Who cares? Give them more to make it happen if they want more. Time to start giving teams what they want to make those moves.
Exactly. I'm a Morey fan, but sooner or later, he's going to have to be willing to take less in a deal to get the player we need.
Do it Morey. Do it to it. Before I get out the pitch forks and torches then start handing them out.:grin::grin:
I would offer Martin, Dalembert, and #16 for their #8. If they bite, good, if they don't, oh well. As for the #8 pick, Lillard or Waiters sound good to back up Lowry. Then choose Rivers or Ross with the 14th pick.
I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure plutoblue is implying that there is no way Toronto would accept Martin + 16 for the #8. They have absolutely no use for him and his salary with Derozan on board. If we somehow get #8 without giving up Lowry, add another notch to Morey's belt. But I don't see anyway Toronto takes that deal.
Exactly. We only think that way because Morey is our GM. With him in charge nearly every deal is impossible.
A good trade is giving them what they will take, not what they want. D-Mo, Parsons, the draft picks that is what they will all want. Will they take Martin or Scola? That is whatMorey needs to find out.
I agree with you totally. But????? We have Morey. I do not trust he can figue it out to do anything. If he is in charge of figuring it out instead of just going into it with the idea to slightly overpay to get the draft picks? I am convinced by now he will come out of the draft with nothing but the 14 and 16th pick for his inability to make an offer teams want for those big deals. So I am suggesting he overpay considering his impairment to make big moves.
I am basically working off the idea we have a disabled GM who needs to offer more to other teams to get the deals done. I certainly dont believe he will get anything done any other way.
If we can convert the 14th and 16 picks into Zeller and Ross, it will have been a banner draft IMHO. Martin, as an expiring, might bring huge rewards in a trade deadline deal if he gets his game back to 2010-2011 levels. Or Lee as a RFA may not be matched. And I think that we all agree that a young center is one of our biggest areas of need. The drop off in talent and potential from 2 to 16 is unusually narrow this year. For instance Beal could go #2 and Ross could go #16. And a case could be made that Ross could possibly have a better career than Beal. A similar case could be made for Drummond and Zeller. I could go on about the exceptional picks Morey made getting Parsons in the second round and D-Mo out of the lottery last year but you get my drift.
Sounds good to me. I really feel its time to bring over D-Mo. Then on top of that get those picks in here and give one or both them plus D-mo some time playing. Trade some older guys. I am not real big on going after another veteran to keep us close to the 8th spot or 9th playoff spot.
Just out off curiosity, what kind of deals do you think were on the table for us that Morey passed on because of his supposed impairment to make the big moves?
IMHO Lowry (unfortunately), Martin and Scola have to go. Lowry and Scola for Gasol seems like a natural to me, so clean and easy, but many don't think so. Parsons is our elite wing defender (and every good NBA team has to have at least 1) and he should (will?) develop a much better shot. Dragic has to be resigned if Lowry goes. Two possible tracks: Seriously compete next season for a 4 - 6 seed: Dragic/FA Martin/Lee/Ross with Martin gone at the trade deadline if Ross develops Parsons/Bud or Morris - the odd man out gets traded PPat/D-MO if D-Mo continues to mature D-Mo/PPat in January Gasol/Dally/Zeller An interesting possibility is drafting Lilliard (instead of Ross) as a back up PG and scoring spark off the bench as a SG. That would take care of the back up PG issue and would make trading Martin at the trade deadline an easy decision to make. If Parsons, D-Mo and Ross develop quickly the Rockets might quickly make it to the WCF. Put off competing for 2 years to develop talent: Dragic/FA Martin/Lee/Ross - Martin gone at the trade deadline Parsons/Bud or Morris - the odd man out gets traded PPat/D-MO if D-Mo continues to mature D-Mo/PPat in January Camby/Drummond Basically you have 2 out of the three highest potential rookies in the NBA next season. You have traded Dally's expiring/cheap buyout contract, Bud or Morris, Lowry, Dallas's protected first round pick, and the 14th for Drummond (taking back a bad contract would be acceptable). At the 16th you take Ross. Whatever Martin will bring in at the trade deadline is cake. Future draft picks and young talent preferable. Scola is packaged with the 16th to try to move up. Again Lilliard may be an upgrade of a draft pick over Ross due to the roster makeup. The team (sans Camby) would be well below 25 years old. If Ross, D-Mo, Drummond and Parsons can get anywhere near their potential by 2015 you may have the next OKC in Houston.
This could take a while but it would take so many threads and research its not worth looking up. For the simple fact I would expect to be engaged in a conversation I have a chance to prove Morey does'nt get so much done for this team. When that's actually not possible for me to expect. There will be biases and I am sure my research will only lead to another question where I have to do this endless cycle of answering questions. When it is Morey who has no track record to prove he has done something for this team yet to begin with. Which leads right back to our destination the 14th pick and discussing this exact same topic next year and questions regarding this exact same thing. So I just wrote this long paragraph so that I wouldnt have to go endlessly give a reason why I wont go research for all those deals or things he tried to do but didnt get done. It saves time to end it all in this one paragraph. In the end I understand these biases thats why there is such a thing as a fanbase. At some point some guys break off from the pack to say its not working out. While others want to stay the course under their managements plans. This has happened obviously with the fanbase. Its good and healthy debate to keep out teams competitive. To keep the pressure on the higher ups to do better and also to have fans cheer them on when they have something going on that people can get behind. Right now there is nothing Morey is doing I can get behind. Your point of view will be different than mine until he changes that. Just like its likely those who disagree with me wont change their minds either because they think its being a better fan to not say anything and encourage Morey. Its better to explain why constantly asking me questions wont do any good if I cant prove it to change your minds until Morey sufficiently does something himself to change the thought process within your own individual minds. That point where its enough for you to break from the pack too. That may be this draft or season. Its already to that point now where it will be decided without my answering any questions. Thank you if you read that. :grin:
I did read that. Again Morey now has cap room for the first time. With the new CBA luxury tax looming it may be the most important component in many trades. Last years draft was a huge success. An elite wing defender in the second round and one of the 3 highest potential rookies next season for the 23rd. If the Gasol trade had gone down - and I totally discount Nene as a rumor - the Rockets might have been a 4 -5 seed. I personally don't have anything to complain about as far as Morey goes. This time next year I may have a completely different opinion.
So if you don't do research how do know if there were deals on the table which Morey didn't do? From what I can see you're complaining without knowing what you're complaining about. Also saying Morey has no track record is asinine, I guess the Scola-Tmac-Lowry trades didn't happen.
You twisted the words of the paragraph. You show the example of why its useless for me to keep answering questions. They only lead to more questions from the people I answer them for. What I am saying is I am now waiting for Morey does this offseason and not answering anymore questions on his track record. I think by then a few minds will either be satisfied. Hopefully my own or Morey will start to have answer questions from many more posters than me and a few others. As you can see I cant change your mind answering your questions over and over again. It was just proven with your reaction. So we wait. AGAIN.
Meanwhile my mind is set until Morey changes it. For the first time. It is the first time something would be done in a different direction. As far as I know last year was still sort of a extension of the last few years.
