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[Chron] Players: Kubiak is Underrated

Discussion in 'Houston Texans' started by sugrlndkid, Nov 6, 2012.

  1. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    is this what you guys choose to complain about? they are the best team in the conference through mid season, they have only suffered one major injury (cushing) and they have arguably the best offensive (foster) and defensive (watts) players in pro football.

    they got beat by a red hot arron rodgers and i don't think people fully comprehended how much cushing was missed in that game (the game following his injury).

    all their other games have been completely decisive. come on guys, i think mr. kubiak can coach, especially some freakin offense
     
  2. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Member
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    Some people just can't give an inch once they made up their mind.

    On the flip side, I can just see the outrage when on 3rd and 11 from their own 30 yard line, with a 10 point lead, the texans throw a pass to only have it intercepted giving the other team a very short field or worse 7 points.

    Then the cry would be "WTF kubiak!, you have a lead with a top 3 defense, punt the ball and trust your defense!!"
     
  3. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    exactly, i just love the madden coaches. hey when i play madden i'm very aggressive and i just don't understand why 99% of actual nfl coaches aren't aggressive like the guys who play madden in vegas for money.

    these guys don't know football. you're winning, why give up anything, keep the pressure on the other team and don't give them any stupid breaks.

    that's the way you coach when you are rolling out the best damn on the field up and down the roster week to week
     
  4. Nimo

    Nimo Member

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    When you get angry at or hate someone so much, it gets almost impossible to admit it when they prove you wrong or do something good. I think that's what's happening here. Give credit where credit is due.
     
  5. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Member
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    What's even more mind bottling - rezdawg can't even link his issue to any literal evidence that Kubiak's decision is impacting the team. It's all conjecture. They're 7-1; their offense is second in points scored; first (or second?) in TOP; and, statistically, their running game is better than their passing game. Out of (approximately) 560 offensive plays, he's defining a coach that's won 18 of his past 25 games (including playoffs) on 11 plays.

    It's just an odd drum to beat right now.
     
  6. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Member
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    true. Timing is everything. If the case were made during the down years or even after a loss in a game where the texans showed little offensive creativity, then there would certainly have a little more traction from an emotional aspect.
     
  7. ima_drummer2k

    ima_drummer2k Member

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    It was hard for me.

    I was Kubiak's biggest critic 2 years ago. I made rezdawg look like Hey Now!. I thought Kubiak should have been fired and bringing in Wade Phillips was just a publicity stunt by McNair to try and revive the old Luv Ya Blue days. I thought installing the 3-4 in 1 year without a real training camp was a recipe for disaster.

    Worse than any of that, I bought into the theory that Kubiak's main problem was that he didn't yell and scream enough on the sidelines or during his press conferences and that we needed a guy that made more angry faces like Rex Ryan or Bill Cower.

    I said over and over again in 2010 that coaches should be judged on wins and losses only. So I'm sticking with that philosophy. Kubiak has now won 11 of the last 12 games with his 1st string QB starting. Who the hell cares HOW we win as long as we keep on winning.
     
  8. crose

    crose Member
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    Politics in a nutshell.
     
  9. rezdawg

    rezdawg Member

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    Actually, this comment would make sense if we actually had success running the ball on third down. We dont...so your point is worthless here.
     
  10. rezdawg

    rezdawg Member

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    Im not complaining about anything...I made suggestions on what I think Kubiak can do better. Its my ****ing opinion...so Im entitled to not like 100% of everything he does? Is that not okay? Im sorry if I dont suck dick for a living.

    Its my opinion...but Im still just as much on the bandwagon as anyone else here. My mood in life changes with the Texans....that's how attached I am to them.

    Kubiak has the exact same shortcomings pre-Wade as he does post-Wade....I have had the same problems with him. I think he has improved...but we are winning because our defense is all of a sudden something to be reckoned with...in other words, we are winning despite Kubiak's playcalling shortcomings. I dont hate Kubiak at all...go back and check my post history regarding him...I have supported him. And as of right now, I would not want another coach. The players like him, and our offense is solid. I think we could be better though. However, this isnt a case of me not liking Kubiak from the start and wanting to just rail on him for no reason. Until he is the very best, then I think we can look for ways to be better. I dont settle in life, and I dont want the Texans to settle either. I want the Texans to go for the kill every single time they step on the field. I want the Superbowl...every year.

    If we ran the ball effectively on 3rd and long, then I would agree that its to throw the defense off or whatever. But we absolutely suck at it and our offensive line isnt nearly what it was a year ago...we have had almost zero success running the ball on 3rd and long, the statistics prove it. And like Ive said, Kubiak doesnt run to get a first down...his runs are just to be safe and give the ball to the other team. I dont agree with that....Im not being stubborn about it or just trying to hold on to my initial judgment.

    Ive shown that running the ball 11 times has led to 11 punts and 0 points for the Texans.
    Ive also shown that passing the ball 26 times has led to 30 points.
    Ive also shown that the Texans have run the ball on 3rd down as much as 5 other heavyweights in the NFL, combined!


    My point stands....its my ****ing opinion. Just like all you guys have opinions, I have my own. I dont like Kubiak's playcalling at times. If not for Wade, Kubiak would be sitting on the streets right now.

    And Ive asked all you guys that keep chiming in....Donkey, Nimo, HeyNow, Conq, etc...

    If Kubiak isnt perfect, what is his weakness? All you guys are quick to defend him, but when I ask a simple question, you guys run and hide. Instead of moaning and groaning that "oh this guy just cant admit he's wrong?", lets see what you think Kubiak's weakness is. Clearly, there is a weakness...so lets hear it. Ive been stating mine. A couple others have stated theirs...but for you big, tough internet guys, you cant even step up to that simple question.

    But wait, I forgot, we should be on our knees at all times, with Kubiak's pants down at his ankles.
     
  11. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Member
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    Congratulations on proving that scoring is not likely when a team punts the ball. Truly expert analysis.


    I don't even understand what's trying to be proven anymore.

    Kubiak is an underrated coach as the title discloses, and I think that's a pretty fair assessment. He doesn't get a whole lot of credit from fans. Heck, people still say his success is due to Wade.

    We know Kubiak's weakness. At times he can over-think his offensive strategy and get too cute, his time management can be spotty, he's been sub-par at challenging plays and sometimes he falls into a hole in terms of yard production.

    You can argue that him being conservative is a weakness but that's a tough one because being conservative to me falls along the same lines of being risky. Sometimes it pays off and sometimes it doesn't. Inherently, being conservative isn't a bad thing.

    My only contention being made about this silly draw play argument is that running a hand full of draws during a season means absolutely nothing about how good a coach is coaching. You can disagree with the strategy, but the strategy is not inherently wrong. Period. I really don't understand how one can objectively disagree with that. And if you do, then you are disagreeing based on subjectivity and not objectivity.

    A person may not like the idea of running a draw play, and that's fine. But don't try to turn it into anything more than it is. Your personal opinion,and that doesn't mean it's right...even though that may be hard for pride to swallow.
     
  12. rezdawg

    rezdawg Member

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    Apparently, you missed the point. The point is that running the ball has been completely ineffective as far as helping out the offense. If we actually were able to run in an effective manner, then we wouldnt be punting 11 times.

    And that's all Ive said regarding the draw play...I dont like it. Nothing more, nothing less. Im not the one that made a big deal about it, its everyone else that jumped in to try to make a big deal about it. Im allowed to defend my opinion....Im not sure why you guys are trying so hard to make me want to be 100% okay with everything Kubiak does.
     
  13. Nimo

    Nimo Member

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    The Texans do have success running the ball on 3rd down.

    Plus if Matt Schaub was sacked on first down, hit hard as he threw on 2nd down, and the Texans are on their side of the field. It makes more sense to run the ball with Foster who's much fresher at this point and if he doesn't make it. You punt. Just because a team punts doesn't mean the drive is a total failure. Get your o-line some rest or time to change some things to adjust to what the opponent's defence is doing. Your QB gets a breather.
     
  14. rezdawg

    rezdawg Member

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    Oh okay.
     
  15. conquistador#11

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    So you think running the ball on 3rd and long is kubiak 's way to get a first down? While I'm sure kubiak would want to get a first down, that play call is basically saying, "wade, do your thing." while running more clock and preventing a turnover, which is the smart thing to do when you're up multiple scores and have a defense that can be trusted.

    My frustrations with kubiak were taken care off by the nfl ,as all touchdowns and turnovers get automatically reviewed.
     
  16. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Member
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    How has running the ball been ineffective by the texans? :confused: I guess you can look at their yards per carry and say they haven't been good but that doesn't tell the whole story.

    Are you talking about 3rd and longs? If that's the case, then it depends on what you mean by being ineffective. Sure it's not effective at getting a first down, but that's not the point of that play. The point of the play is to not turn the ball over and allow your punter to flip field position.
     
  17. Chef_Monteur

    Chef_Monteur Member

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    The difference is that the championship Rockets could come from behind if they needed to, they proved it over and over again. They played better than any team in the league in the clutch.

    The Texans haven't proven they can play from behind, yet. And I think it's highly unlikely that we will win a SB without ever having to come from behind, no matter how good of a football team you are there will be times where you make a mistake and give the other team a lead.

    We have seen it in the past, Schaub is a much different player when we lose a lead. He starts getting nervous, he starts throwing the ball away when there isn't a defender near him, he gets rattled and then the rest of our team becomes rattled. What I would like to see is a good comeback win for the Texans at some point this season, a character defining win.
     
  18. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Member
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    This is intellectually dishonest. He built an elite offense long before Wade got here; just because he did it sevral years before he wised up and found someone to build an equally elite defense doesn't discount his impact on this current success the team is having.

    They score a lot of points, which gives Wade the freedom to be more aggressive; they lead the league in TOP, which gives Wade's players and coaches a chance to rest, study, gameplan; they very often control field position and they rarely shorten the field with turnovers. We watched Kubiak coach himself into knots trying to side-step an historically bad defense in 2010. Don't think Wade's defense wouldn't look appreciably better if he had to coach with... Jacksonville's offense.

    This is SOP for haters; continually readjusting the standard; never satisfied. It seems like an awfully sad way to "cheer" for a team.

    So what? What impact is it having? You can't qualify it; it's all conjecture.

    You're quickly running from troll to flat-out desperate with this kind of flaccid drivel. Almost every response to you has been very reasoned; no one is suggesting he's above reproach; just that you've chosen an utterly silly thing to focus on at a remarkably bad time. You can not neatly place 18 of 25 aside and pretend that this teeny, tiny little piece of an otherwise machine is somehow detrimental.

    People have repeatedly listed shortcomings: he drives me bonkers every time he kicks a FG on fourth and short in opponent territory. But even on *this* - I can cite examples of him passing on the FG.

    And I see that others have jumped in and listed items, too. So you turn: since there is no empirical evidence that 3rd-and-long runs plays are costing the Texans, will you admit that maybe, just maybe, you're too busy searching for a needle in a haystack to realize that there's a really good NFL head coach in the barn?
     
  19. crose

    crose Member
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    So, completely curb-stomping the only other logical AFC challenger at the time, on the heels of a total national TV embarrassment against the Packers, wasn't character defining?
     
  20. Chef_Monteur

    Chef_Monteur Member

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    No, it mostly confirmed what we already knew about the Texans. They're an explosive football team that is prone to getting off to fast starts and more than capable of blowing any team off the field, especially at home.

    That's good, but what happens if we play New England in the playoffs and go down by two touchdowns early? How will the team respond to that? What kind of character does this team have? We still don't know yet.
     

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