Please stay on topic. You're not "in the middle" if you have a superstar on your roster to add pieces around, like the Lakers after Shaq left. That's what I was responding to. You're only stuck in mediocrity of you're an average team with no superstars or blue chip youth to build upon. If you think we didn't have a superstar then you're saying Morey is a moron and should be fired for building the team as if we had one.
DD, you are basically saying that nobody should take your opinion seriously because you flip flop based on the situation. For someone who boasts that they can coach on college levels if they wanted to, but is simply uninterested, I think you would hold yourself to higher standards to that. And why would every decision of the office be held accountable even if Lin becomes an all-star? That doesn't make any sense. And the comment regarding McHale motivating Thabeet to play harder. A few months ago you were going around saying that Thabeet works hard, is smart (because he knows 5 languages or something) and all that. Now, instead of holding Thabeet accountable for sucking, you are holding McHale accountable for not being able to make Thabeet not suck. R.A was also known as a player coach, how come Thabeet didn't flourish under him?
Sorry, but honestly I have no clue what point you're making. Maybe I missed something earlier in the thread. We are a team in the middle, and we have been for the last 3 years. A bubble playoff team, with very little chance to make it out of the first round.
Morey has talent in finding some diamonds in the rough. So far has not translated to top tier talent. Give him another pass. Awe come on please!!! There I went to bat for him. Do not expect anymore good words past March if we are sitting with the same team.
1st post!!! hey all... i'm not sure whats the problem with morey, methinks it's a trend that is spreading across the nba like a wildfire.. the trend of free agent stars demanding to play in a "big/sexy market" (i.e. ny, la, miami). the only way a team like the rockets can get a legitimate star is to draft him. which... unfortunately, we are never in that position b/c Les. I give morey the benefit of the doubt, he's been dealt a tough hand.. 1) never tank a season, 2) try to win in the west with no star, 3) try to lure top players to htown even though no legit free agent star wants to play here.. if you think about all of that, morey has done quite well.
Nice first post and accurate summary of what's going on with the Rockets. Better than 99% of the posts on this thread by couch GMs.
LMAO let me translate DD's post for you. Basically what he's saying is that just a fan, not a GM so he can complain all he wants without taking into account the reality and circumstances of the situation. Its not his job and he isn't bound by inconvenient things like having to explain things like passing on a 7 foot shot blocking C, or cutting the guy who turned down a Euro league contract because you promised him a contract or eating 3.5M guaranteed just to secure our 3rd pg. That's why he raised hell on the boards when the Rox passed on Jeremy Tyler TWICE to get D. Mo and Parsons, conveniently forgot about it and now is saying DM is the one who doesn't know how to evaluate talent, and should be fired for not predicting his 4rth pg whom he has not seen play an actual NBA game would drop 38 on Kobe. Of course if you hold DD to the same standard, he would have been banned by now because he makes a wrong evaluation almost every year. This is the guy who said he's "not impressed" with C-bud's dleague play then started pulling the bandwagon himself, who said Lowry is a "backseat type of player", who said we would "regret passing on the Vonhawk" when Dallas picked him up, who agreed that DM "missed the boat" on the Bucks for Patterson, who said Minny has a much better team than the Rox this year etc. etc. etc.
Lol didn't he also say we'd regret giving up Gerald Green. Not to mention the V-Span fiasco and Dan Langhi. Oh, and Maarty Leunen to the rescue!
I used to think DD is just the way he is because he's a hardcore fan albeit ignorant... but maybe the guy is just a troll.
I for the most part agree with your sentiments durv. I think it is ridiculous to blame Morey for not keeping LIN. This part of the argument has already been well articulated. Let me at least attempt to defend Dakota. I don't see how he has changed his stance. Back in Jan he argued that Morey is accumulating players that serve the same purpose and this results in good players not getting PT. Can't you argue that this in it of itself was the main culprit as to why LIN did not get enough PT because there were already 3 player ahead of him that weren't great but were good enough to get PT over him and therefor Lin was cut. So in essence it would have been better to have a variety of players to begin with instead of having a glut at the PG position. I know it is confusing but that was my attempt to defend dakota.
The problem here is DD is complaining even when what he was complaining about was actually addressed. Durv was right, DD was indeed complaining about the glut on the roster. We had 15 guys on the roster including 4 pgs. The chance to nab a 7 foot shot blocking C came along, DM cut the 4rth PG and added our only legit center. Now DD is saying Morey should be fired for cutting Lin. I remember one of more instance of this, DD said JVG had to be fired because he was too tough and was always taking a "my way or the high way" approach. Then when the players were too undisciplined under RA he said RA should learn to instill a "my way or the high way approach". I think he even used the exact same phrase lol.
Nice attempt. But his point was that you can't have multiple quality players fighting for minutes. Suppose we didn't have Flynn, and it was just Lowry and Dragic. According to his argument, it still would have been a bad idea to add Lin to the roster, because clearly one of Lin and Dragic would be getting little to no playing time. In fact, suppose the Gasol trade went through, and we had only Lowry and Flynn on the roster. According to his argument, even in that scenario it would have been a bad idea to add Lin ("both Lin and Flynn have an argument for minutes based on what they've done"). The only way to reconcile both opinions would be if we had a wide open spot on the roster for Lin but still passed him up.
Nice attempt, but that was not my point, the point was that when you have a ton of same players it can create discord, and you hinder your ability to make trades because your assets devalue on the bench. Now, that has nothing to do with letting quality players walk out he door, particularly if they are BETTER than most of the players at their position. The two are not remotely related in this discussion.....well, they are in one way, Morey doing a bad job in both roster building and talent recognition, so yeah, I guess they are related. Good job Durvasa, you just pointed out that Morey did a crap job....you are growing young padwan. DD
Uh, yes it does. Obviously. Oh, stop. You're living in your own fantasy world of talent evaluation where its possible to just "know" what a player will be at a glance. Hence, all your "jump-the-gun" predictions over the years that didn't pan out. In the real world, you're dealing with limited information, there are huge unknowns, and there are real consequences to the decisions you make. Even if Lin had a great training camp, he wouldn't be the first backup-quality player who did so. And this wasn't even a full training camp. There's no way a rational person could take a few days of scrimmages and drills and say "This guy is going to be a STAR! He's a KEEPER." If Lin played great in training camp, then the Rockets at most should have believed he could be a quality backup player with a chance to be something more (in other words, same outlook they had for Dragic who once scored 23 points in the 4th quarter of a playoff game against the Spurs). That's it. Predicting more than that requires real game action. Hell, even after Lin had 3 monster games of full-fledged NBA action last month, I asked you if you'd rather have Lin or Greg Smith. Your response: Greg Smith. Look, its OK if you changed your views. I change my mind also sometimes, and I'm not criticizing you over that. If you think the Rockets should add players that they think have a chance to be really good irrespective of the rest of the roster, fine. That's a legitimate perspective for a rebuilding team. Just acknowledge there was merit to your earlier argument as well, that there is such a thing as having too many rotation-quality players (such as having 4 PGs, all of whom can probably play in the NBA, when only two of them will actually get minutes).
I am not employed by the Rockets, nor am I in practice every day, nor is it my STINKING JOB to evaluate talent. It IS Morey and McHale's job. No more excuses Durv, the fact that they missed on Lin calls into question their evaluation abilities....and the fact that they keep finding role players instead of guys that can carry the load, or develop into stars. Morey keeps on lying through his teeth about stocking the roster with players with LOTS of upside.... WHERE? WHO? LOL - and people keep on drinking the Kool aid. I am more the - No excuses guy - sure there are circumstance, but so what, it is their JOB....and they did a piss poor job concerning Lin. Again, stop trying to cover up for them......and make it about me...I am not a Rockets employee......they are......focus on the failure of the organization, if you can. DD
Agreed. I must say you are quite a debater. Now that you have correctly pointed out that the whole point of cutting Lin was to sign Dalambert, Dakota's argument really is extremely weak. I tried dodge dakota ur on ur own on this one brother.
Jeff Adrien says hello !!! We kept Adrien instead of Lin....then liked him so much we cut him later. Talent evaluation at it's finest. That is the crux of the discussion nothing else. DD
That is one part of the discussion the other is in reference to what you had written a few months ago and now seem to have completely changed ur position on.
Not really, for reasons already stated umpteen times. OK, we're not seeing eye to eye on this, and it looks like there will be no resolution to this debate. I'll stop.
