I read through that again. My fault for the initial interpretation. Admit wrong here. However, for the net rating of on/off for that year, Luol Deng still is higher than Rose. Again, that stat you provide doesn't tell much, as you have to take into account the unit that player plays with more often than not. Nash/Rondo are considered the superstar PGs. So no, you're comparing him to stars again. I never said AB was a star that year, nor will he ever be one. Jason Terry is considered a good player. He also has very little impact when he can't find his jumpshot. Or unless you consider Jason Terry a mediocre player? And he can start on quite a few teams right now. Brandon Jennings is another good player. He also struggles to impact a game with his inconsistent jumpshot. He's a starter for the Bucks, who led them to the playoffs in his first year. Or do you consider him mediocre? Mike Bibby in his prime couldn't impact a game if he couldn't make his jumpshot. And he was a starter for a top 2 team in the league. Or do you consider him mediocre?
He did pretty good that year as our scorer. That does not change the fact that he is simply a decent scorer. If he was a "good scorer" his offensive game will not start and end with his 3pt barrage. Like I said, you either fail really hard at reading comprehension or you are trying to nit pick and failing hard at that. I don't understand how what I am saying is very hard to understand. Let me spell it out for you one last time: - He did a pretty good job fulfilling his scoring assignment that season. On a team where the best scorer behind him was Scola and then Budinger, I honestly thought he would score more. Some one has to end up with the points. - He is only decent because he is a one trick pony. He starts and ends his offensive game with his shot. Granted it is a pretty good trick and can excel with the right offensive schemes, but it makes him only decent and not good. He did pretty good that year, but he is a decent scorer and not a good player. Get it now?!? - If the NBA landscape truly thought he was a pretty good player or a pretty good scorer, more teams would be interested. We ended up trading a "MIP player" for a backup PG. What does that tell you of what the league actually thinks about him? The league is full of players that have "breakout" years and then resume being mediocre. The league is also full of players who can score and do little else. Those are typically bench players or 6th men. As of now, AB is nothing special.
First point, do not know if serious. He averaged 20 points that year, and you wanted MORE? Derrick Rose averaged 5 more points with LESS offensive help. So you wanted AB to put up 24-25 points? He'd be a Derrick Rose then. Second point, I named you several players who are one-trick ponies. And they are considered good players. Your expectations for AB were too high then. Third point, teams were not interested in him last year b/c he sucked last year. SUCKED. If he was a FA when 09-10 ended, it would have been a different story.
I'm going to end with these vids that describe his role: he was asked to "take over games." A player of his stature has no business doing that. But he tried that year, and did good. <iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/OxFxVSRIXPM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe> <iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/8bSdhTH8NLQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe> <iframe width="560" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/cv_KbQ_zdrk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Answered a post I had missed but you pointed to anyways. Like most posters on this forum, you seem to be confusing scoring points and helping the team. Scoring is simply one facet to this game and scoring a lot does not make you good. I will take Rose's actual contributions to his team in terms of leadership, playmaking, and scoring over the PPG column any day. He only has one thing he does well and if my expectations of him not doing great in that ONE area, then yes, maybe I really am expecting too much from him. Of course it is too much to ask for a PG to do more than shoot right? One trick ponies are fine in the NBA as long as the team can cover their weaknesses. There have been lots of players who sucked one year and still are sought after. It is because teams recognize they are still good, just having a bad year. AB showed us what he could do. More importantly, he also showed what he does not do and that outweighs heavily anything that he can do, shoot the ball.
What? I thought Morey was worried about him getting too big an offer on the open market, are you now saying that all the other NBA teams will not be pursuing Aaron Brooks, because you believe he is a one trick pony? (Your words). Wow - I guess we shall see when the lockout is lifted, and if any teams go after him....Sacremento - cough cough. DD
The point I was making is that, if AB is good as some of the posters are making him out to be, the demand for AB at the trade line would have been much higher regardless of his "off year" that season. I have always believed he was a one trick pony. We have had our rows about this before. Do I think there will be high demand for him? Maybe, there are many the dumb GM's in the league. Will he succeed with his new contract and starting role? Like I said, with the way he is currently, I highly doubt he will until he (like I have said) he makes some serious realizations or improvements.
So that is your out, that if he somehow succeeds he will have improved? If he goes back to his 09-10 levels, I would think there are a LOT of NBA teams that would want him and be happy to have him. Every player has strenghts and weaknesses, you just have to build a mix around all of them to compliment and in some cases hide those weaknesses and augment those strengths. Both AB and Lowry have had good NBA seasons.....my guess is that they will both have very good NBA careers. DD
Well that is any player's out. My argument is that with his existing skill set and style, he is not going to go anywhere. If he changes the rules and the landscape by improving, we are no longer dealing with the same situation. Just because sometimes people cannot change or improve, does not mean that the possibility does not exist. With his current skills, he is a mediocre player. The only reason why he did so "well" during 2009-2010 was because he was the scorer by default. He had a chance to prove he could do so again last season off the bench like Terry, but showed us with his poor attitude he wasn't having any of that. So let me ask you this then: How many teams do you know will hand the offensive reigns to a player and designate him as the primary option (basing offensive schemes off his style) when AB: - Has not proven anything yet save one breakout season where the next proven scorer was Scola - Has poor to none defensive abilities - Cannot finish strong or well at the rim - Is undersized with a slight frame - Has questionable passing decisions and poor court vision - Shows signs of maturity and poor attitude when things don't go his way - Walked out on his team I don't know too many competent GM's or coaches that will trust in AB now or ever to base their game around him. He is simply no where close to being that type of player. That is reserved to young players who show real star power. If the GM's or coaches don't figure that out from the get go and actually sign him to big contract, mark my words, they will be trying to trade him soon after. AB is not in a position or possessing the ability to be the primary scorer. On a defensive minded team with an existing playmaker and ball handler, he could become a secondary option. As he currently is and has shown to be, I honestly don't see how anyone can call him as anything more than a mediocre player.
Also, to your point about many strengths and weaknesses. I agree with you about that point. The thing about AB is he has way too many weaknesses and way too few strengths. His weaknesses can be argued to completely outweigh his strengths. Weakness: - Size and frame; he is too small and slight to bump anyone off. This affects his finishing ability, something he needs to learn to adjust to. - Finishing ability; he is a poor finisher and resorts to circus shots and floaters when he runs into danger. - Poor court vision and passing; you can argue as much about this as you want, but his stats prove and games prove my point. - Poor adaptability; he does not try to change his game to match the flow of the game or the needs of the team. He just simply keeps shooting. - Attitude (?); he is young so I will give him the benefit of the doubt for now. Strengths: - Shooting range; he has a long range and he is accurate to boot - Speed; not many people are faster than him - Scoring mentality; the guy's brain is all about putting the ball in the hoop. You cannot always teach this. - High stamina; able to play a lot of games
Here is Brooks not drawing multiple defenders against a terrible defense and being a one-trick pony: <iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/dOtV9zatazk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Uh... serious? What I saw there was AB trying and failing to split two defenders after a solid pick, almost losing the ball in the process. He manages to regain it and the two defenders are luckily behind him. Let's face it, if he had lost it there and he easily could have, we would be going what the hell?!? Paul Pierce meanwhile was already lagging far away from Wafer on the wing even before AB got to the perimeter thought he saw a fumbled dribble and took a gamble on the steal attempt. He recovered decently but had unfortunately had slid to the right earlier to try to recover fumbled ball. This blocks AB's left forward line of sight leaving only three players in his right forward line of sight, two of which are conveniently in bright red jerseys (one is actually a giant) and the other one blatantly wide open on the wing. If anything, this was a complete defensive break down by Paul Pierce. First he leaves his marked man, a dude that had been 3 of 5 from the 3pt line the entire night. You don't sag off a 3pt threat when the game is on the line and the other team is bringing up the ball, ever! Then he tries to take a gamble and lunge for the ball that AB almost lost. While I can understand the urge to grab the steal, end the game, and make the heroic defensive play of the night, the safer bet would be to funnel him from the right side to stay between his line of sight and Wafer on the wing. Yao's defender will then sag off to where Pierce would be funneling AB to, completely cutting him off, forcing AB to have to pass out behind.
See, there is no winning with the Anti AB people, he made a game winning play there against a great defensive team, was it easy? Nope, but he did the right thing and it worked.....yet...somehow.....it had nothing to do with his skills. Mind boggling...... I mean, hell, why is it you have to be ANTI AB, to be a Lowry fan? Why not like them both, and their different skillsets? IMO, they are both championship caliber PGs, depending entirely upon whom their team has on it. They are far different players, neither is anything more than an above average role player, but they are both good players in their own way. DD
AB is suffering from the same problem every Rockets player, both with the team, and after they have left, has suffered through when they hurt the team with either an overabundant ego, a snit over playing time, losing their starting position, or a combination of them all. Look at the guy who hit the dagger in TheFreak's video, Von Wafer. Once he'd had an immature outburst aimed at the coach at the worst possible moment, the writing was on the wall. Wafer was either going to be cut or moved. Some didn't like it when the inevitable happened, but for many here it was no surprise, and for many here, he needed to be history. Certainly, I was one of them. Look at how some folks view Vernon Maxwell after the end of the second championship season, when Max couldn't handle losing his starting spot to Drexler. With AB, it was his reaction to losing his starting position, after an injury, to Lowry. He could have handled it as a pro, sucked it up, and fought hard as hell to prove he deserved that starting gig back, but he didn't. He acted out on the bench, he clearly expressed his displeasure during games, and he played like crap when he was on the court. After that, AB lost a lot of friends here. I still like him and actually thought he'd have a good role as a 6th man/instant offense guy, but he didn't produce. I don't think it should surprise anyone that he gets beat up in the GARM when he comes up as a topic. Heck, I'd still like him as an offensive weapon off the bench, but the bridges have been burnt to blue blazes. Short of a miracle, he's regulated himself to a discussion topic when that one terrific season and post-season are talked about. It's time to move on.
AB is your typical divisive player among fans. He combines amazing talent with little understanding of how to actually play the game.
How do you call fumbling his dribble after a strip attempt when backed by a pick and then passing to a blatantly open player a definition of skill? How do you call a play where Pierce sags off so far from his marked man, a 3pt threat on fire from down town that night, and then goes from the gamble steal anything but a defensive breakdown? If he had split the defender clean, juked Pierce, and fed Wafer a clean pass, then yeah I would be like damn that was a good play. Also, for every good play he gives us tons of really bad ones as well. One last thing, just because he makes some of those contested long bombs does not make it a good play.
You want a lack of understanding, I mean read this thread....I would hazard that most people here have very little actual understanding, or ever played the game at much of a competitive level. In fact, AB probably knows how to play the game better than 99.9% of the people on this board, myself included. Heck he probably knows a hell of a lot more about playing the game than most everyone in the Rox organization including Morey.... Come on, this is getting ridiculous. DD
What? Ok..you mean it is not a play you like. Yet, he was doing EXACTLY what the coaching staff was asking him to do. Meh, waste of time. DD
