1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Just because Dwight opted in doesn't mean he won't be traded

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by jopatmc, Mar 30, 2012.

  1. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2002
    Messages:
    15,370
    Likes Received:
    390
    Look, if you're gonna wait until 2014 to contend, you might as well go young, lose a lot, go to the lottery, get a good pick, and shed salary and set yourself up as an attractive destination for free agents. You are making my case about 2014.

    Bynum doesn't make them a contender. He simply makes them a little bit worse than last season. He isn't as good as Dwight. Never will be. And there is a high probability that he gets worse from here. He's not going to help them do anything. Not going to help them with PR. Not going to help them recruit players. (Can't even recruit players when you're over the cap.)


    Read your own post.

    "Right now, Miami seems like juggernaut, but Orlando can be a contender in the East with Bynum. After Miami, Chicago, and Indiana, there's a huge drop-off in the East. "

    So, if they get Bynum they will be able to complete for 4th??? And that's what contending is to you?? C'mon man.

    It's not about acquiring our "mediocre" players. It's about acquiring our young talent, our picks, and what they can turn our "mediocre" players into. First of all, we are discussing the possibility of acquiring Gasol. If we can get Gasol for Lowry and Scola (which undoubtedly we can), then what else can Orlando get for them? That's right. There's value there. There's value in Martin's expiring contract. First of all, Martin, when healthy is a top 15 shooting guard in the NBA (in my opinion, top 10). No, they won't make Orlando winners. But Orlando can flip or package and flip to move up in the draft and create even more cap space, use some of those mediocre players and picks to attach to a bad contract and move out another bad contract. We have all the parts to help Orlando rebuild and that is what Orlando should do if they are going to lose Dwight.

    There is no trade Orlando can make for Dwight that will make them a better team immediately. No trade that will make them better! But they can use Dwight to set themself up to possibly draft another superstar and extract themselves from the salary cap hell they are stuck in. They are going to go down when the trade Dwight. It's a foregone conclusion. So, the best thing is to expedite (that means speed up) a rebuild. We have the pieces to make that happen.
     
  2. plutoblue11

    plutoblue11 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2006
    Messages:
    10,528
    Likes Received:
    1,011

    That only pertains to next season (2013-14, but as they get better pieces from free agency and the draft, while getting further under the cap. They should get better with in the next few seasons, most of all. They'll have near franchise player in Bynum, a franchise center at that, maybe. Where else are they going to find a good center, like that. I'm waiting on that one.


    From what I've seen in the next few drafts, there's no golden centers coming out. How is the Magic acquiring Bynum going to impede their rebuilding process? They'd be rebuilding with a really good center on their team, who might actually stay (You cannot say the same thing if Howard, by stroke of luck end up in Houston). In fact, Bynum would probably be more willing to stay in Orlando, than Howard in Houston (which would essentially just be a rental deal. Most of all, Bynum sounds way more appealing than anything Houston could come up with, even with draft picks (which do not think any will come close to the value of a Bynum).

    Regardless of what the Magic do, they are going to have cap-space unless they keep signing players they shouldn't to long term contracts.

    With Bynum, you are getting a more sure thing versus KM/Scola/Lowry/Patterson/2 mid first round draft picks. Again, throw some names of some upcoming players that the Magic can get from other teams with those players.

    Orlando's biggest need is to fill a void in the middle, none of those players can do that. It's much harder to find a quality big man versus quality wings, because you can find interchangeable wing players in the dozens. Above average bigs are much more scarce, while I do not think even with Rockets package and players that the Magic will be able to draft or find a player who has equal value to Andrew Bynum.

    Even with Lowry/KM/a couple of draft picks, will the Magic be able to get a player, like Roy Hibbert or an Andrew Bogut.


    I still do not think you quite understand how hard it is to replace a big versus these one-dimensional players (like Scola and Martin), decent level pg (Lowry), or even young players with potential (draft picks-Patterson/Morris). Those type of players again are a dime-a-dozen. It might take a good 3 to 8 years to find a player, like Andrew Bynum. If a player like Martin, Lowry, or Scola were so valuable, how come they are so replaceable that the Rockets are easily throwing them out as mere assets.

    For Bynum, you already need the best center in the league, just for the Lakers management to even consider moving him. Because, he's a much harder player to replace, because he's a big man with an almost complete package and higher level talent.
     
  3. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2002
    Messages:
    15,370
    Likes Received:
    390
    Keep tying your wagon to Bynum and going nowhere plutoblue. Check back with me on Bynum in 5 years. You'll see I was right.
     
  4. HMMMHMM

    HMMMHMM Member

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2010
    Messages:
    4,031
    Likes Received:
    597
    Woj:
    http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--n...QDBHBzdGNhdANhdXRob3IEcHQDc2VjdGlvbnM-;_ylv=3
     
  5. ROXTXIA

    ROXTXIA Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2000
    Messages:
    20,892
    Likes Received:
    12,992
    May I quote Clyde "Captain Obvious" Drexler?

    "I agree."

    Although I fear the Rockets will be a wasteland of Courtney Lee, Dmo, and maybe Dragic if we trade for Howard and lose him in a year.
     
  6. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2002
    Messages:
    15,370
    Likes Received:
    390
  7. J.R.

    J.R. Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    114,263
    Likes Received:
    176,948
    <blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p>I would love to know who Adrian Wojnarowski source is bc he knows more about what I'm thinking then I do maybe they can help me decide?</p>&mdash; Deron Williams (@DeronWilliams) <a href="https://twitter.com/DeronWilliams/status/207934552163889153" data-datetime="2012-05-30T20:40:35+00:00">May 30, 2012</a></blockquote>
    <script src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
     
  8. plutoblue11

    plutoblue11 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2006
    Messages:
    10,528
    Likes Received:
    1,011
    Good one, D-Will.
     
  9. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2002
    Messages:
    15,370
    Likes Received:
    390


    Oh, come now, Deron. You selling some beach front property in Arizona too, aren't you?
     
  10. plutoblue11

    plutoblue11 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2006
    Messages:
    10,528
    Likes Received:
    1,011
    Not tying any wagon to Bynum. He's not one of my favorite players by any stretch of the imagination. He's got a rather distasteful attitude, but he's a beast of player (and has even more potential to improve).

    I will ask you, this question. Name a better center than Bynum, right now outside of Dwight Howard.

    If you are somehow able to do that. Are these players under 28?

    Furthermore, if you have $12-17MM for any quality big man or any player that can play center. Name a player that you would give that amount to over the next 4 years, outside of Dwight Howard.

    That's one of main reasons, I think Bynum is valuable and I do not see any other guys on the horizons who are closer to being the best center in the league.
     
  11. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2002
    Messages:
    15,370
    Likes Received:
    390
    Tim Duncan
    Pau Gasol
    Kevin Garnett
    Andrew Bogut
    Tyson Chandler

    There's 5, not just 1. And who cares about age. If you are crap at 24, you can still be crap at 31. But if you're great at 31, you can age like Timmy and Garnett and still be good at 38. I would give my money to any of those 4 and take my chances with their health before I gave it to Bynum for another 4 years and took my chances he turns into the next Eddy Curry.
     
  12. J.R.

    J.R. Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    114,263
    Likes Received:
    176,948
  13. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2002
    Messages:
    15,370
    Likes Received:
    390
    Well the draft lottery is history. The Nets lost. They lost out on Dwight and they lost DWIll. Just a matter of time.

    During the next 30 days, expect to hear all sorts of rumors about the double D's heading to the Lakers, the Lakers trading Pau for Dwill straight up, and I expect DWill to give the Nets the option to trade him to the Lakers if he opts in for the final year of his contract. All sorts of shenanigans as both guys try to make the Lakers deal happen.

    One thing that worries me is Orlando hasn't hired a GM yet. If DWill does tell the Nets he is leaving and gives them the option to trade him to the Lakers for Pau or Bynum before he walks away for nothing, then Orlando could lose significant trade leverage with Dwight. They may be forced then to accept Bynum for Dwight as most teams that would be willing to rent Dwight will probably back off when Dwight doesn't commit to an extension and they can't acquire DWill. It's a significant risk that Orlando is taking here by not having a GM in place.

    So, I can see this power play unfolding just like that, DWill telling NJ he is gone and giving them the option to trade him to LA for Pau so they can get some value for him. And if the Nets fall for it, well, that would hurt our chances significantly. But if the Nets stick by their guns that they really prefer cap space (I doubt it) to getting a guy like Pau, then we still have a chance.

    The other power play DWIll could make would be to get the Nets to trade him to Portland for Aldridge and Matthews/Crawford or Aldridge, Williams, Babbitt, and Nolan Smith by making the same threat that he is going to walk for nothing. That would leave Portland approximately $30 million in cap space plus the #6 and #11 picks to send to Orlando for Dwight and Hedo.

    DWill/Matthews/Batum/Dwight/Hedo and a bunch of minimum salary guys. I doubt New Jersey being willing to accept that. But if they are put under the gun, they might.

    The other possibility of Portland going to Orlando with LA, #6, #11, and Crawford for Dwight/Hedo. Orlando may go for that. Then Portland could sign DWill outright.

    So, I suppose Portland is a threat to get involved in the Dwight/Dwill sweepstakes.

    Don't know what Orlando is thinking. That organization is really screwed up. Surely they will get a GM hired pronto because the longer they drag it out, the less value they are going to be able to trade Dwight for.

    There is no way Dwight re-ups there. No way. He'll walk if they force him to play out the season.

    So, actually if Orlando gets wind of DWill's power play regarding the Lakers then they may pull the trigger on Dwight sooner rather than later to keep from being trapped into the Bynum for Dwight deal straight up. That is, unless they actually value Bynum that highly.

    TWill be interesting to see what power move DWill tries to make in the next 30 days.
     
  14. J.R.

    J.R. Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    114,263
    Likes Received:
    176,948
    Lakers Jim Buss:

    On Andrew Bynum:

    "I think it’s pretty obvious how I feel about Andrew Bynum. He’s an incredible All-Star center and you can build the future around him." ...

    "I keep referring to Phil [Jackson]. Phil said, 'Let the kid grow up.' He’s still young at heart. I don’t know what else to say about him."
     
  15. J.R.

    J.R. Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    114,263
    Likes Received:
    176,948
    Chris Broussard says Duhwight still wants Brooklyn, and although everyone assumes he is gone, he also says if the Magic make the right moves, there is a chance he could stay:)rolleyes:).

    If Deron leaves Brooklyn, he says they'll call the Lakers exploring S&T(obviously involving Williams) for Bynum, NY for Carmelo and Steve Nash should expect a phone call from Brooklyn.
     
  16. mr. 13 in 33

    mr. 13 in 33 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2010
    Messages:
    10,617
    Likes Received:
    636
    i'm trying to remember but didn't howard get mad at kobe because he said Dwight is his 3rd option or something like that which means howard to the lakers is not gonna happen
     
  17. J.R.

    J.R. Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    114,263
    Likes Received:
    176,948
    Yeah, Sam Amick, fwiw, said the Mavs and Lakers were teams listed for leverage and he really isn't interested in going to either.
     
  18. J.R.

    J.R. Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    114,263
    Likes Received:
    176,948
  19. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2002
    Messages:
    15,370
    Likes Received:
    390
  20. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2002
    Messages:
    15,370
    Likes Received:
    390
    Thought this was an interesting tidbit on Jameer. He "asked" for an extension to his decision to opt out and the Magic obliged.

    http://articles.orlandosentinel.com..._1_jameer-nelson-steve-mountain-orlando-magic


    This carries him to June 29, the day after the draft and 2 days before free agency. Which means the Magic have more trade flexibility. I suspect Jameer probably isn't going to opt out. I suspect he gets bought out. He's not leaving $8 million on the table. But he might leave $4 million on the table if he can secure a long-term deal elsewhere and make up the difference. And he's sending the signal by threatening to opt out that he is willing to do just that. Magic can now include him in a trade with him opting in and they can include the buyout negotiation in the trade package.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now