I don't know how good you're at projecting Patrick Patterson's future career, but it would help if you look at both 2Pat and Millsap's stats in their 3rd years. http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/millspa01.html http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/pattepa01.html
On the contrary, I've been paying attention every time you've moved the goalposts. For instance, now Paul Millsap is a "top 3 PF [in] everything" and "about a top 5 PF overall" provided we look at literally two months of lockout basketball played last season, per your own links. Relax though, you're neither the first nor last person on earth to deliberately cherry-pick your sample size in order to try to bolster a weak argument.
No. Morey's FA target is a foundational player. Milsap is not one of those. If Morey can't find one of those he will just sign some short-term deals and save the cap space until he can.
Saw the game on League Pass last night, Matt Harpring on the Utah broadcast team said Millsap has been struggling in recent games, lacking his usual energy and "oomph." I wonder if he is playing with an injury. Also, maybe he is pouting a bit due to a lack of contract extension (Aaron Brooks syndrome). Might also be just a random shooting slump. These happen. On one hand, Millsap can and has played better in his career. On the other hand, he is a 6'6" PF (without shoes) and maybe this is a preview of what an older slower Millsap will look like. He is only 27 now, but it takes a lot of athleticism to battle inside at his height and he can't really afford to lose much.
More advanced stat lols, 2012 NBA Regular Season: Patrick Patterson PER: 16.8 Paul Millsap PER: 18.0 Huge upgrade! Isn't this...your stat? I was the one who was supposed to change his mind after looking at this, right? What like we're just gonna buh buh...PER!! this thing as though no other human being knows about basketball-reference.com and could call that bluff?
I just took time to explain how wrong you are on a paragraph by paragraph basis, and how you only choose to see what you want to see, instead of reading other people's post and allowing for context to improve your understanding. The laughs on you. REALLY. NO KIDDING. LOL. WOW.
And yes, you still want to rely on 16 / 18 game sample size this year. And for context, look at James Harden's stats in games 3-8 playing the iso PG role on the Rockets vs his other games' stats. JUST LOOK AT IT!!! James Harden can't play PG, shouldn't have traded for him, or using your words, SOUNDS LIKE A STRIKE ON HIM!!! LOL, WOW ... just LOL, WOW!
You really got to READ AGAIN. Top 3 in WESTERN CONFERENCE. Re-READ POST 1. Even gave you the links to the data. YOU REALLY NEED TO LEARN TO READ
Another funny one as a testament to your reading comprehension. In my post ... "And fifth, to say we are closer to Millsap's ceiling is correct. " LEARN TO READ. When I was a baby, I learned to crawl before I walked. And when I was a pre-schooler learned to read before I wrote. Advice for you. READ BEFORE YOU WRITE. Or the laugh WILL be on YOU! LOL, WOW ... LOW, WOW!!!
And I will show you how RIDICULOUS you sound, when you wrote "his ceiling is literally Patrick Patterson with a few more boards a night" This is NOT what you write about someone whose best season has come in a sample size of 16 games, AND even then, is at best just creeping up on the typical season of another player. Ceiling / floor ??? DO YOU KNOW THE DIFFERENCE??? LOL ... WOW ... LOL ... WOW
Dude in all seriousness, none of your boldfaced points are very convincing. Here I'll just randomly skim and point out something you've said that is foolish. You ready? Again, I don't have the energy nor interest to debunk every foolish thing, so let's just focus on, for instance, statements like this: So now the goalpost is "30 minutes, consistently season after season" is it? We've invented yet another new condition here, this time in interpreting your own stats that you are bringing up to try to talk this guy up? Well let's see here. I'll go slowly here, because as you pointed out, I'm too stupid to understand this. Patrick Patterson PER: 16.8 MPG: 30.1 Hmm, alright, so Patterson averages 30 minutes per game, which is your new cutoff here, your new goalpost. So now this is significant, according to you. Paul Millsap: PER: 18.0 MPG: 30.7 Well what do you know? Milsapp also averages about 30 MPG--significant according to you--and is only a point higher in PER, and in fact scores fewer points on worse shooting? *gasp* How is that even possible? I thought he wasn't a sidegrade like I said, but an "elite PF, one of the top 3 if not top 5" like you said? These are your numbers, your stats. No wonder you wanted me to just look at a sliver of his production instead, in this case 6 weeks worth of play during a lockout season. You'll have to explain these new, more realistic levels of mediocrity to me, I am far too stupid to internalize it all. We should look at the player he was for 6 weeks during a lockout season, right, and not the player he is in the present day? Past Millsap yes, Present Day Millsap, no?
I'm gonna make another joke on you, because it's good for entertainment. My post --------------- And fifth, to say we are closer to Millsap's ceiling is correct. To say he has ZERO upside at 27 is more than off the mark. People forget Millsap was a 2nd round 40-something draft pick, because when he entered the NBA, he was a monster college rebounder and hustle player. Nothing else. They thought he might be good for a few hustle plays and rebounds a game. Kind of like undersized Kenneth Faried mould. Then he added some back to the basket moves/post ups. Then improved as cutter off PnRs. Then mid-range shots, then 18-20ft jump shots. Then iso moves, and started to handle the ball well. Also a very underrated passer for a PF these days. And this year, a bit of a 3-pt shot. 2 years ago, he gave up 40% on close-out 3pt defense, and a year later, it was down to 33%. Every year, he's added something new to his arsenal. And he's continued to improve, even though this year, it's hard to see because of the unique circumstances with Utah's frontline and youth movement. I think a poster mentioned his game being like a combination of Faried and Carl Landry. I quite agree. Some players stop improving, because they don't work hard at their games. That's not Millsap. ----------- Your interpretation " Paul Millsap is going to explode into a significantly better player than he's been for the past 7 NBA seasons because he was a good rebounder in college? Am I even reading this correctly? lol wow" The joke is on you. If you could find causal relationship in my post from Paul Millsap good rebounder in college -> will explode after 7 NBA seasons ... You would be better than Sherlock Holmes. Again ... LOL WOW ... LOL WOW
I get it, though. You're catching feelings because the whole conceit of something like this is that I'm not supposed to be so rude as to point out how you are constantly shifting focus and reinventing the argument until it meets some incredibly specific criteria, and that part of that involves such creative gymnastics as completely ignoring basic stats and the player Paul Millsap is in the present day. Forgive me if I am less tolerant of and less impressed with poorly conceived, slippery argument than most.
So I need to teach you the meaning of the word 'context' ... on top of all I've written? Do I need to go through the example of Harden playing out of position as playmaking PG again? What I bolded above, does, in fact, have a certain element of truth. Sorry. Here's the numbers http://hoopdata.com/player.aspx?name=Paul Millsap Millsap's worst PER in career is roughly Patterson's best, and it started in year 1 of his NBA career. Here's a good article on Millsap with regards to all-stars, using all forwards in the NBA, during a year with sample size and Millsap not having to play time at SF. http://saltcityhoops.com/2011/01/is-paul-millsap-an-all-star/
The signposts or arguments haven't been changed. I keep referring to your posts and my original 1st post. In fact, if you read it, all of this has been available for you to peruse on day 1. READING COMPREHENSION PRE-101.
So the rebounds a win for Millsap, the ppg obviously has a correlation with FGA / game which is higher for 2Pat, and shooting % which Millsap is shooting a career low in this year (small sample size + playing out of position for some of his minutes) despite being a 50%+ shooter all career when playing at PF, and if you can't understand that the floor would be much more spaced in Houston vs Utah with Houston taking 25 3pt shots a game vs Utah 18.5, and that the Rockets are playing at a faster pace than Utah which helps offensive stats, then I don't know how I can explain things to you in a way you can understand.
Yeah, no, you're right, internet forums poster mike_lu. How Paul Millsap rebounded a basketball in college is way more probative of how he rebounds a basketball in the NBA, than his past 7 years rebounding a basketball in the NBA. In fact, how dare we look at his body of work as a now veteran NBA player, when we should be focusing on what he did in college instead. This isn't just one of many terrible arguments of yours at all. Often, I will take a break from coloring and finger painting and explain to others how Adam Morrison is not an NBA bust, because he was the college game's leading scorer before he was drafted into the NBA. And then when some grown-up tells me that was college, he was being guarded by a bunch of 19 year-old Communications majors, we're talking about the NBA, what are you damaged, I just tune them out and go right back to finger painting. la la la la la I made a turkey! Look! Gobble gobble!
