Army Ranger Kills Himself--- before we get too excited about Obama foreign policy

Cuz Obama's main policy during his election campaign was that he would bring home the troops by 2011.

 

It's a unrealistic logic tho. One I am sure Obama felt strongly about. But we can't just throw every thing down and turn our backs to Iraq, we at least owe them that.

It doesn't matter if served 95% under Bush or Obama. The fact of the matter is, George Bush deployed our troops there. There is no realistic logically strategy for pulling troops out over night. It just can't be done.

 

I’m not going to sit here and argue the rights and wrongs of this war. And you’re a complete fool if you think I, ex-military from a family of military, go around characterizing this war as a “thing”. So just get all pissy for nothing if you wish.

But understand I was not talking about war in general, but all aspects of life…hence the term and the quotations. And if you're still not happy about it, well, then, piss off partner.

 

No, but you will sit here and criticize those who weren't cut out for the "thing."

In June, I lost one of my best friends in Iraq. When I say "one of", I mean "one of two." The three of us were damned close. Two of us stayed behind, one of us went. Now, there's only two of us.

I don't hold my friend's decision against him. He had been to Afghanistan and Iraq, twice. When he came home to visit, he never talked about what he'd done overseas, because it was obvious he didn't enjoy it. He chose to go back a third time because he felt that he was doing a service to his country. He never came home.

Well, he did, but it was in a box and we watched him go into the ground.

Compare that to my girlfriend's brother-in-law, who came back from his deployment to laugh while he told stories about gunning down civilians (families, no less). You could make the argument that he laughs to keep from killing himself as others have done. You could make the argument that maybe he's just a sociopath. He's recently redeployed (presumably to kill more civilians).

Either way, I'd trade his life for my friend's in a second. In less than a second.

So tell me again who's cut out for war, and who's not, since you refuse to discuss the fact that neither of those men should have been over there in the first place.

While you're at it, piss off, yourself.

 

Bush put us in those wars; and you can't just unilaterally pull out without causing all kinds of undesirable fallout. And even so, Obama has wound down the Iraq occupation and plans on doing the same in Afghanistan soon, without yielding to the temptation to open any new theatres for our ground forces in the meantime.

But even so, I don't think a country decides on what wars to fight based on the military suicide rate. I think this suicide rate might be a useful anecdote in a discussion of how the military supports it's soldiers, and the treatment it provides for PTSD. To not pursue our foreign policy interests because the military health policies are somewhat lacking is the tail wagging the dog.

 

Excellent post. This story is very tragic and something all of us should take to heart. I would like nothing more than to have every single US troop back in the US but we have look at things are and they say is that a realistic expectation? Would that actually makes us any safer?

The truth about war is that people die. That's why it should be avoided as much as possible but it doesn't mean that war will never happen or there aren't sometimes reasons for going to war. We can debate all along about those reasons but we should never forget the truth that people die.

For this thread frankly I find it rather flippant use of this tragedy to score political points considering the wording of this thread is a direct play on another thread. We could discuss the many issues this tragedy raises but the title of it has made it a political shot right from the start.

 

Agreed. Although the two issues are not entirely mutually exclusive, it would be unfair to pin the rising suicide rate on Obama. Suicide in the military and for veterans is an issue that needs to be tackled separately, and is not a justification in and of itself for ending conflicts.

As for pulling out of war, that is an entirely separate debate. "Cut and run" is one of those terms thats been use to delegitimize it as a strategy, but at this point the objectives for staying- particularly in Afghanistan- are growing weary. It was once said that Afghanistan is where empires go to die, and part of me wishes Obama would have a quick surge which will invariably result in some immediate success, claim victory, and bring the troops home....

 

Your friend signed the dotted line bro. Been there and done that. Still doing that. Above all........your friend that died.......signed the line.

Sorry he died. But he liked chess. He made a great pawn. Like a few million others. He was cut out for 'it'.

Judging by your emotional response......stick to college son.

 

My friend did sign the dotted line. I'm glad that you've done that and are still doing that. I hope all our troops come home.

Sorry you feel that you're just a pawn. He liked playing darts most.

He was good at it, too.

You're damned straight he was cut out for "it."

He was a warrior.

My post was meant to question the fact that a lunatic can come back from war and laugh, while a totally sane, totally decent person would be blown up by a roadside bomb, yet somebody else could sit back and say that another (totally unrelated) soldier couldn't handle a "thing."

As to your response, don't call me son, f*****.

EDIT: I meant the word that begins with F and ends with R, in case anybody wants to ban me for the other 6-letter F word.

 

You can also probably put the blame on the American electorate who supported entering the Afghan war in 2001 (though their permission wasn't requested) and voted in Obama despite his campaign promises of more military focus on Afghanistan. I don't know how many different ways I can tell you this, but this and all the other military suicides does not delegitimize the wars we chose to enter. Perhaps Iraq was Bush's war, but we're wrapping that one up; Afghanistan is something we as a people essentially chose twice, and fought with a volunteer army.

 

haha....
I like Basso and some of the things he posts I agree with.. well I even agree with glynch on some issues too...
but hell your chart is pretty awesome.. repped

It is funny how no matter what the topic is and how much of a stretch it is some posters always want to make it a political issue..

 

Even the elite ones who were in charge of million dollar equipment have trouble holding a simple job like parking cars.

 

At least Glynch is capable of writing a coherent paragraph and while I dont agree with him a lot, I at least get the impression that he's not a troll or a moron. Basso's posts consist of links to blogs/articles, cliched internet memes or answers to other posts in the form of irrelevant non-responsive questions.

I've seen Basso post drawn out and well written stuff in GARM so he's clearly not a robot (I think) but I haven't seen him display any such effort in D&D in several years. He functionally trolls constantly now.

So to suggest they're both the same is a bit (actually quite a bit) unfair.

 

regardless if the suicide rate in the military is very high and if its true or not.. I totally agree let's BRING THEM HOME!!!

I think that might be my main voting issue this next election. Whoever promises they can actually do that has my vote. Sadly I dont think any of the Repubs can promise that and Obama has but hasnt done a thing. OH WELL

 

Remind me how he's been deceitful? Just because you and so many leftists thought he would leave the wars immediately, don't blame him because you didn't do the research.

He said he wanted to emphasize Afghanistan. He did. He said he wanted to draw down from Iraq. We have, and contrary to leftist-libertarian fantasy world, we are not going to charge out of Iraq immediately, and Iraq seems to be relatively stable now. And he said he was willing to go into Pakistan to fight Al-Qaeda. We have, and with great success.

Obama's been pretty honest about the whole thing, people just weren't listening.

 

If a war is NOT justifiable under just war policy..... when the heck is a war justifiable?

Or do I even want to know your answer to this question?