what use did they make of helicopters that was so insidious? also, you don't know the geography of lower manhattan very well, a helicopter would be a extremely limited use. in fact, i did an event on wall street one day back in 2000, and we had a helicopter on display in front of the exchange. it had to be trucked in.
Zuccotti Park is privately owned property. You can not pitch a tent on someone else's property and live there for two months without their consent. It is called squatting. 'public welfare concerns' has nothing to do with it, they have stolen someone else's property. The owner's have told them to get off their property. How can anyone argue the protesters have a right to live on someone else's property against the owner's will.
Sure they can! The government does it all the time. Ever hear of eminent domain? And besides, the rules of the park state that it is required to remain open to the public 24/7
The park specifically allowed OWS, and a court order demanded they be allowed to stay. Bloomberg's operation is completely illegal.
strip protest! obviously, NSFW, but SFOWS. Spoiler <iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/DSRMA_GK8eE?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Why are you so contemptuous. An unreconstructed 1 percenter? Afraid they won't be into war enough? I still wonder what is so threatening to your kind about trying to keep big money out of politics.
Not very likely. Maybe crack a couple of hundred or thousand heads, beat some people to death and and put lots of folks in jail and hospitals. If the occupiers would fire a firearm or two at the police, I wouldn't rule out tanks of helicopters.
My question do you think we would have the present day Civil Rights laws if all the supporters were as phlegmantic as you and Obama?
Judoka, do you think Ghandi was just an unruly, impatien, overly emotional man ? The same with Mandela? How about MLK?-- not the sanitized version celebrated by the mainstream media? Yes, Judoka, the economic righs of the 99% #OWS and whether our democracy will be completely corrupted by money is similarly important-- and worth ruining one's whole day over.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psyops Getting into argument loops with an anonymous person can be a huge energy drain, especially if there is no chance of changing their mind. And the financial elite would much rather have you engaging in endless dead end internet arguments than doing something more constructive, such as political fundraising or voter registration. Think of it as the Fox News version of internet trolling, create a lot of noise and hope you can distract your intended target. Neocon dirty tricks 101.
It's a PR war these days. You lose when you make people bleed on either side. So far. In my totally wild ass guess, I'd think, you would have to have some blatant election dominance where PAC money pretty clearly directs the vote to corporate candidates and we get 'clean coal tax breaks' and continued loose banking regulations, more union busting, no change in hydrocarbon energy policy, reduced access to health insurance (even private)... like that through 2016 before The People take up sabotage and the Corporations return fire. You might see some secret police stuff though where private contractors assemble 'cases' for federal jurisdictions to take leaders off the streets... if we ever get any.
One of the big names in the OWS movement is David Graeber, there was a great article about him in Bloomberg Businessweek in the 10/26 issue. I don't buy his entire premise (that debt, in and of itself, is wrong), but it is clear that there are hidden taxes on people who are poor or middle class. These taxes take the form of payday loans, overdraft protection, high interest rates, and other charges that are levied simply because they don't have as much money as other people. Then there is the "parasite" charge, which is just plain silly. I haven't seen many in the OWS movement asking for handouts, they want jobs, they want to work for a living and get paid for their labors. That isn't parasitism, that is capitalism. "Socialism" is only an argument in and of itself when used on Fox "News." Sane people recognize that elements of socialism have been successfully integrated into our society as well as many others over the course of recorded history. Some of the things that OWS is advocating could be described as socialism, but if you want sane people to agree with you, it would behoove you to actually break down these policies and describe why they would be detrimental. BTW, the biggest thing I have seen them advocate for is accountability among the people who crashed our economy in 2007, you know, the same people who are today getting millions of dollars in bonuses while the rest of us pick up the pieces of the economy they brought to the brink? I just had to pull this one out separately to laugh at you for decrying Warren, whose only goal has been advocacy on behalf of consumers. Are corporations the only ones who should be allowed to influence government policy in your reality? It really is. You should get some education because your ignorance is, quite frankly, embarrassing. People who are as ignorant as you are make me want to put a maple leaf flag on my backpack when I leave the country because you give us such a bad name. No, Europe (really, only a couple of countries in Europe) is "melting down" because Greece cooked the books in order to be allowed into the EU, as did Italy, to a slightly lesser extent. The fact that they are now on a common currency also removes monetary policy from their list of possible remedies, making it extremely difficult for Greece to get out of the downward spiral. Reagan and Bush implemented the biggest redistributions of wealth in our nation's history, but I highly doubt you will decry them for it because it is only "class warfare" to you people when the poor fight back. Unions aren't the problem in America today, around 12% of the labor force is unionized today and our economy was in MUCH better shape when that number was north of 50%. Of course, in America we have historically low tax rates, so this is a bunch of hooey. In addition, when the top marginal tax rate was over 90%, our economy was almost entirely free of bubbles, the middle class was booming, families could easily make ends meet on one income, and people were still able to get extremely wealthy. Again, you ignore reality. We have far fewer federal employees than we did even 30 years ago and I would argue that as we have done away with government employees and made the government less responsive, we have also seen things go downhill in our country with regards to infrastructure, wage growth, education, and many other measures. Only if you look at Greece and Italy while ignoring the rest of the continent. Several European countries have more income mobility than America, universal healthcare with better healthcare outcomes than the US, and more stable economies than the US. You are welcome to narrow your field of vision to only examples that fit your narrative, but it is completely apparent to the rest of us what you are doing. ...for Republicans. You're right, Republicans are scared s***less about the OWS movement because they know that, even with the many flaws exhibited by the OWS protesters thus far, fundamentally they are right. Yes, and as a result of US policies, our corporations are going to be less able to compete the longer we let the status quo continue. Corporations have to shoulder employee healthcare costs since there isn't single payer, they have to shoulder massive compensation packages for executives since the Boards are so incestuous, and they have to suffer through episodes of greed like we saw in 2007 since there are no consequences for bad actors. No, but you can refuse to subsidize or give tax breaks to companies that move American jobs overseas. History disagrees with you. See 1950-1980. In case you hadn't noticed, we have decreased regulation dramatically over the course of the last three decades. I don't know where you come up with this gem, but it shows you to be delusional. You mean some of the lowest effective corporate tax rates in the world and the lowest personal tax anywhere in the world? Even if we went back to tax rates before Reagan, our tax rates would be lower than the rest of the world and still low compared to other eras in American history. While that is certainly one of the goals, I would point out that one of the other main goals of the movement is to enforce some accountability among the people who crashed our economy in 2007, many of whom are once again receiving record breaking bonuses while the rest of us tighten our belts. I fixed that for you.
They haven't seen snow and freezing temperatures yet. Great armies have collapsed under winter. Let's see how the hippies fare when it's 10 degrees with 3 feet of snow.
Actually, those who fear this movement, like basso and tallanvil, will have more to fear when the protesters go inside and organize and raise money and register voters and evolve into a more cohesive organization.
AP News: Judge Mike Stillwell has decided the #OccupyWallStreet protesters do not have legal right to gather in Zucatti Pk Verdict to follow
