http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/23/world/asia/pakistan-bin-laden-doctor/index.html?hpt=hp_t1 What a troubled nation. Hopefully the US doesn't leave him out to dry.
What are we supposed to do? We aren't "hanging him out to dry." Oh, unless you want us to send in our people and spring him from the lockup. Somehow, I don't think that's in the cards, Ronny. I agree that Pakistan is one screwed up country. I feel sorry for the people of Pakistan, who are victims of a dysfunctional, corrupt government. That's putting it politely. And the doctor deserves a medal, instead of being a target for blowing off some Pakistani Governmental Humiliation.
Pressure, pressure, pressure. If the US wants to do something about it, they will. It's just hard to understand how the same country that allowed them to go through with the operation to capture Bin Laden allows this stuff to happen, regardless of what tribal legislation it took part under. There is no progress or uniformity being made on a national level whatsoever, and that can only mean bad things to come from them in future.
I don't really think they allowed this to go through. Pakistan knew exactly where he was. They were hiding him. They didn't really want the US to get him.
It's not hard to understand, it's very similar to Afghanistan in fact. The majority of the humans in these countries oppose the current leadership. This is mainly because the humans in those countries are aware that the governments are treasonously selling their sovereignty to foreign nations. However, they are powerless to get rid of the leadership because those foreign countries ensure that the leaders and the military are richest in the country, have the best weapons, and dominate foreign media (to deflect international pressure). So while those leaders and their "defense" establishments aided the US in finding Bin Laden and continue to support their efforts, it doesn't stop the rest of the humans who obviously occassionaly get into semi-important positions, where they have a stronghold, from making noise. It doesn't stop the humans who are pissed off from turning into medieval anarchists. They know that these actions such as local terrorism, assassinations, etc are only the "best" they can do very much in the same manner the US considers the murder of Pakistani/Afghani civilians an unfortunate consequence of the oh-so-sad limitations of murdering people in foreign territories with drones. At this point, everyone in Pakistan probably knows someone who was killed by an American - justly or unjustly. Plus they have very little to lose - it's not like there are well-paying jobs, worthwhile education, freedom to form their own country, etc. The extremists will fight for decades, centuries. The only pleasures they have is their 45 wives and being remembered in their village or town for attempting to bring down the status quo.
Once again, Mathloom is trying to make it seem like terrorist actions are just a reaction to actions by "evil Americans". BS. These people were ass backwards and violent long before the USA even got involved there.
So you are maintaining that whatever terrorist actions these lunatics commit and any other ass-backwardness is just a reaction to some foreign action?
If anyone else actually believes this, they can challenge me, and I'll respond to them. 0 interest in responding to you.
This Atlantic article troubles me deeply. tl;dr: They've lied to our faces for decades and we enable their lies for whatever reasons. Lately, because Pakistan is a nuclear power, the US is damned if they do and damned if they don't. They're paranoid that we'll take away their nukes to the point of shipping them around in broad daylight. But as much as we would like to leave and let them rot, they have nukes, and even the best contingencies (which they plan against) is risky as hell with 0% degree of deviation.
Let's flip the script and suppose . . .some villian was in the U.S. he is a bad guy BUT he had valuable intel and resources we needed/wanted So the U.S. Government hid him and denied he existed Suppose some foreign government paid some guy to verified this guy was here and to tell them where this guy is . . . .. having proof . . .the other government insist the U.S. allow them to get it the U.S. government can no longer deny it . . . so they relent Said foreign government then took a team into the U.S. and killed the guy now . . . . how do you think the U.S. government with view that Some Guy? Regardless of the RIGHT of it . . .you were collaborating with a foreign power I don't think the U.S. would be 'grateful' One countries criminal is another's hero. Bin Laden paid alot of folx over there. . . some will be upset with the end of the gravy train. They might want a little revenge . . .. It will be interesting how the U.S. handles this we cannot allow our assets to be handled this way . . .esp if we want more assets in the future. . . Rocket River
It is what you said. Everyone can see it. Most people don't actually bother to engage with your craziness, though. A few will even agree with it.
I don't know enough about Pakistan, but with all the oppression and injustice, is there some sort of grass root anti-government guerrilla movement occurring? I would imagine the country's environment (both physical and geopolitical) is perfect for it. I'm not advocating force as the only option for reform. I'm just surprised we don't hear too much about militant reactions, as such with other countries in a similar environment.
There is. The slight problem is that those guys are the Islamist nutjobs whom would be far, far worse if they got into power like Al Qaeda. Pakistan just doesn't have the proper culture or legal backdrop to create a democracy, if not a civilized state. Of course, when a certain other state (which admittedly, is more civilized than Pakistan, not that it's difficult to do so) in the Middle East tries to get nuclear weapons and we attempt to negotiate/pressure that state not to do so, lots of people throw a big stink over it.
So you're saying there's a rebel force because the government is NOT repressive enough? NOT Islamic enough? I'm thinking of a reactionary force that's 180 degrees of current status quo like the ones like FARC or Tamil Tigers. While the groups mentioned are probably not any better than the establishment they're against, at least they have a pretense of fighting for the people. Does the culture, be it Islam or Paki, have that much control of all it's people? North Korea also comes to mind.
Pakistan knows that we're not committed to Afghanistan, and are trying to ally themselves with both sides, so that they don't end up losing.
Pretty much - the reason the government is our "friend" is that its more moderate than the alternative. Our worst fear with Pakistan is that the current government falls - in that case, an Islamist government would replace them, and that new government would have nuclear weapons. Thus, we tolerate and support the craziness that is the current government.
Spot on, I believe. As bad as their government is now, religious extremists ruling the country would be much much worse. The rulers now are corrupt beyond imagination but aren't violent freaks that an extremist-run government would be. Sad situation. Things don't look positive for the country anytime in the future.
