Lin's scrutiny

Did I miss one hmm my mistake. Can't even remember it.

 

If watch alot basketball, you can Lin handle below average for NBA PG starter. When he speed up his pace his dribble become to high and way too far from his buddy. It's easily poke away. I believe he can easily improve on this through a lot game, but we continue see his pocket get picked.

 

How many times he got picked and how many times he picked opposing guard?

 

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. Maybe you're saying that when Lin picks opposing guards clean (like in the 4th quarter of Grizzlies game), the handle of the opposing guards is not questioned?


In any case, it's worth mentioning in any discussion of turnovers that the whole package should be taken in consideration. In the Wins Produced model by Berri, there is a category of player output that is about the control of possessions. This includes the control or acquisition of possessions (steals and rebounds) and the loss of possessions (turnovers).

Their Wins Produced values are as follows:
-0.034 wins produced for a Turnover
+0.033 wins produced for a Steal
+0.033 wins produced for a Rebound
From: http://wagesofwins.com/how-to-calculate-wins-produced/

In this model, the negative value of one turnover on the win/loss outcome is basically balanced by the positive value of a rebound or steal. They basically cancel each other out; the difference is between -.034 versus .033.

This is one way of explaining why Lin may have a net positive effect on the win/loss outcome of the game despite his turnovers. Indeed, Lin is now 2nd in the league in steals per game so far this season, and is also a good rebounder for a guard.

Lin even had more rebounds than Patterson in the Grizzlies game. That also says something about Patterson as well, and that, aside from Asik, our frontcourt rebounding is weak. Asik's rebounding is all the more impressive when we take into consideration that rebounding is harder when there is not another strong frontcourt teammate who is helping with boxing out opposing rebounders.

 

How does getting steals justify his ball handling

hurhur I don't have to make a shot if I can just block people's shots

 

I don't disagree with the assertion that he needs to tighten his handle although I have seen a lot of improvement in that area. But the vast majority of his TO's thus far aren't a result of his handles but just sloppy passing because of lack of chemistry with his teammates. His TO% thus far is a lot less than what it was last year. (Small sample size of course). With Harden out there handling some of the facilitating duties that will help considerably. But once again you have to put Lin in a position to be successful he shouldn't be standing at the baseline but at the top of the key. He needs space to attack.

 

Great hype comes with great responsibility.

 

It does justify his TOs mathematically speaking, or at least mitigate it, but regardless he still has terrible ball handling. Luckily players doesn't really steal more over their career, while they do decrease TOV% as they get more experienced.

 

Well, even if we roll with the absurd idea that someone can block that many shots, shots and blocks have different Wins Produced values.

0.020 Blocked Shots (BLK)
0.033 Steals (STL)
0.032 Two Point Field Goals Made (2FGM)
0.064 Three Point Field Goals Made (3FGM)

Regardless of whether you accept the Wins Produced model, those numbers are I think consistent with the general consensus that blocked shots are not a good measure of defensive strength and that the impact of a blocked shot does not cancel out a made basket, and that a steal impacts the game more than a blocked shot.

 

You mean scrutiny.

 

Why would you roll with the stupid idea

My point is no matter how many damn steals or pocket picks Lin gets, he still needs to improve his ball handling, having the ability to produce steals doesn't mean you should have sub par ball handing.

 

Why should take seriously something you say? That is indeed a silly thing to do.

If your insight is that Lin should improve his handle, well, duh.
The larger point being made here is that the game is not decided by a single stat like turnovers. Ultimately, it's wins that matter.

 

Take it as you like.

Being irrationally adored doesn't come for free. The same people who went insane over Lin after 10 games are the same ones who will turn on him and lose grip with reality.

 

I was merely responding to the other guy's post trying to justify Lin's ball handling abilities to the number of steals he gets which makes no sense.

TO isn't the only thing that comes from poor ball handling anyway. When you can't protect the ball well as a point guard, it's a lot easier to trap you, it also runs down the shot clock because you can't get to the position to start plays (though right now McHale has no plays), and it also hugely affects your finishing abilities while driving.

 

Also means, by going with whoever's logic of "if you get picked as a PG, you have a bad handle", that the opposing PG's must not have "as good of a handle" as Lin. I think we can all agree that with his "poor dribble", he is a much better playmaker than anyone else on the current roster. Yes, possibly even harden. Harden is a good passer for a shooting guard, but he is not a point guard.

In addition, just because he has these problems of having a "high dribble, and dribble the ball too far outside of his body" these are really more cosmetic assessments of what it should look like. I think people fail to realize that the reason why coaches teach low dribble and keep the ball close to your body (though this is actually arguable) is because they are ways to create space between the defender and the ball.

If Jeremy has success creating space between the defender and the ball, then the "high dribble" has done it's job. Now let's think about it. How many times has his "high dribble" during a drive resulted in him getting his pocket picked? How many times has his "wide dribble away from his body" gotten the ball picked? In fact many times he gets the ball picked is if he's trying to cross in front of him, or he mishandles by running into something (weird right, but ive seen this happen on multiple occasions..not sure why though).

In the end, I could care less about "how he should be dribbling or how loose his dribble is" as long as he knows how to create space with his dribble. I complete agree with the statement of learning to "protect" the ball in terms of being aware of the defender at all times.


Random tidbit - people used to criticize how leandro and wade had a front center crossover (where they start their cross over move at the center of their body, instead of a side) saying how the cross doesn't protect the ball, yada yada yada, yet it was extremely effective for them. Is it fundamental? No. but it works.

 

Lin's finishing ability is the least of his problems. The same goes with his ability to get into position to start the play so clearly his ball handles aren't affecting that.

And liunatic is right some of the times he gets the ball picked is because he runs into somebody. He ran into Marc Gasol on the baseline.

It's an area of that could be improved though that is for sure.

 

Exactly if Lin is able to pick other PGs does that automatically mean they have a bad handle as people say Lin does? From what I see, he just needs to slow down more and also stop trying to go through traffic, which he likes to do too much, because that's where he usually lose the ball.

 

hope they don't try the same stunt again today.