With the Series just rapping up, I figured it might be a good time to toss this out there to be kicked around. Any era ... any position... just list a few reasons why you think your man is THE man. I have to go with the "Say Hey Kid", Willie Mays. The best all around player to ever grace a playing field ..... - 660 HR - hitting for average while cranking those 660 - a gazelle with great instincts/jumps that allowed him to run down so many would be extra base hits; Willie combined this with one of the best arms the game has seen. - On the bases, Mays was a terror ....stretching singles into doubles, doubles into triples, and swiping em with the best ever. He is the ultimate "five tool player".
Babe Ruth is the GOAT. Its not close, is career OPS was a staggering 1.164. He led baseball in walks 11 of his 14 prime years, with Lou Gehrig hitting behind him. He didn't get 500 PA until his 5th season, and still set all of the records. Before becoming a hitter, was a true ace pitcher leading the league in ERA in 1916 The only player who was even close was Steroid aided Bonds. Career WAR leaders 1.Ruth 190.0 2.Bonds 171.8 3.Cobb 159.5 4.Mays 154.7 Based on how good they were in their prime my top 10 1.Ruth 2.Bonds* 3.Cobb 4.Mays 5.Mantle 6.Bench 7.Williams 8.Aaron (stellar career, but was more about consistency) 9.Griffey 10.Gehrig
Ted Williams has to be considered. He essentially lost 5 years due to 2 separate terms of military service.
In my opinion "best player" conversations for baseball should always be split into hitting and pitching categories. Best Hitter: Ty Cobb, Ted Williams Pitcher: Cy Young, Sandy Koufax Also just want to throw Josh Gibson out there. It's possible he was the greatest hitter of all-time...
Or you can just go with Ruth since he was one of the best LHPs of his era before becoming a full time RFer. That's what puts him over the top for me.
Willie Mays. He made the routine plays and the extraordinary plays. He stole bases and hit with power. And he missed almost two seasons early in his career so his stats don't really show what he could have done. Folks remember the tail end of his career, but I lived in the SF Bay Area and saw a good chunk of his prime years. Plus, he made baseball look fun (Bonds never did that). Hard to compare to Ruth, Stan Musial, or even Ted Williams, but compared to Billy Williams, or Aaron, or Clemente, or any of the newer players... it isn't even close.
Ruth, and it always will be. No player will get the same opportunity to be an ace, and the greatest slugger of all-time. Ruth was light years ahead of anyone.
Its Babe Ruth by far. Probably the most dominating year that Babe Ruth had was in 1920. That year he hit 54 home runs. The Major League team average that year was 39. Compare that with Barry Bonds who, in 2001, hit 73 home runs. That year the Major League team average was 182 home runs. Bond would have to hit 254 home runs to be as dominant as Ruth was that year.
It's difficult for me to make any comparison across generations other than to say, "who was the best relative to the era he faced." When I consider that, I can't make a legit argument for anyone other than Babe Ruth. I know the game wasn't integrated...but I have a difficult time believing Ruth doesn't hit at least 57 HR's in a year where he hit 60 because the game was integrated. Even at those sorts of numbers, he so thoroughly dominated the game, it was ridiculous. Pile on top of that what he meant to the game in the wake of the Black Sox scandal, and I think it's a no-brainer.
In my opinion, as much as I hate to say it... Roger Clemens has to be considered one of the best PITCHERS of all time. 354 career wins and 184 losses with a CAREER 3.12 ERA. And the fact that he was dominant late into his career speaks volumes. The only thing that hinders his accomplishments is all the performance enhancing crap that scarred his reputation.
Well who doesn't consider him one of the best pitchers of all time? The reason people knock him is because he appeared to be in his decline phase in the mid 90s, then reportedly started juicing and ended up going 162-73 with a 3.21 ERA, winning 4 CYAs from ages 34-44.
Pitcher - Andrew "Rube" Foster or Satchel Paige Position player - Babe Ruth or Willy Mays. Ted Williams is the greatest hitter, but he was kind of one dimensional in that respect, because he would be in the outfield practicing his swing and wasn't that great at defense.
Interesting that you would call out Williams for his defense while seemingly ignoring Ruth's. Statistically, Ruth comes up short of Williams in the outfield. That being said, Ruth does have his pitching going for him.
Yeah You're right. It was inconsistent of me. I guess Babe's overall dominance clouded my view on that point.
