True, but is an appropriate comment in light of comments such as: If you were once two cells, you were also once sperm... and egg!
What does that have to do with anything? Some of us have been here long enough to not care about reputation. Do you have a problem with the word masturbation, or can you really not see how it fits in here?
Sorry that you continue to get mostly a bunch of smart-ass responses. People don't want to face the reality of what they are advocating it would appear....
Wow....all your pictures and arguments have totally changed my mind...mostly because I've never heard or seen any of them before.
$75 more to Planned Parenthood in your name! Because of you a woman's right to choice is a little safer.
Not all the skin cells you shed are dead bud. Neither is the sperm you throw away everytime you have sex not intended for pregnancy.
I'll start with my own feelings. I don't agree with abortion and what I mean by that is if I get a girl pregnant, it is not an option for me and I would not suggest it to anybody. If it was an option she would consider then I would not necessarily agree but would support her decision or anybody who makes that decision. The funny thing to me when talking about abortion is that these same people who sit here and speak out against abortion are the same ones who would get upset when many of these expectant mothers began to ask for public assistance with medical bills, feeding, housing, care, and other necessities of having the child. These are also people who fight against free contraception such a birth control pills, patches and condoms, things which reduce pregnancy for sexually active people. There are anti-abortion groups out there who trick women into coming into their clinics and talking them out of getting abortions by presenting them pro-life literature, showing them videos of abortions and promising them plenty of help if the opt out of abortion. Once they have talked them out of the abortion and the mother passes the timeline at which she can have an abortion they, along with their promised assistance, abandon the mother. The documentary 12th and Delaware showcased the debate on both sides and at the end presented an expectant teenage mother who was talked out of the abortion, promised the help and was abandoned. She began doing things like lifting heavy objects and participating in activities to attempt to induce a miscarriage. The vast majority of abortions (78%) are women who have had 1-2 procedures, it is not the perpetuated myth of preferred birth control by the masses who do it. I'm also willing to bet that very few people actually want to do it and it is a very tough decision for most. And please save me the the argument that there are parents out there ready and willing to adopt the babies once they are born. There are currently over 100,000 children waiting to be adopted in the U.S. and out of those 30% are 3 and under, the preferred adoption ages for adopting couples and 50% of them entered foster care at that age range. If there are so many couples and families waiting to adopt there shouldn't be any waiting. To add on to that these same people as mentioned above want to take away adopting rights from certain types of people further limiting where these children can go and many families simply go overseas because the adoption process is a lot easier and there are even more children there that need homes. So I don't support abortion but I don't vilify those who do choose that course.
Long, unwinnable wars based on lies and dated paranoia didn't end in the '70s, you should have known the abortion debate wasn't going to either.
I like IzakDavid's threads. Even though I don't agree with many of his views, for the most part he seems honestly interested in discussion. Regardless of the legal definition, I think that ending a life against the will of the victim is murder. Examples: Breaking into someone's house and shooting him in the face with a gun: murder. Shooting someone who pulls a gun on you: murder. Dropping a bomb on a population of people: murder. Hunting for food: murder. Administering the Death Penalty: murder. Putting down Old Yeller: murder. Stepping on a spider: murder. The criteria is easy. (1) did the will to live exist? (2) did you take the life anyway? If you answered yes to both, you've committed murder. When the fetus is aborted after it develops the will to live. I don't know when that is. You don't either. This is where the debate starts to ring hollow for me: When you try to step on a spider, it runs like hell to save it's life. When you put down Old Yeller, it begs you with its sad puppy dog eyes not to. Deer continue to run with arrows sticking out of their chests and end up as decoration on my wall. People cower in their homes and get bombed anyway. In all these situations, the victim demonstrates a sentient will to live, but its life is taken anyway. Murder is committed, nobody bats an eye. How is this any less cruel? If the argument is that life at two cells is just as valuable as birthed body, then why aren't there cries for all the smushed spiders? WHO WILL SAVE THE SMUSHED SPIDERS?!!! Because we've already stratified life. This piss party is over which caste to put a fetus life into. Does it go with the spider caste, where we can murder it and not feel bad? Does it go with the sad puppy caste, where we can murder it, but feel a little bad and get over it tomorrow? Does it go with the war and death penalty caste, where we debate the morality forever but ultimately allow it? Or does it go with killing the innocent, where we do not allow it, and hold a grudge until our hair turns grey and we get old and wrinkly? Whether you're pro-life or pro-choice, you've already subscribed to these castes. You've already internalized, for the rationalization of your choice (Bible says animals have no souls, Darwin says survival of the fittest), that life A is more valuable than life B, and the murder of life A bears punishment, while the murder of life B bears none or is even encouraged. We are all of the same sh!te bucket. We are all hypocrites. We are all scum. So, in my opinion, the outrage over doing the same for a fetus is nothing more than grandstanding. It's so that you can feel good about yourself as a "moral" person and pat yourself on the back for sticking up for something without a voice, while ignoring or even condoning the deaths of other voice-less victims. I don't believe that those who choose abortion escape taking responsibility for their choices. The day will come when they will have to answer to their God for their behavior, and He will pass judgement. Not you, not me, not a jury of our peers, not Pastor Mike or Rabbi Ezekiel or Imam Habibi. I do believe that you must be prepared to bear the costs of your choices, such as pregnancy if you choose to have sex, and that you have to stand by your decisions. When you do decide to have sex and possibly bear children, then the edification of your children is also your responsibility, not society's. You must teach them that they are not to derive their morality from the rule of law, because that's a pretty low bar. Whether abortion is legal or not, nothing is stopping you from teaching your kids that actions have consequences: emotional, spiritual, financial and social consequences. Yes. It is not ours to allow or disallow. We don't know the circumstances and to uniformly disallow can constitute Cruel and Unusual Punishment. We don't object to attempting to terminate life in these cases: case1, case 2, case 3, case 4. In each of those cases life can be sustained, or the remote possibility of life exists. The decision to terminate is equally clinical. I believe that anybody that terminates a healthy 9 month fetus will suffer torment greater than anything that can be imposed on her by society. too long post is too long.
Man, committing genocide against all the bacteria on your hands every time you wash them must really suck.
I do. I've killed spiders, clearly. The example is not to be sanctimonious. The spider's existence posed no threat. My quality of life wouldn't suffer if I let it live. I don't risk financial, emotional, spiritual or physical ruin. All my possessions will remain as they are whether the spider lives or dies. By all accounts, it's as innocent of wrongdoing as a fetus, and the choice to let it live bears exponentially less burden on my life. So I killed it, just because, as many other people do. And the taking of this life is OK to us, because it's worth less to us. But there is no justification to make it "right."
I feel the same way. Bacteria aren't sentient beings capable of feeling pain so let's not go that far. I don't avoid killing every living thing I see but I don't think because something is small and relatively insignificant, like a bug, I can squish out it's life just cause. I'll kill any spider at a moments notice though, all spiders deserve to die.
agony. but that's the point, these "atrocities" are committed by the second. how we choose which ones are acceptable and which ones aren't is arbitrary.
To me, the question of abortion shouldn't really be talked about until the country can actually support unwanted children by giving them at least a decent life. I would love for all babies in the US to be born if they all eventually get a chance to be brought up in a good environment into adulthood. But if the current political platform is all about "every person for himself" and getting rid of supposed moochers, unwanted babies should be the first thing this country needs to rid herself of.
Where the hell are these children? There are no shortage of older children for adoption. There are no shortages of handicapped/special needs children for adoption. There is a shortage of healthy babies to families that want them.
