I am just copying and pasting this from another forum but the OP did a real good job of putting the numbers together. http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=494334 Larry Fitzgerald 405 Receptions (668 Targets), 5,776 Yards (14.3 Y/R), 48 TDs, 255 First Downs (63%), 14 Drops 1,781 Yards after Catch (4.4 Y/R), 42 Broken Tackles, 2 Fumbles, 71 Catches 20+ Yards, 14 Catches 40+ Yards 60.6% Catch Rate, 3.3% Drop Rate, 24.5% Target Rate, 10.4% Broken Tackle Rate, 8.6 Y/T, .072 TDs/T 70 Games (100%), 4,400 Snaps (98%), 2,728 Routes Ran (2.1 Y/RR, 6.7 RR/R), 11 Penalties, 4x Pro Bowl, 3x All-Pro Playoffs: 6 Games 42 Receptions (56 Targets), 705 Yards, 9 TDs, 1 Drop, 75% Catch Rate, 2.3% Drop Rate Per Game Average: 7 Receptions (9.3 Targets), 118 Yards, 1.5 TDs, .2 Drops Stat Averages: Per Season: 93 Receptions (153 Targets), 1,320 Yards, 11 TDs, 58 First Downs, 3 Drops Per Game: 5.8 Receptions (9.5 Targets), 83 Yards, .69 TDs, 3.6 First Downs, .2 Drops Deep Ball: 44 Receptions (117 Targets), 1,293 Yards (34.0 Y/R), 13 TDs, 2 Drops 37.6% Catch Rate, 4.3% Drop Rate, 17.5% of All Targets Big Play Ability: 20+ Yard Catches: 17.5% of Catches, 10.6% of Targets, 2.6% of Routes Ran 40+ Yard Catches: 3.5% of Catches, 2.1% of Targets, .5% of Routes Ran Deep Ball Catches: 10.9% of Catches, 22.4% of Yards, 37.6% of Deep Targets, 1.6% of Routes Ran, 27.1% of TDs Average of Top 10 Longs: 63 Yards, Average of All Longs: 31 Yards, 37.2% of All Yards on Longs (2153) Red Zone: 53 Receptions, 342 Yards (6.5 Y/R), 32 TDs, 40 First Downs Slot: 83 Receptions (135 Targets), 1,286 Yards (15.5 Y/R), 7 TDs, 4 Drops 601 Snaps (14%), 61% Catch Rate, 4.6% Drop Rate By Down: 3rd: 66 Receptions, 960 Yards (14.5 Y/R), 4 TDs 4th: 8 Receptions, 116 Yards (14.5 Y/R), 1 TD Stats vs. Top 10 Corners: 36 Catches (66 Targets), 502 Yards (13.9 Y/R), 4 TDs, 54.5% CR Best 8 Performances: 73 Receptions, 1,248 Yards, 13 TDs QBs When Targeting Him: 5,776 Yards, 60.6% Completions (405-668), 48 TDs, 26 INTs, 96.4 QB Rating QB Stats of QBs When Not Targeting Him: 11,523 Yards, 60.1% Completions (1065-1747), 56 TDs, 48 INTs, 79.6 QB Rating Andre Johnson 348 Receptions (518 Targets), 5,053 Yards (14.5 Y/R), 28 TDs, 230 First Downs (66%), 31 Drops 1,558 Yards after Catch (4.5 Y/R), 18 Broken Tackles, 3 Fumbles, 70 Catches 20+ Yards, 21 Catches 40+ Yards 67.2% Catch Rate, 8.2% Drop Rate, 27% Target Rate, 5.2% Broken Tackle Rate, 9.8 Y/T, .054 TDs/T 54 Games (82%), 3,311 Snaps (91%), 1,923 Routes Ran (2.6 Y/RR, 5.5 RR/R), 5 Penalties, 3x Pro Bowl, 2x All-Pro Playoffs: 2 Games 13 Receptions (24 Targets), 201 Yards, 1 TD, 1 Drop, 54% Catch Rate, 7.1% Drop Rate Per Game Average: 7 Receptions (12 Targets), 101 Yards, .5 TDs, .5 Drops Stat Averages: Per Season: 103 Receptions (153 Targets), 1,497 Yards, 8 TDs, 68 First Downs, 9 Drops Per Game: 6.4 Receptions (9.6 Targets), 94 Yards, .52 TDs, 4.3 First Downs, .6 Drops Deep Ball: 36 Receptions (86 Targets), 1,392 Yards (38.7 Y/R), 9 TDs, 7 Drops 41.2% Catch Rate, 16.3% Drop Rate, 16.6% of All Targets Big Play Ability: 20+ Yard Catches: 20% of Catches, 13.5% of Targets, 3.6% of Routes Ran 40+ Yard Catches: 6% of Catches, 4.1% of Targets, 1.1% of Routes Ran Deep Ball Catches: 10.3% of Catches, 27.5% of Yards, 1.9% of Routes Ran, 32.1% of TDs Average of Top 10 Longs: 60 Yards, Average of All Longs: 33 Yards, 35.1% of All Yards on Longs (1774) Red Zone: 44 Receptions, 378 Yards (8.6 Y/R), 19 TDs, 29 First Downs Slot: 64 Receptions (95 Targets), 596 Yards (9.3 Y/R), 3 TDs, 5 Drops 404 Snaps (12%), 67% Catch Rate, 7.2% Drop Rate By Down: 3rd: 60 Receptions, 828 Yards (13.8 Y/R), 5 TDs 4th: 9 Receptions, 131 Yards (14.6 Y/R), 2 TDs Stats vs. Top 10 Corners: 23 Catches (47 Targets), 378 Yards (16.4 Y/R), 1 TD, 49% CR Best 8 Performances: 83 Receptions, 1,333 Yards, 12 TDs QBs When Targeting Him: 5,053 Yards, 67.2% Completions (348-518), 28 TDs, 26 INTs, 95.8 QB Rating QB Stats of QBs When Not Targeting Him: 9,490 Yards, 64.2% Completions (852-1327), 51 TDs, 28 INTs, 89.4 QB Rating Calvin Johnson 330 Receptions (576 Targets), 5,327 Yards (16.1 Y/R), 47 TDs, 232 First Downs (70%), 31 Drops 1,802 Yards after Catch (5.5 Y/R), 47 Broken Tackles, 8 Fumbles, 84 Catches 20+ Yards, 24 Catches 40+ Yards 57.3% Catch Rate, 8.6% Drop Rate, 23.7% Target Rate, 14.2% Broken Tackle Rate, 9.2 Y/T, .082 TDs/T 62 Games (95%), 3,921 Snaps (93%), 2,430 Routes Ran (2.2 Y/RR, 7.4 RR/R), 10 Penalties, 2x Pro Bowl, 2x All-Pro Playoffs: 1 Game 12 Receptions (15 Targets), 211 Yards, 2 TDs, 0 Drops, 80% Catch Rate, 0% Drop Rate Stat Averages: Per Season: 85 Receptions (150 Targets), 1,375 Yards, 12 TDs, 60 First Downs, 8 Drops Per Game: 5.3 Receptions (9.3 Targets), 86 Yards, .76 TDs, 3.7 First Downs, .5 Drops Deep Ball: 47 Receptions (152 Targets), 1,791 Yards (38.1 Y/R), 20 TDs, 8 Drops 30.1% Catch Rate, 14.5% Drop Rate, 26.4% of All Targets Big Play Ability: 20+ Yard Catches: 25.5% of Catches, 14.6% of Targets, 3.5% of Routes Ran 40+ Yard Catches: 7.2% of Catches, 4.1% of Targets, 1.0% of Routes Ran Deep Ball Catches: 14.2% of Catches, 33.6% of Yards, 30.1% of Deep Targets, 1.9% of Routes Ran, 42.6% of TDs Average of Top 10 Longs: 68 Yards, Average of All Longs: 34 Yards, 39.5% of All Yards on Longs (2103) Red Zone: 34 Receptions, 325 Yards (9.6 Y/R), 27 TDs, 31 First Downs Slot: 68 Receptions (114 Targets), 1,096 Yards (16.1 Y/R), 7 TDs, 5 Drops 468 Snaps (12%), 60% Catch Rate, 4.6% Drop Rate By Down: 3rd: 80 Receptions, 1,254 Yards (15.7 Y/C), 8 TDs 4th: 11 Receptions, 125 Yards (11.4 Y/C), 5 TDs Stats vs. Top 10 Corners: 38 Catches (75 Targets), 504 Yards (13.3 Y/C), 5 TDs, 50.7% CR Best 8 Performances: 63 Receptions, 1,322 Yards, 14 TDs QBs When Targeting Him: 5,327 Yards, 57.3% (330-576), 47 TDs, 30 INTs, 93.9 QB Rating QB Stats of QBs When Not Targeting Him: 10,362 Yards, 59.5% (1046-1758), 56 TDs, 49 INTs, 75.2 QB Rating
ugh. somebody please put this in a spread sheet or something. i'm too lazy to scroll up and down...unless i'm checking out pics of chicks.
lol click the link for better format. The key part: Larry Fitzgerald QBs When Targeting Him: 5,776 Yards, 60.6% Completions (405-668), 48 TDs, 26 INTs, 96.4 QB Rating QB Stats of QBs When Not Targeting Him: 11,523 Yards, 60.1% Completions (1065-1747), 56 TDs, 48 INTs, 79.6 QB Rating Andre Johnson QBs When Targeting Him: 5,053 Yards, 67.2% Completions (348-518), 28 TDs, 26 INTs, 95.8 QB Rating QB Stats of QBs When Not Targeting Him: 9,490 Yards, 64.2% Completions (852-1327), 51 TDs, 28 INTs, 89.4 QB Rating Calvin Johnson QBs When Targeting Him: 5,327 Yards, 57.3% (330-576), 47 TDs, 30 INTs, 93.9 QB Rating QB Stats of QBs When Not Targeting Him: 10,362 Yards, 59.5% (1046-1758), 56 TDs, 49 INTs, 75.2 QB Rating Supports the notion that Texans offensive scheme doesnt miss Andre "as much" as others when he's not involved, or when he's out. Andre gets more percentage of the yards than the others. 53% targeted yards, compared to 49% for Fitzgerald, 51% for C Johnson. Its still the one knock on Andre, that he doesnt pick up enough TD scores for a top flight receiver.
AJ is a bad ass but he's not as good as Megatron. Even in his prime there isn't a gm in the league who would take AJ over Calvin Johnson
You could also say that it supports the notion that Andre opens up the field for other receivers much more than the others even when he's not targeted--and therefore makes it easier on the QB to perform well throwing to others If seems to talk about him being targeted vs. not...not him being "out". Unless I'm misinterpreting
I'm confident that that's strictly a system thing. Is he as good of a target as Megatron in the endzone? Nope. Would AJ have twice as many TD's as he does now if he played for the Patriots though? Wouldn't surprise me.
The numbers posted are from 2008 and forward. (Or at least, appear to be) I'm willing to bet AJ was a larger part of the Texans offense before then. And then there's the whole question of are those numbers "not targeting AJ" including the times when he was missing from the field entirely because of injury. Either way, neither Arizona, nor Detroit, in that time frame have had much offense outside of their #1 WR. Not nearly as much as the Texans, at least.
are you trolling? what does 100 recs in a season mean? is wes welker better than calvin too? i love andre, but would also agree that most, if not all, GMs would take megatron over him if they were both in their prime. certainly not a trolling comment
you're right about the time frame. i'm guessing the numbers are only from the games he played. (79 passing tds in 54 games). zona had warner throwing to boldin alongside fitz in that time frame. that's pretty stout. extending to prior that time frame for andre would paint a more accurate picture for sure though. his prior-to-schaub years were pretty similar surrounding cast to calvin's prior-to-2011 (stafford) year.
Yep. Take a look at the numbers from the time frame in question. 2008 Team Rushing Detroit - 30th Arizona - 32nd Houston - 13th Yards passing to TEs Detroit - 316 Arizona - 181 Houston - 939 2009 Team Rushing Detroit - 24th Arizona - 28th Houston - 30th Yards passing to TEs Detroit - 642 Arizona - 207 Houston - 839 2010 Team Rushing Detroit - 23rd Arizona - 32nd Houston - 7th Yards passing to TEs Detroit - 1100 Arizona - 210 Houston - 989 2011 Team Detroit - 29th Arizona - 24th Houston - 2nd Yards passing to TEs Detroit - 1124 Arizona - 554 Houston - 1030 So yeah, out of a 4 year sample, Detroit and Arizona only have two years where they seem to have had any major weapons outside of their #1 WR. For Arizona, it was 2008-2009 with Boldin. For Detroit, it was 2010-2011 with Pettigrew. Meanwhile, during that entire 4 year span, with the exception of only 2009's rushing game, the Texans have had very capable running games and tight end play. This goes a long way towards explaining the lack of drop-off in QB play when AJ isn't being targeted, as opposed to Detroit and Arizona. That stat shouldn't be a knock on AJ, it should be a knock on the rest of Arizona and Detroit's supporting cast.
Love that QB rating stat for all the posters here always trying to wave David Carr in everyone's face all the time. Or those who try to argue Fitzgerald has always had better QB play even though he's had to deal with the likes of McCowns, Leinarts, and now Kolbs/Skeltons. Andre Johnson is a beast of a receiver, but to say he is clearly the best receiver in football is not an informed opinion because Fitzgerald has always been a better red zone target, had the best stretch performance by a WR in NFL history when Arizona went on their Super Bowl run a couple years ago. As I stated in the other thread, Megatron is clearly the best in the league now followed by a pickem of Fitz/AJ.
Have you seen Megatrons stats bro? Not to mention he is a GIANT. I love Andre but Calvin is another monster.
It could be. Rod Smith, who played a similar role in Shanahan's system, only put up two double-digit TD seasons in that offense's prime. It's an offense built around running and it utilizes a TE more than a lot of offenses. But Andre has *never* had double-digit TDs in a season - not under Kubiak, not under Capers. Never. He was on pace in two injury-shortened seasons ('07 and '10) - but his total so massively trails Fitzgerald and (especially) Johnson's that it's hard to completely excuse him. Top-flight WRs score TDs. Moss had 9 double-digit TD seasons; Owens 8. Fitz 4; Megatron 3. AJ 0.
maybe... but alls i know is that he had David freaking Carr as his QB for the early part of his career.. c'mon man, David Carr!!!!
He's also the 2nd wide receiver to lead the league in yardage back to back years. The other? Jerry rice. It's a shame he missed those 3 games in that 3rd year because he was on pace to do it 3 years in a row. It's a shame that he doesn't get the TD numbers but I still have a hard time believing it's because he's not good enough too.
I agree. if Dre had someone other than check down superstar carr throwing to him for most of his career.. we wouldn't be having this conversation.
In their primes, It's just opinion. Don't get too heated. That said, I'd take Dre in his prime over Megatron, and C. Johnson is top 5 fav. non-Texans right now.
