Well Obama has been or is prosecuting 4 other "leak" cases in addition to the Drake case. It seems like Drake is the most outspoken person about it. My guess is because the other 4 are quaking enough at the prospect of spending 40-life in a federal pound me in the ass prison and are listening to their lawyers to stfu.
i should have been more clear. i would like to see the other side of the argument on the government prosecuting whistle blowers as it pertains to national security. i don't think its a simple case of vengence
Apparently you want this issue to be your own liberal jerk circle. Sorry for getting in the thread to show support.
It occurs to me that on the War on Terror, libertarians and "liberals" should be on the exact same page concerning extrajudicial rendition, torture, warrentless wiretap, and unnecessary warfare, as well as concern about the growing influence of the "national security" lobby.
I give Ron Paul a lot of credit for his consistency that said Ron Paul isn't the end all and be all of Republicans or conservatives. In fact from what I know of Paulites is that they are mutually hostile towards the Republican and conservative establishment. While you are right that there are a group of libertarian thinking conservatives out there who are against these type of measures I don't think they are a majority of those who identify as conservative. Given that Texas didn't bother to have a law regarding to disapprove of the erosion of liberties that were taking place under the previous Admin. I have a hard time seeing the current Republican dominated Texas government as looking at this as primarily a principled stand free of politics. Like it or not most of the criticism of the erosion of civil liberties have been coming from those who identify as liberals. To guys like Rhad and Jo Mama's credit they have been consistent under both GW Bush and Obama in this regard. In the meantime most conservative posters generally were supportive of these programs under GW Bush and at the moment are generally keeping quiet on the issue.
A thread doing virtually nothing but blasting Obama is a "liberal jerk circle"? You made an offhand and irrelevant comment that Bush supporters were opposed to the programs lamented in this thread. All I did was indicate such was a dubious assertion. I was not the only one to say as much, and I made it perfectly clear why I thought this was true, and that it was probably subjective (thus the word choice you ignored). Apparently you wanted to turn a perfectly reasonable comment into something else, no doubt to feel good in "cracking" the latest elitist "liberal" cause with some sort of conservative martyrdom routine. It's silly and counterproductive. Bush started these programs, strengthened them, lied about them, and sold them via fear. Obama is continuing them with basically the same methodology, and is now punishing anyone who speaks out. The only one who bothered to bring any sort of "right vs left" horse**** into such a non-partisan cause was you, when you baited rocketsjudoka with the nonsensical and unsupportable claim of "bipartisan dissent". The only dissent I see is from folks I would generically consider anti-partisans, those who are focused on civil liberties sans political feuds or boundaries - the EFF, greenwald, ACLU, Chomsky, etc. The kind of folks more interested in the human condition, liberty, and equality than some utterly trivial political "points" game. And this makes sense, given the two-headed nature of our rapidly de-democratizing government. Neither a staunch republican or democrat is guiltless here. In summary, no, this is not a partisan cause. The only partisan aspects (until recently) are factual, e.g., Bush's involvement in the programs; Obama's continuation and support for them. That being said, as I noted in the first post of this thread, there is peculiar silence from the right regarding this cause, which is absolutely understandable, given the circumstances under which these programs arose and were justified. That's not to say that they don't disagree as you claim, but it does label them cowards for not voicing as much during Bush's tenure.
Uhh no actually all I did was come in and make a comment about how I thought it was curious how the media is laying off this subject even when it has such wide opposition. See here http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showpost.php?p=6128489&postcount=161 You confused me as saying both sides of politicians hate it and I corrected you in stating my comments were directed to the people as even the most right wingers were also against it. Sishir was the one who came in here ranting about Bush and other partisan crap. At least blame the right people for the crap fight.
Well, you did post this: I noted that, yet doubted the (corrected) claim too, as stated previously. You brought it up. Sishir responded basically the same as I did: he doubted the claim was true. He was simply more vehement about it. Anyhow, as I mentioned above (and you ignored), this is a dumb sidebar. I do hope you stay involved in the thread though, casey, as these issues are truly important.
Obama has done well lately on handling things .i.e. Killing Osama bin Laden, not attacking gun rights, finally giving Syria negative treatment, shutting up trump the idiot... Many people excuse airport security measures as a way to keep us safe. Obama is doing that as well but I know there are valid arguments. Anyhow Obama is starting to look better in my view...we just have to get this economy turned around.
Incorrect. Not until my 4th post on the page did I mention Bush. Sishir is the one who brought him up. I responded to his. How did you miss that? What you quoted me above was my 5th post and only in response to this.
Well heck, I brought up that sentiment in the OP... Arguably, referencing the GOP brings Bush into the conversation one way or another. Bush deserves the lion's share of the blame (and his supporters accordingly, to a certain extent) but Obama is not any better - although you could argue his supporters were duped. Whatever. He-said-she-said is intolerably useless when both are ****ing you over. Stephen Walt on Imperial Secrecy:
You did write "bipartisan opposition", I pointed out why that isn't really the case. Then you asked me to prove my counter to your point which I did. Also keep in mind people had mentioned Bush several times in this thread long before my post that you are citing. I agree though, this is a sidebar.
The New Yorker has another good piece up, this time regarding the Obama admin's absurd plan to charge Assange under the espionage act. Fitting that the most unamerican anti-democratic law in the USA is used by the Obama admin against "transparency". It's also interesting to note that even now the media is still reluctant to point out how blatantly Lamo betrayed Manning. Excerpts:
