Recent history shows quite the opposite, actually. Again, Miami with Shaq, Detroit with Wallace, Billups, Hamilton. LA with Pau and Odom. Boston with Garnett and Allen. The examples you gave (such as Houston) were before the lottery system was put in place... Ah, my bad, stopped reading that post too early. Well that's somewhat fair then, but I think NYC makes up for that for the most part. It's still a worthwhile tradeoff because making the playoffs will in all likelihood be a better building block than a high lottery pick. But regardless, I guess you win this round, heh.
I dont want to see the team tank. I just want to see the team get rid of all these role players that will never be bundled into a deal for a star. If it leads to a bad season i am all for it. Gathering so many role players wont get the team moving in the right direction.
Haha, I try so hard to not be a douche sometimes. I know I go overboard in these interwebz arguments, but it just really gets to me when people say things that I unequivocally consider absolute nonsense. I'm probably a subtle troll's dream, heh. 20 years? We have only NOT been a legitimate contender for two years, brotel... This is the third, and we've looked better and better in each of those years. I guarantee we're going to be waiting a lot longer than that to start winning again if we try to tank for a pick right now. People just need to be patient. We have a good front office, we have young talent, and now we have cap space.
The goal is a championship, or to be a contender for one, this team is not. We have role players, we have no alpha dog, no beta dog, our best player is a gamma dog...Lowry...he should be 3rd on a decent team. DD
I guess in terms of Wade recruiting then I see what you're saying. James and Bosh had nothing to do with the Heat nor were they obtained by any Lottery Picks. You're kinda stretching. I think if Wade plays for Detroit, LBJ and CB4 don't come. South Beach isn't too shabby of a place to be, especially if you got money.
Wade was a top 5 pick and carried that team to a ring that year. They don't win that championship without Wade. The Lakers had freaking Kobe Bryant already come on man. Boston had Pierce who was an elite guard in the league. All three of those teams had superstar caliber players that carried them to the ring. Go check the finals mvp for each of those teams and you will see the player that was already on the rosters name on it. We don't have a player of that caliber so the situation is very different. The Pistons did do it unconventionally but they are definitely an outlier. haha I was wondering how you were going to counter that. As much as I hope the Knicks don't make it the east is terrible especially if the Celtics are bad so they probably will get in. I would be more ok with fighting for the playoffs if we didn't lose our lotto pick. I really don't think making the playoffs is worth a first round pick in the draft and especially this draft. If we sucked it would be a great trading piece for a DWill or Howard but oh well we blew that by keeping our aging vetarans. If we had just traded Scola and Martin and not signed Dalembert we could have a ton of great pieces by the end of the season. I think the Rockets blew a great opportunity to make a quick turn around in a shortened season.
Yeah... I know. That's what my post was about. Not sure what your point here is. Lowry is already the best player on a "decent team", sooo...
I'm not stretching it. Players want to play with other talented players. We aren't Detroit so bringing them up is irrelevant for us. We aren't as sexy as LA or NY but players don't hate being here at all. If we had Wade Bosh and James would have come here too.
So as of right now we are what? 10th or 11th? Knicks are 8th. I don't think the Knicks will continue to play at this level. They will figure something out, they have to, its NY. Right now the teams ahead of us are playing good so don't know what think about this. How long is Timmy and Ginobli sitting out for? Spurs might slip out if they are out for too long. I have a feeling Minny will win more game, getting away from the rough start and Rubio getting more courage and acclimated. Its gonna be Portland, Minny and us fighting for a 8th spot and quite frankly its gonna be a hard fight.
The point is that all of those teams were lottery teams to middling teams until they traded for major upgrades. That's where the Rockets are right now, regardless of whether they have a "true" superstar. For one thing, they've shown the ability to close out close games this year, which is really one of the only reasonable cases for needing a superstar. And for another, Lowry looks like he *might* be developing into a legitimate star. Not likely a carry-a-team-to-a-championship kinda star, but the kinda star that could attract other stars if this team continues to win (especially given how much room his salary leaves us). I just think people need to have more patience. We might even be able to find an answer in the lottery WITHOUT tanking. Either by landing a late-round jackpot, which isn't unheard of, or potentially by trading up in the draft. I also think this team is just one major piece away from contention, and it makes more sense to look for that piece outside of the lottery.
As excited as I am, I agree. We could trade the NY pick. Its looking like a 25 game win season for NY. That could be in the same neighborhood as the T-wolves pick that landed a superstar for a SG whose numbers were nearly identical to KM.
We are one free agent signing away from being a contender I will give you that. if we could sign Howard and lose nothing we would be a legitimate threat because we have so many solid players on this team and lowry who is a borderline star. The problem is that we are most likely going to have to trade for a superstar and I don't think you can win a championship with Lowry as your second best player unless you have another all star caliber player on the team which we don't have. My point of listing the other teams is that when you already have a real legit star player you are always one star away from being great assuming you don't have to blow up your team to get him. The Knicks are a prime example of what happens when you have to trade away too much for star talent. A high lotto pick player like Barnes, Jones, Drummond or Davis would have done wonders for this team.
I disagree with you there. Again, he's already the best player on a good team with a couple of clear weaknesses. I think he can be the second best player on a GREAT team if he had the right pieces around him. But like I was getting at, I doubt he can be the BEST player on a "great" team. The Knicks aren't a very good example of anything except stupid management if you ask me. And that's something the Rockets don't have. Also, the most important point to go with the above (along with my last post) is that none of those teams tanked to get their drafted stars. They went through the natural ebb and flow of the game and landed them. When you already have a "good" team, you don't put all your chips on 3 red and cross your fingers. You just try to wisely invest and continue to build from there.
If those players were both 23 they would have gladly given us Paul for those two and dragic. The whole reason the trade got vetoed was because of the age of the players. Martin's value is not comparable to Gordon's value.
The reason the trade was vetoed was money. The Lakers were gonna be taking on much less money which hurts the owners. The Lakers would be lower on the luxury tax and the Hornets would be taking on salary which the owners would have to pay.
Rebuilding is a natural part of the game. Nobody is saying we should go out there and purposely lose games. My only real complaint is hanging on to Scola and Martin and signing players. Age wise those guys don't match up with us long term. Realistically we are 2-4 years away from being a contender. Scola has already showed signs of slowing down this year and Martin isn't the most durable player. To me it made a lot more sense to get as much for them as we could right now and get pieces back they can be really good contributors in 2-4 years. Also to go back to your point most of the time to get those superstars teams want young talent not old guys. KG was trade for a young jefferson. Allen for a top 5 pick. Pau for cap space and Marc Gasol. Shaq for a much younger Odom and Butler. Right now we don't have the picks are really good young proven players like that outside of Lowry and PatPat which are people we want to hang on to.
