[Uh-Oh]Israel and Gaza on the brink of all out WAR

I have doubts on how much groups like Hamas truly values the lives of Palestinian children over its own political power. I think about the way they encourage martyrdom and preach hate and intolerance to the youngsters. So when they lay out the dead bodies of children for display with the purpose of demonizing the other side, its hard for me to not view it as a very cynical act on their part. Hamas can't hope to win based on military strength, so it has to win the propaganda war instead.

I wish Hamas would go away and be replaced by more civilized, diplomatic representatives. But its hard to convince a desperate, angry population to go that route. Every time they go through a conflict like this with Israel the popularity and standing of the "resistance fighters" increases not only amongst Palestinians but throughout the Middle East.

 

There is little doubt that Israel is engaging in genocide against palestinians, I saw it first hand. Israel wants them to go the way of american indians.

Israel wants peace, as long as all the palestinians magically disappear.

Israel does not and will allow for a palestinian state because then it will be harder to justify stealing their land.

Not that the rest of the middle east really cares, they don't really want the palestinians either.

Very sad situation all the way around, and not happy that the USA is involved.

 

A lot of the feigned solidarity in the rest of the Middle East is fake, however. Joint hate against Israel and Jews? Yes. But would they actually accept Palestinian refugees and give them full citizen rights? Nah.

 

Israel has offered Palestine statehood many times. Palestinians don't care about this, they care about Jews not having a state.

 

Uh, yeah.

 

If you read the post, you would have realized I hadn't said anything negative about the Holocaust, yet you decided to respond hysterically.

 

Yes, there is a lot of feigned solidarity..... Muslims, like every other group on Earth, have no problem screwing each other over, or killing each other.

Having said that, I do think that the tide has started to turn against Israel from a global perspective.

 

As it is, the West Bank and Gaza are effectively separate states with very different agendas. Personally I think the PA has a better chance of having a state if they move on without Gaza, at least for now. Since Oslo they've been cooperating with the US on training their security forces, building infrastructure and building a relationship with Israel. It's not perfect, but at least they've been trying.

Israel's ideal situation with Gaza is if the Egyptians just take it back (they've tried), but they know it's unmanageable and Hamas would fight them just the same. The Gulf states have tried to convince Hamas leadership to concentrate on developing their economy and have pointed out that the cost of all that ordinance would be better served building schools, but being the leader of the fight keeps them in the captain's seat.

As it is, Gaza is the #1 excuse for Israel to not give up the West Bank settlements.

I can hear Bibi saying it with visual aids at the UN: "If we leave, just imagine, we'll have TWO Gazas on our hands. We simply can't allow that kind of security threat."

Of course, I don't buy how incentivising civillians to move into suburbs in contested land in a warzone makes people "safer" but that's how it's spun. And it's that insistence that hurts Israel's argument.

So I think if Abbas was brave, he'd call the bluff...but I don't know if he has the political capital to do that. I'm sure there would be rioting...probably worse than the Irish compromise and I'm sure he knows that. Everyone asked for a moderate, western educated Palestinian leadership, and they've had it for years. The world should give it a chance.

I'm all for exerting pressure on Israel to abandon the whole settler enterprise and agree to a state, and I think time is running out. It bothers me how Hamas gets so much attention and support while Abbas is losing credibility.

 

I have been the Israel a half dozen times... I love Israel, it is beautiful and for spiritual reasons is of extreme importance to me.... however the treatment of palestinians by Israel is WRONG. It is also easy to call for peace when you are the one taking what is not yours..... the USA offered peace to the American Indians multiple times as well.

Ultimately this is not going to end well.... Israel is going to be erased from the earth, and you will see genocide, or the palestinians will continue to be picked off and killed off until they are gone.

 

When Abbas is done, his replacement will most definitely not be such a "moderate, western educated, Israeli friendly" candidate. You can rest assure, the longer this Gaza thing drags out, the more and more hard-lined groups will take leadership positions, not only in Gaza, but also in West Bank.

It is a cycle.

 

True, but some actors have been far more responsible than others and they have been the least rewarded for their efforts.

That's not necessarily a bad thing if the world focuses on helping create a Palestinian state rather than pushing Israel into a hyper-defensive pariah.

 

It's like throwing around the n-word in a conversation about race, even if you didn't actually say anything demeaning, and then acting surprised when people react strongly.

 

No, its nothing like that. Quit getting your panties all twisted. Goodness.

 

And I don't think Gaza will have a resolution until the West Bank has one, which is much more achievable.

 

I agree, but do you think Israel has any reason to even touch the West Bank situation until it deals with Gaza? Or at least does Israeli leadership see it the same way as you?

 

You're discussing a sensitive topic with a bunch of people who obviously support Israel and you throw out the Holocaust. You are baiting people to respond just so that you can call them out as being unreasonable.

Actually, maybe it makes sense why you support the Palestinians in all of this...