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Jeremy Lin's upside

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by meh, Jul 20, 2012.

  1. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    Well, yes, that is my point exactly: we don't require a 'sample size' of nba games to proclaim potential or even inevitable greatness on the part of certain black or european athletes--it fits the stereotype, ie cognitive categories that most of us hold.

    In fact, we are often confused when these players DON'T pan out: ie Darryl Dawkins, or the entire string of 'baby jordans,' as well as 80-90% of all black and european draft picks (Milicic among countless others). Again, it's because these are DISCONFIRMING examples which we need a HUGE number of to eliminate existing conceptual categories.

     
  2. roxxy

    roxxy Member

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    This pretty much. Although he does say and do some highly questionable things that imply that he is also ignorant himself. He has used racially charged lingo like"put you back in your place" and he more often than not always defends the black athlete, he has said as much himself many times on national television or on twitter.

    An element of it as well is that in the NBA they look at you and compare you to a player subconsciously. For example if you are a white guard it is Nash. If you are an asian guard it is a lot more difficult to make a comparison.
    Fortunately for future prospects Jeremy Lin could become the next basis of comparison.
     
  3. roxxy

    roxxy Member

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    I agree. And I feel sorry for him.
     
  4. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    I didn't say it was correct or incorrect, I assumed it was hypothetically for the sake of argument. As in "if this is true, then..." Personally speaking, I like to be optimistic about the rockets picks, although historically, mid first rounders tend to have unremarkable careers.
     
  5. Arthurprescott2

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    basic English 101: "good if not great" (in my post) means "at the very least good and quite possibly great" ;)
     
  6. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    This has happened countless times: stereotypical depictions of women and minorities are easy to digest and swallow--they also reinforce specific political agenda. It's happened countless times: go check out the rush hour movies: nothing but racial insults and stereotypes. The examples are endless: Stephen A is likely being used to promote a racist agenda, but Stephen A likes being on TV so....

     
  7. redlawn

    redlawn Member

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    Absolutely.

    He has made comments that ****** and chink are not the same; that one is a word born out of hatred and that the other can be justifiably used.

    He has said that it is blasphemous for anyone to suggest that Lin can play.

    He has said that Lin is at best an average marginal player, during the height of Linsanity, when he himself had probably seen no more than a handful of his games.

    He has tried to label Lin as a selfish, money grubbing, individual solely looking out for himself.

    Undoubtedly, there's more. I just have better things to do with my life.
     
  8. Arthurprescott2

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    More to the point - I've never said that there is no racism or cognitive dissonance in the media and more specifically on this board. Obviously there is. But unless you actually saw a specific poster here exhibit such it is patently unfair and condescending to presume such of any one member. THAT is the point I was making.
     
  9. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    LOL, no one is going to attack you for your evaluations whether optimistic or conservative. :)

    What I look for is evidence one way or the other. The preponderance of evidence, along with the clear and consistent application of criteria for evaluation of evidence, wins.

    On top of that we can agree that there is an emotional component to our reactions as wel: if you look at the attendees at MSG most were not Asian, yet they were wildly supportive of Lin. Why? There are lots of reasons, but suffice to say, we can acknowledge that we ahve emotional reactions which color our supposedly objective evaluations whether we acknowledge this or not.
     
  10. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    Racism is not as transparent as that. Racism takes behavioral, cognitive, symbolic forms, and it also exists as a phantom and mist deeply buried in our unconscious. This requires some acknowledgement of the unconscious in the first place and of how it manipulates our conscious mind, and not everyone is willing to explore this territory either personally or analytically.
     
  11. roxxy

    roxxy Member

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    The race card goes both ways though. If you look at LBJ for example, everyone talks about his athleticism and how he is a freight train but he also has a ridiculously high BBIQ. Look at Lin and Tebow everyone puts focus and hypes up there faith when there are guys like KD and Wade who are also very religious. Lamb is also very religious as well but I doubt the media will focus on his faith as well. Yes Lin's race has been a hindrance in some cases but at the same time it has also helped him. A certain amount of the media focus was on him because he was the first asian american baller. I see Lin on NBA.com sometimes for the randomest things and I roll my eyes. He got a shoe deal from Nike even though he was undrafted does that happen often with undrafted non-asian players? (this is a sincere question) I don't believe the contract he got had anything to do with his marketability to be honest, I actually think it is a ridiculously fair contract and could prove to be a steal as he develops.
     
  12. roxxy

    roxxy Member

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    Oh I know. The hangover with the short, skinny overly sexual asian man. It is bad it was during the whole Linsanity thing that CNN had a speaker who brought this same example up as a stereotype of asian males and I was like wow I never noticed that I am such a terrible person.
     
  13. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    As one quick example social psychologists have studied social space: whether we stand closely to or far away from, strangers based upon factors such as race. Few people would acknowledge that they are racist, but many of us will stand farther away from individuals of a certain racial group than others.

    It's also clear in residential patterns: few of us want to acknowledge that we are racist, but most of us do not want to live in predominantly black neighborhoods, even middle class black neighborhoods with high property values.

    We see it in dating patterns, and in all walks of life, really. There is a strong disconnect between our professed beliefs and our actual day to day behavior, in regards to race.
     
  14. Arthurprescott2

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    OBVIOUSLY! YOU CONDESCENDING PRICK. But that does NOT make it alright to attack/lecture someone assuming that they are in some form or another racist.
     
  15. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    "Two inches of pain." It's endless. Race fundamentally structures how we think, feel and behave. But we are loathe to admit it.
     
  16. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    We are all racist, including myself, by dint of the fact that we participate, live in, are affected by a worldwide racist culture. We have the choice of acknowledging that reality and then work to change it, or we can bury our heads in the sand about it, which leaves the existing structure of racism in place.
     
  17. roxxy

    roxxy Member

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    Yes but he also frequently goes off on other players before Lin. He goes off on Kwame Brown. He went hard against Danillo Gallinari to the point where I was shocked of the Denver Nuggets to defend Carmelo Anthony. He did a similar thing to Yao. The things he said about Lin have a lot to do with Carmelo to be honest. I don't think he actually believes what he says and I think he just does it to garner eyeballs. SAS is ignorant but I wouldn't say he is racist. Also he plays that loud rowdy african american bit to a fault which parallels the white more quiet Skip Bayless. That is the media for you.
     
  18. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    No one attacked you. I don't even know you and am not in your physical proximity, so attack is impossible.

    I am incapable of lecturing you. You can choose to read my posts or ignore them. You chose to read them of your own volition, which is quite different than being subject to a lecture.
     
  19. Arthurprescott2

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    Umm... I was just standing up for ch0kob0freak. You surely did not attack me.
     
  20. redlawn

    redlawn Member

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    Great insight, especially that last sentence.
     

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