I don't really know why wekko made that comparison with those players. Again, if Yao was healthy for most of his career, and with the same playoff success, I wouldn't mind having his # retired. It's all about legacy with a team, which is my problem. Yao's legacy around the league is: an injury-prone center. That's the first thing that comes into people's minds, especially Rocket fans. He played in 74% of the total Rocket games in his career; but only 59% of the total games in the last 5 seasons. I just don't agree with retiring a player's jersey with that type of legacy.
Let's use Barkley for example, he got his number retired by Auburn, the Sixers and the Suns. And he brought in 1 billion people who hated him at one point in time. Nobody started a "Would we retire Hakeem's jersey?" article. Sounds like if you have to ask then it's not a sure thing in your head either.
Isn't Basketball HOF much easier to get in compared to the Major League Baseball HOF? He has a chance.
I was responding to the guy who said that a jersey shouldnt be retired unless the player makes a significant contribution to winning. Since none of the players I listed won championships, then by his logic, their jerseys shouldnt be retired.
There's a huge difference between one playoff series win, and always going deep in the playoffs. He played a full 82 in his first 2 years.
And your argument is specious at best. There is no predecessor for Yao. No one has opened his owner's wallets as widely as Yao did. But that does not mean he belongs in Houston Rockets Basketball Jersey Lore. Economic lore, sure. But that is it.
Ignore economic benefits. Focus on basketball achievements. 5 all-nba teams with one team and a good relationship with management. Has there been such a player who hasn't had his jersey retired?
Carl, I want to look at my organization as one whom believes in CHAMPIONS. I don't want to have numbers retired of good guys. Shoot...Chuck, Shane, Bobby Joe Reid, Tmac, Francis, and a host of others were all "good to Houston" in there own individual rights. But I don't care about that in terms of having their jerseys retired. That should, imo, be reserved for those that contributed to the highest levels of success. Whereby has Yao done that? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
A good example is Grant Hill. He was a 6-time NBA all-star, and 5-time all-nba selection (with 1 1st team) with the Pistons. His prime was basically with the Pistons. And Grant had a much bigger impact on the pistons more than Yao with us in terms of on the court. He left the Pistons on great terms. I don't think he'll have his jersey retired. Shawn Kemp was a 6-time all-star, 3-time all-nba, played 8 seasons with the Sonics. And there is not a very high chance that his jersey will be retired by the Sonics, and he co-led the Sonics to one Finals. Again, wekko, please tell me what Yao will be remembered most for his time as a Rocket?
How many 1st team selections in a center depraved era? And who gives a damn that you get along with your boss and make him a billionaire, from a fans standpoint? I root forand support winners in the W and Games Played column.
Looking at the least, even Avery Johnson got his number retired. However they all had more playoff success than Yao. Name one player who has gotten their Jersey retired while only winning one playoff series in his whole career.
I do. There's 0 chance. Seattle doesn't have a basketball team anymore, and OKC isn't going to retire a player that didn't play for it's franchise. The same can be said for Gary Payton. He'll be remembered as the first great Chinese basketball player who happened to be 7'5. Players around that height will be remembered for their height. When I think of Gheorghe Muresan, I don't think about his injuries. I remember him as the huge Romanian guy who was on the Bullets and starred in "My Giant" with Billy Crystal.
A center-depraved era that happened to include a prime Shaquille O'Neal. Since jersey retirement is a decision made by management, a player's relationship with the team's management is crucial.
Michael Jordan had his number retired by the Miami Heat without playing a single game for them. But who cares? Retiring a jersey is an individual honor. Why are you trying to base it on team achievements?
When did Calvin Murphy and Rudy T win CHAMPIONSHIPS as players? They came closer, but ultimately were not CHAMPIONS. And no need to get falsely dramatic about "the road to hell." Thinking that retiring a player's jersey is taking any team to hell is just laughable. The fact that the Rockets have not, so far, in your view soiled themselves with jersey retirements didn't make the Steve Francis era any better and isn't convincing any stars to join an organization basis that their jersey retirements are about CHAMPIONS. The fact that the Warriors didn't soil themselves by retiring Chris Mullin's (who never got past the 2nd round) jersey didn't make them a first class organization all about CHAMPIONS and the fact that the new Warriors owners said they will retire his number next season don't make this new ownership second rate. The Clippers have not elevated themselves by retiring no one's jersey numbers at all, nor did any number of retirement of arguably unqualified players condemn organizations forever (Mark Eaton had is jersey retired as a specialist/role player, Malik Sealy and Drazen Petrovic got their jersey retired due to their untimely death, Buck Williams only got to the 2nd round once as a NJ Net and got his jersey retired by the team). Jersey retirements are somewhere between, cynically, a marketing gimmick and, less cynically, a way to honor star players who performed with excellence and heart for the organization. Maintaining some imagined high standard for retired jerseys to make some fans feel better about themselves isn't going to make your team better in the short or the long run. Jersey retirement standards just ain't that big a deal. On the other hand, honoring a star player who gave 100% even when he failed to bring a title would make a statement to players about how the team appreciates its warriors. It's somewhat gimmicky, but it's an angle that Pat Riley worked hard at last summer and succeeded.
Because most Rockets fans don't give a crap about individual achievements. Yao doesn't mean anymore to me than Steve Francis. Neither one of them are anything more than wasted potential.
Mkay, so one antagonist to his injury riddled era? Did he defeqt Shaq on the biggest of stages? Would an "injury riddled" Larry Holmes have been one of boxing's recognized alltime greats (HOF), by any stretch of the imagination? No. He had to go out and beat his competiton at the highest level. He had to beat the Michael Spinks' and old Ali's of the era to earn the still controversial spot that he has now, in boxing lore. This...and Holmes actually was NOT injury prone. Yao, in his healthy tenure...albeit short, did not ascend to those heights. He didnt defeat Shaq in the playoffs. He didn't lead the Rockets to the promised land. I wished he had, but he didn't. So as far as I'm concerned, NO.
