shootings were committed by those taking or withdrawing from psychiatric drugs. There have been 109 wounded and 58 killed.

http://www.cchrint.org/school-shooters/

 

What sort of justification allows for people to buy such weapons?

 

"Contrary to early reports...Nancy Lanza was not a teacher at Sandy Hook Elementary"

 

That's not true. He only used the handguns in the school, the Bushmaster .223 was left in the car. That's also a Bushmaster that is fully automatic, you can't buy them fully automatic. This is probably one issued to local police.

A semi-automatic .223 rifle (aka AR-15) can shoot just as fast as a semi-automatic hand gun... and while people can say they have a higher capacity, generally handguns are more deadly due to larger caliber. You can also buy large capacity clips for hand guns online, even from overseas without much difficulty, like this one for a glock:



Assault rifles also account for just a fraction of gun related deaths, handguns are the primary cause of gun deaths. 56% of gun-related deaths are suicide, 40% are homicides. 75% of all gun related homicides are due to handguns, just 4% are from rifles (like the Bushmaster .223). The majority of gun-related homicides are drug related.

Blame guns all you want, but get the facts right at least.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/16/us/connecticut-school-shooting/index.html

You should use your own advice and gets yours straight.

 

Wrong

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/16/us/connecticut-school-shooting/index.html

He was found dead with the handguns and the rifle. The autopsies on at least 7 showed that a "long weapon" was used.

 

There are about 100 stories online that says he left the rifle in the car, so blame the media for not getting their facts straight. With that said, that still doesn't change the fact that 4% of gun homicides are with rifles, and that is ALL rifles including hunting. His Bushmaster also isn't fully automatic unless his mother was in law enforcement (which she wasn't), so the video linked is inaccurate.

 

Nope. The media has gotten their facts straight, that was all updated information from the information provided yesterday. You're living off of what was said on Friday. So therefore, you were wrong for not getting your facts straight. Sorry.

 

You were wrong. Tell me svpernaut, give me one justification as to why handguns and semi-auto rifles ought be legal? Why are shotguns insufficient?

I just don't understand it. I will never feel comfortable with a gun in my house.

 

I was wrong because the misinformation of the media. Sorry, i don't watch the news 24/7 when these stories hit because it helps perpetuate future shootings. I'll read the news on it in a few weeks when all of the facts are in, until then you guys keep selling commercial slots as the media plasters this dude's face and name all over the world for weeks.

Because the second amendment affords me the rights to them. The entire meaning of the 2nd amendment is to protect you from the government, to give you the right to stand up for yourself if the government doesn't act in accordance with the laws. The government as you know, has far stronger weapons.

Either way, outlawing them now won't change a thing as America is split down the middle on gun control like every other hot topic. Outlawing drugs hasn't worked, nor will outlawing guns, it would just cause MORE violence.

EDIT - And to clarify, I am not a member of the NRA and I don't know anything about them other than Charlton Heston. So I don't contribute to their lobbying.