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Are you better off now than 2 years ago?

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by BornTexan, Sep 16, 2012.

  1. Haymitch

    Haymitch Custom Title

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    I am doing better than 2 years ago, but I just got my Bachelor's 2 years ago so that's not saying much. And I don't vote because I like to think of myself as a good person.

    "But not only is [being active in government] irrational and ineffectual, it is also harmful. It is harmful because enlightened, good, and honest people by entering the ranks of the government give it a moral authority which but for them it would not possess. If the government were made up entirely of that coarse element – the violators, self-seekers, and flatterers – who form its core, it could not continue to exist. The fact that honest and enlightened people are found who participate in the affairs of the government gives government whatever it possesses of moral prestige." - Leo Tolstoy

    He continues:

    "That is one evil resulting from the activity of Liberals who participate in the affairs of government, or who come to terms with it. Another evil of such activity is that, in order to secure opportunities to carry on their work, these highly enlightened and honest people have to begin to compromise, and so, little by little, come to consider that, for a good end, one may swerve somewhat from truth in word and deed. For instance, that one may, though not believing in the established Church, go through its ceremonies; may take oaths; and may, when necessary for the success of some affair, present petitions couched in language which is untrue and offensive to man's natural dignity: may enter the army; may take part in a local government which has been stripped of all its powers; may serve as a master or a professor, teaching not what one considers necessary oneself, but what one is told to preach by government; and that one may even become a Zemsky Nachalnik, submitting to governmental demands and instructions which violate one's conscience; may edit newspapers and periodicals, remaining silent about what ought to be mentioned, and printing what one is ordered to print; and entering into these compromises – the limits of which cannot be foreseen – enlightened and honest people (who alone could form some barrier to the infringements of human liberty by the government, imperceptibly retreating ever farther and farther from the demands of conscience) fall at last into a position of complete dependency on government. They receive rewards and salaries from it, and, continuing to imagine they are forwarding liberal ideas, they become the humble servants and supporters of the very order against which they set out to fight."

    Read the whole thing. A Letter to Liberals by Leo Tolstoy
     
    #61 Haymitch, Sep 17, 2012
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2012
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  2. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    You make more than me, if that's worth anything.

    2 more percentage points at 100k is substantial, though reasonable with the hours you pull
     
  3. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

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    I like the sentiment of this post. I wish my life were as idyllic as the one you paint here. Though I am an artist (and a devoted partner to my dearest love and a best pal to my dog and cats and a man blessed with many dear friends), I am most times more than any of that a manic depressive with a crappy brand of mania (mostly rage, almost never bliss). And I am a nihilist that is at almost all times at least half suicidal. So I miss out a lot on the 'beauty of life' and I have trouble with the notion of 'shattering ignorance.' I believe all is pretty much nonsense and all people are ignorant in all things, especially me. Were ignorance to be shattered, what would take its place? The Negredo, I expect.

    I just came from a meeting of my board of directors in which the president asked us to do an exercise asking why we were involved with the organization and it was implicit that I was to answer why I make plays or why I make the kind of plays that I do or whatever and I was like, I couldn't ever answer that question and don't ask me that. If I knew why I made art, I'd have to stop doing it. Like Elliott Smith sang, "I'd be cranking out the product, just a total waste."

    I get the idea from the posts of yours I've read that you seem to have it all figured out. I'm not trying to be insulting when I say that -- that's just how it seems to me. That's a way to be, I guess. It's not a way I could ever be, because I'm too confused and upset over the whole thing. But it's a way to be.

    On another topic, I especially liked one line in your post about paying bills being a necessity. It reminded me of one of my favorite quotes, from the late Herman Brood, at various times on the subjects of speed, sex and football (soccer):

    "It's not important, it just has to be there."
     
  4. BornTexan

    BornTexan Rookie

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    Sorry to hear about your son's medical condition. Are your son's medical bills covered by your health insurance? I know health care is really a grave burden because I went to hospital for my gallstones situation recently. The bills are just appalling, which I think are well over 100k in total. If I hadn't bought the health insurance 100% percent coverage with no deductibles, I would probably have been on the brink of bankrupcy. The cost for my situation in other countries is just a small proportion of mine.

    Hope your son get well soon.
     
  5. BornTexan

    BornTexan Rookie

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    No offense but I think you lived too well and too easy during your childhood, thus forget to appreciate the small pieces of happiness in mundane life. I came out of a poor family who simply do not know how to protect their young, vulnerable offsprings and a vicious neighborhood, but one family member did encourage me to do my best in academics and get a higher education. Obviously I complain too and it's not a strange concept to commit suicide, but I think I am now far far away from my barbaric childhood. I just think out loud that **** you all you can not bully me anymore I am much better than you now, plus I have my own young ones to protect and raise properly, which makes myself moving forward.
     
  6. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

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    I don't bear you any ill will and I am sorry for your struggles, but it doesn't seem like you know what manic depression is. In case you're interested you can read about it on wikipedia.

    Also, I said my family had a lot of money when I was a teenager. Before that I lived with a single, working, struggling mother and two brothers. And after I was a teenager the money was gone again. If you're saying I'm spoiled, well, how can you say "no offense?"

    Incidentally, as you might learn on wikipedia, one doesn't develop bipolar disorder type 1 by being spoiled.
     
  7. BornTexan

    BornTexan Rookie

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    Well I sympathize with you and I am not trying to compete with you on misery. I hope you get proper treatment and get well.
     
  8. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    I suspect if ignorance were shattered, worldwide pain would take its place. Pain on what we inflict on others, on ourselves, and on living things. There could be knowledge of the Darkness, but even if we were all inside one self contained snowglobe, it makes the life there is in the here and now even more unique.
     
  9. BornTexan

    BornTexan Rookie

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    Sometimes a blissful pig is better than a thoughtful saint. The most profound philosophy about life lies in the simplest form. That's what Lao tzu says:grin:

    Batman Jones could read a little on that, it might make him feel much better.
     
  10. dandorotik

    dandorotik Member

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    This is incorrect- nice try, though.

    How can you compare a combined 2 tenures (Reagan, Clinton), with a 1 tenure President (HW Bush, Obama to-date)? You have to analyze each tenure separately.

    Also, this is based on January of the President's 1st year... that is incorrect- a President does not take office until January 21st- therefore, you either have to use the number on the date at which the President entered (which they don't keep stats for), or round it to the closest month- since it's the 21st, that would round to February of 2009.

    In February of 2009, UE was 8.3%.

    In May of 2012, UE was 8.2%.

    Now, it's 8.1%.

    That's a gain.

    Accurate Facts

    Beat

    Distorted

    Facts

    E.S.T.
     
  11. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

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    I promise you that you are not qualified to give me good advice.
     
  12. dandorotik

    dandorotik Member

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    For the past 8 tenures, here's how they rank in terms of UE when they started and UE by the end of their 4th year:

    1. Reagan 2
    2. Clinton 2
    3. Clinton 1
    4. Obama 1
    5. Reagan 1
    6. Bush 1
    7. Bush 2
    8. HW Bush 1

    http://www.miseryindex.us/
     
  13. napalm06

    napalm06 Huge Flopping Fan

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    It's interesting how fans of either candidate can make the facts say essentially whatever they want them to.
     
  14. BornTexan

    BornTexan Rookie

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    Your call mister, can't do anything about that. No regrets.
     
  15. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

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    If it were my call I wouldn't have bipolar. But thanks for telling me which book I should read so I could cheer up.
     
    #75 Batman Jones, Sep 18, 2012
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2012
  16. rimbaud

    rimbaud Member
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    I am doing well but I was doing well two years ago. Financially have more I suppose but also have more expenses because of kids and ageing parents. So life feels about the same as far as money goes.

    It is because of my wife, though. My career is stable and I make more money now than two years ago but it is still an insultingly low number for someone of my skillset and quality. The arts don't pay, though. I do it for "love" ha!
     
  17. GladiatoRowdy

    GladiatoRowdy Member

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    No kidding, I haven't had a single raise in the last 10 years save the ones I got from changing jobs. The OP should count himself lucky to have a job that gives raises as significant as the ones he has received.
     
  18. GladiatoRowdy

    GladiatoRowdy Member

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    You put $12k per year into an IRA and call that "no savings?"

    Why don't you try "getting by" on the median household income sometime, your b****ing about how you "barely" get by is nothing compared to what most Americans are experiencing. The median income in this country went down while the very wealthy saw HUGE gains, forgive me if I just don't have empathy for the upper middle class guy whose taxes wouldn't go up if Obama had his preferred tax policy.

    You have it MUCH better than most Americans, show some gratitude.
     
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  19. Air Langhi

    Air Langhi Contributing Member

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    Isn't the limit for Roth IRA 5 grand?
     
  20. Steve_Francis_rules

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    A drop in the unemployment rate is not the same as a net increase in jobs. You're leaving out labor force participation, which is now down to 30-year lows.
     
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