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2012 Presidential Election: Romney vs. Obama

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by rimrocker, Apr 11, 2012.

  1. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    does Romney have a plan for anything other than to repeal everything Obama has accomplished?
     
  2. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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    fair enough, but Romney had proposals for Medicare long before Ryan joined the ticket
     
  3. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Yes. __________
     
  4. mc mark

    mc mark Member

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    Funny, he's never mentioned them before.
     
  5. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    Of course, but why can't he tell us what it is? I guess it's our January surprise!
     
  6. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    He has. Your news sources apparently just have not provided you with that information for some reason. Here are links to Romney's plans for Medicare, spending and tax reform.

    Of course there is exactly zero chance that you or any of your fellow lefties around here will agree with his plans. But at least he does have plans that he has published.

    So, I have answered your question. How about you answer a similar question from me? What will Obama do during a second term that is different from what he has done during his current term to reform entitlements and balance the budget?

    As far as I can tell, Obama has no serious plans for dealing with any of the serious issues our country faces. Feel free to prove me wrong, if you can, but the only answer I am really expecting from you on the above questions (for obvious reasons) is:

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
     
  7. FranchiseBlade

    Supporting Member

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    Well the idea of cutting spending now is stupid. Interest rates are at a low, and the economy is sluggish to say the least. Now is when it's cheap to borrow and spend money. It would also be good for the economy. Now is the time to do that.

    As to cutting and reforming entitlements I hope he does more of what he did during his first term. Where he cut waste from programs like Medicare. Of course when he did cut that waste out the GOP jumped on him for cutting medicare. It was part of the Affordable Health Care Act which the GOP also lashed out against.

    Obama has proposed 72 Billion in cuts to medicaid, 248 Billion in cuts to medicare, and has had Socical security benefits up for cuts since 2008. Guess who blocked it because he also had some higher tax revenue plans all of which would have helped reduce the deficit.

    So hopefully he continues to cut waste, and works to help reduce our deficit in such positive ways. I also hope he'll have a more cooperative GOP who are willing to actually do that work.
     
  8. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Obama never had any intention of cutting spending on any of those programs, as you very well know. He agrees with you that cutting spending is stupid.

    What I am asking for is a link to a published reform plan for balancing the budget and reforming Medicare. You have not provided it because it does not exist.
     
  9. FranchiseBlade

    Supporting Member

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    Not only did intend to cut spending in those programs, he did already actually cut money out of Medicare. You can look at any of the proposals he made during the debt ceiling debate. All the GOP had to do was agree, and that money would have been cut from the programs.

    They didn't agree.
     
  10. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    The idea that Obama is an advocate of material spending cuts is beyond preposterous. That anyone would even propose such a thing is absurd to the maximum possible degree.

    According to you, Obama has already done all he is going to do and has still not solved the Medicare problem. Even Obama admits that Medicare is still in need of major reform, by the way. So, what good is the guy? It looks like this is probably a good time to give someone else a try.

    We have run deficits over $1 trillion dollars every year Obama has been in office. He is clearly against cutting spending. Obama's so-called budget proposals have been voted down consistently on a virtually unanimous basis, because they are so irresponsible. And the Senate (Controlled by the Democrats under Harry Reid) has refused to debate a budget for over three years, much less pass one, as they do not want their spending priorities to be documented and voted on in the light of day.

    Both Obama and the Democrats have complained loudly that Republicans have been obstructing his agenda. "What agenda is that?" you might ask. The left complains that their $1 trillion "stimulus" program did not work as expected because "it was not nearly big enough." According to their leading thinkers, it needed to be at least triple the size that it was. Also, Obama and the Dems have wanted to bail out the states, especially the public unions in the states, and even did so to a limited degree before the the House switched hands in January 2011 (which was substantially attributable to a backlash against the bailouts and crony capitalism in Obamacare). Bailing out the states to the full extent that Obama and the Dems would have liked would have surely cost another trillion at least, and probably quite a lot more than that.

    Also, does anyone doubt that Obama would want to kick in a trillion or two to Europe to help try and "stimulate" them out of the Euro Crisis if he could get away with it? And of course there is the global warming agenda led by the UN, which has announced an international redistribution of wealth plan (which is it's response to global warming) with an initial kitty of $100 billion, largely funded by the US, which Obama signed the US on to during their follow-up meeting in Cancun. And rest assured, that is just for openers. Ultimately, this amount will be in the trillions, if Obama and the global warming crowd get their way. And how much will the climate be altered by that program? None. Absolutely none.

    Even as we speak, Obama's campaign consists of flying around the country, announcing handouts and giveaways to groups that he feels the need to curry favor with, such as his proposal to sustain the ethanol-gasoline blend mandate, expanding that program during a time of rising prices and scarce corn supplies by adding sorghum to the subsidy list. Also, Obama has proposed having the federal government buy livestock that ranchers are culling from their herds (in large numbers, all right now) due to the spiking corn prices, which is driving down meat prices. He wants these people's votes and he has not been shy about spending billions of tax dollars (actually borrowed money) to try and win them. And there are many more examples like these.

    If Obama has any current published proposals for balancing the budget or reforming Medicare during a second term, feel free to provide a link to them. Until they materialize, they will be regarded as non-existent, which of course they are.
     
  11. GladiatoRowdy

    GladiatoRowdy Member

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    You have bought so many lies that it is truly sad...

    That idea came about when Obama and the Democrats agreed to substantial cuts during several rounds of talks. The GOP refused all of these cuts because the proposals included tax increases, which the GOP is ideologically opposed to even though they would help reduce the deficit.

    Obama definitely tried to do a lot, but when the opposition party is opposed to anything and everything you propose, no matter how reasonable, it doesn't make me want to put those obstructionist SOBs in office, it makes me want to give Obama a Congress that might work WITH him to get things done.

    Have you actually looked to see where those deficits come from? Let me give you a hint, tax cuts, wars, the financial crisis, and Medicare Part D are the four biggest drivers of the deficit.

    No, the proposals put out by Republicans who claim that they represent Obama's budget proposals have been voted down because they are irresponsible. Obama's budget proposals haven't been voted on, no matter what liars you believe on this subject.

    The Senate Republicans have blocked every attempt to pass a budget through unprecedented use of the filibuster.

    And would have put many more people to work, could have helped modernize our crumbling infrastructure, and would definitely have helped improve the economy. Unfortunately, the GOP don't want more people at work and don't want the economy to improve because their primary goal is to make Obama a one term president.

    Given the historically low borrowing costs, if there were a time to borrow in order to improve the economy and complete more infrastructure projects, it is definitely now.

    Nice conspiracy theories, let me know when you remove your tinfoil cap.

    Unfortunately, they are examples that only exist in the minds of people who listen to liars.

    If you actually think that Obama has not put out a plan, then it is clear evidence of your willingness to believe liars. Here is an article from almost a year ago...

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/19/obama-deficit-plan-buffet-rule-taxes-medicare_n_969403.html
     
  12. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    And after all that, Obama's current plan for what he would do to balance the budget and reform Medicare is still nowhere to be found.

    Why? He does not have one.

    Case closed.
     
  13. FranchiseBlade

    Supporting Member

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    It's odd that you are holding one side to a much higher standard. One side (Obama) has proposed spending cuts to the entitlement programs I mentioned earlier. Obama has successfully already cut some waste out of Medicare spending. Obama did that over the fact Republicans were trying to stop him.

    That's what Obama has done. The cuts Obama proposed weren't rejected because Obama didn't really want them. They were rejected because the Republicans were unable to work together to reduce the deficit.

    The fault with that isn't Obama's.
     
  14. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Yes, we know. Nothing is ever Obama's fault. Never. And anyone who dare suggest otherwise must be a racist.

    Obama is an empty suit and a political hack who provided no leadership on this issue and whose only cuts to Medicare were the $716 Billion hacked out of it to pay for Obamacare, your statements to the contrary notwithstanding.
     
  15. GladiatoRowdy

    GladiatoRowdy Member

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    Apparently, you chose not to click on the link I provided. Go back to your liars, they will tell you what you want to hear.
     
  16. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    I saw it. The Huffington Post link. I thought you surely you could not be serious. This was all in Obama's most recent budget proposal that was so ridiculous and irresponsible that even the Democrats refused to back it. The only people that pushed to bring this silly political prop up for a vote were the Republicans. It was shot down unanimously in both the House and Senate, which obviously included ALL Democrats.

    But my question was not about Obama's unanimously rejected budget proposals from days gone by. It is about Obama's proposals for what he would do differently during a second term to balance the budget and reform Medicare.

    And still all we have from you is the typical leftist petulance and name calling. No current plan from Obama for a second term. None. Zip. Nada.

    So, I will say it again. Obama's current plan for what he would do to balance the budget and reform Medicare is still nowhere to be found. Why? He does not have one. Case closed.
     
  17. GladiatoRowdy

    GladiatoRowdy Member

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    You're right that the political prop brought up by the GOP was shot down unanimously BECAUSE IT DIDN'T REFLECT THE PRESIDENT'S PLAN!

    Your question was answered at the link, I'm sorry that you chose not to consider it, but that is your choice.

    I provided the plan and never called YOU a name at all. I told you to go back to listening to the liars who apparently contribute to your opinion. They will continue to tell you what you want to hear, regardless of the facts.

    Your choice to ignore the president's plan is your choice, but it is still ignoring reality.
     
  18. FranchiseBlade

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    I disagree with plenty that Obama has done, and I never once called you a racist for disagreeing. Why are you so defensive about that?

    So you admit Obama already cut waste out of Medicare.

    What I find odd is that you tend to blame the person who's already cut some out of medicare, proposed more cuts for medicare, as well as cuts for medicaid, and social security, rather than the group that rejected those cuts.

    Then you blame the person who proposed the cuts rather than the people who rejected them because the cuts weren't accepted.

    The way you are going about assigning blame is odd and nonsensical.

    I'm going to blame the group that refused to pass the cuts to medicare, medicaid, social security, in addition to blocking tax hikes all of which would help with the problem of the deficit.

    Instead you are supporting the party that passed the tax cuts, and started the wars that are driving the deficit and blocked the proposed cuts to medicare, medicaid, and social security.

    It's very odd.
     
  19. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Mojo how is the fight against global warming and evolution going? Feel like you have your thumb in a dike?
     
  20. QdoubleA

    QdoubleA Member

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    Gladiator- Here is the presidents plan
    Mojo- Nope, not there, don't see it
    Gladiator- But...well ok, here it is again
    Mojo- Nope, doesn't exist
    Gladiator- But I've showed it to you twice
    Mojo- LALALALALALALALALA can't hear you LALALALALALA
     

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