Do you think we would find them making crucial mistakes in almost every instance against a good team? That's what we have with Matt. That pattern doesn't look bad to you (go back through the list...good team = pick 6, lost fumble, etc)? No QB is perfect but you at least trust the elite ones not to have a brain fart most of the time. No, I'm not really considering the games against scrub teams. We are battling a rep that we can't win games against quality opponents, as recently as last Sunday, and part of that rep and lack of faith from the fan base involves our QB making those crucial mistakes that were highlighted above. That's not a supporting list for confidence, although I do respect him for putting it together and not trying to hide the bad (against good teams) from the good (mostly against bad teams). But surely you should be able to understand why some don't think he is clutch with so many errors against quality opponents?
I don't know. I've seen a ton of brain farts by Peyton Manning in big games when he plays against great defenses.
Tons!!! Pick 6 in the superbowl against the saints comes to mind. Game against the steelers. . where the defense got the ball back took it to the 50 . . . Peyton could not move the ball 20 yrd to make the field goal more makable . . . Heck . . . .until he won the superbowl . .. I considered Peyton a CHOKER [Why did Tennessee win with T MARTIN and not Peyton??? I don't think they were more talented] Rocket RIver
The first games vs the Patriots in the playoffs he was throwing a lot of ints, also the superbowl that he won, was more because of the colts defense or stupid mistakes by grossman/bears, that gave peyton the title.
I agree. People think that Peyton being out exposes the colts but I think the biggest loss is Tony Dungy. His eye for talent . . . esp on the defensive side of the ball I think Wade being here this year showed me how important that is. Colts been coasting since TD left [Like Switzer winning a SB after JJ left] Rocket River
you're being really selective in your analysis of the games in order to proclaim that schaub makes "crucial mistakes in almost every instance against a good team". i do think schaub had a rough year last year, but even elite QBs have brain farts, and those brain farts typically come against good teams. go through any QB's 'clutch time' record against good teams with a magnifying glass and you'll find plenty of problems. I don't personally put Schaub in the elite category but he isn't far off and, like others have said, his play is the least of the texans' concerns. the numbers speak for themselves and Schaub has put up elite numbers for a couple years now. keep in mind that until this year, our offense (usually led by Schaub) has been the only reason we've even been competitive in games, and typically the only reason Schaub is even in a position to make a 'brain fart' down the clutch is because he did something positive just to get this team in position to have a shot at winning or tying the game in the clutch. to lambast him for not being able to seal the deal everytime when he's the only reason the deal is even on the table is unfair in my opinion. would we rather have drew brees or aaron rodgers? definitely. will matt cost us more games than he will win? absolutely not. if schaub has more brain farts this year in the crunch that cost us games, now that he has a legitimate defense to help shoulder the burden of winning games, then i'll agree with your assessment of schaub's clutchness.
I need to see how Matt does in playoff games. You can't simulate big game situations and the regular season games haven't really led us to anywhere, so his "clutch" moments on those games I take with a grain of salt.
Before the Colts nabbed a superbowl, Bill Simmons used to joke that a more realistic Madden would shake your controller like crazy if you had Peyton in the last two minutes of a close game.
It seems to me like the haters will just continually add qualifiers and adjust their expectations accordingly to be disappointed with Matt or make him look bad. So, I understand it, but I don't agree with it. In every instance where Matt has "brain farted" against a good team, he's also done just as much in the clutch, if not more, to help us win. Moreso than most NFL QBs do for their teams, that's for sure. Like I said, go back and look at those "elite" QBs and their clutch resumes, you might be surprised to find that their batting average is very similar to Schaub's. Or, in the case of Aaron Rodgers, even worse than Schaub. I maintain that, given a competent team around him, Schaub would be considered in the same breath as the elite. And, despite his faults, I'm tempted to say the same for Romo.
Let's all hope that the Texans get to the playoffs and provide a nice stage for Matt to show his stuff. DD
Being clutch is too often defined as how someone "comes up big" at the end of games... To me , its coming up big when needed,period... Whether we need a score in the 2nd qtr two minute drill , or after a defensive turnover... Sure Schaub is nice in the 4th qtrs but I still wouldnt define him as clutch due to his record as the Texans Qb... Its not just about some 4th qtr stats IMO
this thread is full of ridiculousness. those "comeback" situations don't matter unless you look at how it compares to other qbs. while i appreciate the work that went into them putting that together, no way i'm going down that path
Schaub is a "pretty darn good" decision-maker (channeling my inner-Kubiak) in the pocket, and that's the biggest thing you need as an NFL QB. Granted, Kubiak's offense makes it pretty much automatic if you have a QB that is somewhat competent -- it's just reading through progressions, not a lot of complicated audibles or leaving a QB with a whole field to throw to on any given play. If Schaub had a little better footwork (not speed, just able to move his feet better) and slightly better accuracy he could be special. That's what separates him from getting to a level of a guy like Tom Brady, who is not all that physically gifted. On a scale of 1-10, I'd rank him about a 7.5 or 8. Brady, Brees, Manning, and Rodgers are 10s. Rivers, Roethlisberger are 8-9.
Agreed with 98% of this, except the Big Ben part. With that o-line, he goes from a nine to a seven, which further proves that the success of a qb has a lot to do with the rest of the team. Ric, can you get "clutch" stats from Rodgers and Bree's 7-9 season, please and put the "delete" on this thread.
Manning is a great QB but his brainfarts under pressure has been one of his biggest criticisims over the course of his career.
How am I being selective? I'm picking winning teams from losing ones. Teams that are making the postseason from ones that didn't. What other criteria should I use to deem one team good or not? No QB is perfect, but I doubt I will see crucial mistakes in almost every instance when facing a quality opponent if I go look through say, Tom Brady's resume. Pick any QB that you consider to be clutch and have supreme faith in him when the game is on the line, and I doubt you will see the same when you go through their resumes. I'm not saying Matt sucks, but do I think he is "clutch" and do I feel confident in him in a big game situation? Hell no. What has he shown you for you to feel confident about him in those situations?
There are two parts to this equation: The Texans were 8-8 and 9-7 in '08 and '09, missing the playoffs by a game in '09 - so while the competition wasn't always top-notch; those were still big, must-win games for the Texans. And, frankly, looking at '10... they were 4-3 when they played San Diego; 4-4 against Jacksonville; 4-5 against the Jets (hard to believe those 3 games were in a row) - so those were big, season-saving games. And Donny is absolutely right: no QB has a sparkling "close and late" record. I would put Matt's up against anybody's - and I do mean anybody's: Brady, Manning, Brees.... I appreciate you taking the time to read and respond - but I think you're fishing to try and blow holes in the list. (And I've said previously: I would mostly agree that he hasn't been consistently great against good teams; but that wasn't the criteria.)
There is a difference between hating and legit criticism. I'm not making Matt look bad in the situations that I speak of. He is. Saying I don't trust Matt to get it done in a big situation when I can point to multiple examples of him not doing it is a legit criticism. That isn't hate, and it doesn't translate to him being a garbage QB. But I can't be on "ClutchCity" and define a man as "clutch" when his track record clearly says otherwise. As far as Rodgers, he also wasn't considered clutch until what....he finally stepped up in the postseason and got it done. Manning was considered a choker until he won the SB (he provided tons of support for the choking crowd), and even some still consider him one based on his play that postseason and that error in his last SB. And saying Romo would be considered elite based on his track record and what we have witnessed this season alone is killing your credibility (all jokes).
Speaking of brain farts, I had a massive issue with my document and inadvertently left off the Chiefs game from last year: == October 17, 2010 Kansas City Score: 21-31 Time remaining: 7:05 Result: Win, 35-31 Details: Schaub hits 11/15 for 155 yards in the 4Q including an 11-yard, game-winning pass with :28 remaining. The Texans score 21 in the 4Q to wipe out 24-14 deficit at the end of 3Qs.
