to start, i think hakeem is arguably a top 2 2-way player of all time along with michael jordan so it tells you where i think he is ranked. i think he's better than shaq but you don't go around calling people r****ds b/c they think shaq is better. there is a legit argument for that too. if you purely judge by the skills you mentioned, a long of people were better than shaq (i.e patrick ewing, david robison...). we're talking about basketball dominance and shaq was one of the most dominant players we have seen--he changed the freakin' rule book. his statline is ridiculous, 4 rings, 1 MVP (could have won every year for a 5 year stretch), 3 finals MVP... it isn't like calling david robinson over hakeem, now those are r****ds. shaq deserves his props. listen to the evidence/actual numbers on shaq's side before you post.
No one on this board said dirk is top 10, I started the thread because I live in Dallas and have heard everyone up here saying Dirk is the #2 PF all time and does this make him top 10 all time.. I'm sure not all Dallas fans feel this way but I've heard it from a lot of people so I wanted to see what everyone thought..
Even if he was rated as the #1 PF of all time, I still don't think that would put him in the top 10. And naming him #2 is a stretch. Is Tim Duncan a top 10 player, all-time?
I am German and a Nowitzki fan... no way I put him in the top10. Top20? Yes, I`d strongly consider that, but no way that he is a top10 player.
LeBron did so bad he dropped all the way to 48. People are such prisoners of the moment. LeBron should be in top 15-22. How is Dirk better than Elvin Hayes, Rick Barry, and Dwight Howard. Karl Malone over Moses? That's a f#cking shame. Akeem and Wilt are way too low. Jason Kidd at 19 Paul Pierce at 32
What the...? Seriously? Wow. One of the greatest defensive PGs of all time, just a triple double threat throughout most of his career, turned around every franchise he ever played for (notice how every team Kidd played for got good as soon as he joined and bad as soon as he left). I wouldn't put Kidd in my top 25 but Bron has years to go before surpassing JKidd.
I personally think that in order to be there, you just have to be able to withstand the test of time. Kidd has while all of these young guys (LBJ included) have not yet. Grant Hill at one point looked like a sure-fire HOFer and I am sure there were kids ranking him in their top 20 of all time but look at what ended up happening (sad story, extreme case but just an example). Same with TMac/Jermaine O. Maybe LBJ has had some better individual seasons than Kidd but to say that he has had a better career, I just have to disagree with.
1) every year lebron has been in the NBA, he has put up 20, 5, 5. EVERY single year. since his 2nd year, he has put up AT LEAST, 26, 6, 6. 2) he has had at least 7 seasons where he is a top 10 player, and been arguably the best player for the past 4 seasons. jkidd has never had one season where he was considered arguably the best player in the L. and lebron has been considered the best at his position since his 2nd year in the L. 3) lebron has won 2 MVPs; jkidd has 0. 4) lebron has 7 all-nba selections, jkidd has 6 total. 5) lebron already has 3 all-nba 1st team defense; jkidd has 4 total 6) both lost twice in the finals as the lead dog. grant hill, tmac... had potential, but they never achieved the things lebron did for this long (8 years total now) individually or even close to them. lebron is NOT going off potential anymore. he IS arguably the best player right now. the more he plays, the more individual accolades he will accumulate. that's a fact. more MVPs, all-nba 1st teams... the only thing missing from his resume is a ring or two (or more).
The best player would not wilt like a flower in the fourth quarter. He is not even the best player on his own team.
i'm sure you are old enough to remember "tragic magic" right? lebron has some mental problems to resolve, but he's 26. he will eventually resolve them.
It doesn't matter. He has the potential to become one of the best ever, and he probably will be (barring injuries). Right now, he is not.
you don't need to win a ring to be one of the best ever. charles barkley, karl malone, patrick ewing, gary payton, chris webber are all some of the greatest to play the game of basketball. judging by career achievements as of RIGHT NOW, lebron is better than jason kidd.
Bron choked but this is ridiculous. He is the best player in basketball that happened to play his worst when it mattered most. He has plenty of time, barring injury, to redeem himself. Magic in the 84 Finals is a perfect example.
