for what... his place among the greats wont change...Even if he wins one, people will still say he lacks something because of today's NBA...
Dirk's lack of rebounding, defense, and low post play always annoyed me. People don't realize how difficult it's been for the Mavs front office to build around him. To compensate for his shortcomings (and have a chance at winning a championship) he needs good defenders at all other positions, a great rim protecting big man next to him, and a good playmaking point guard. It's not like building around the other greats of his time (Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Lebron,etc). The 1-2 punch with another big star and mediocre role players wouldn't work with him. With all that being said, he's impossible to stop offensively and undoubtedly one of the all time greats.
No one's arguing that Pierce or Allen are all-time great PF's. I'm saying that people call Dirk a choker/soft, but when he and Garnett were in similar situations, Dirk was able to lead his team farther into the playoffs. Garnett CONTRIBUTES to a great run in Boston. He's not leading anything. Also, Garnett's an absolute prick. :-D
Well, yeah, because who the f was with Garnett in Minny? Give him two half-decent players in Sprewell and Cassell and he grabs the #1 seed and takes the Puppies to the WCF. I'd rank Dirk behind McHale, Garnett, Malone, and Duncan. Tied with Barkley.
Its hard to build a championship-level team, in general. But the Mavs are perennially a 50 win team, and the only constant I see with that on the floor is Dirk Nowitzki.
When it was Nash/Finley/Dirk going against Garnett/Cassell/Wally/Spree? It's been so long, but weren't those roughly the cores of that time period? Look. I'm not saying Dirk is without fault. I've just always been one to not GET the Garnett infatuation. People have always called him tough. I see a guy who's fake-tough. I just don't respect the guy. And I don't think I've ever seen him take over a game offensively like Dirk can do. I absolutely concede that rebounding/defense goes to Garnett. But when your team needs points, I just never felt like Garnett wanted to carry a team offensively. Once again, perfect for Boston when it's more of an all-star caliber lineup. But when he was carrying the load, when it came playoff time, I just wasn't impressed from THAT side of the court.
The same guy who immediately turned Chicago into the top defensive team in the league when he became their coach.
right because he guards players on the pick n rolls.. I dont undervalue Thibodeaux's value, but Garnett brought that mentality to them...
I always forget Nowitzki's name when it comes to the best PFs. I usually have him as a tall small forward, a la Larry Bird. If we list Nowitzki as a small forward, I have him top 3-4 all-time.
It's quite funny to cite this as a criteria considering the top 4 players often mentioned for All-Time Power Forward status includes non-championship winners Karl Malone and Charles Barkley. If it weren't for going to Boston, Garnet would have been in that same group.
So does Barkley and Malone McHale wasn't even the best player on his team. Well, I guess that part acceptable when you got Bird but still.
I have said this many, many times. I still don't get why people are so attached to traditional positional label. Just because a guy is a 7-footer doesn't mean he's a center or a power forward. You've got to look at his offensive game. Dirk is definitely a wing player. That's why asking how he is ranked as a PF doesn't really do justice to his game.
Right now Dirk is level with Barkley, a hair below KG, and not approaching Malone or Duncan yet. However, he will almost certainly have several more very good years, at which point I think he'll find himself a comfortable #3 above Garnett and below Malone.
Correct. Also, Dirk has been much better about going inside the last few years. Still, imo, great playmaking and great offensive/defensive low post play are key to winning a championship. So, I think, Dirk is THE reason that team has been so good for so long. It's just that he lacks key skills that the superstars on championship teams often have. Kobe doesn't need a Nash or Kidd. Duncan doesn't need a Tyson Chandler. It's not that I don't think he's great, I just feel you're more likely to win a championship with a player who has those key skills, even if he's a less talented player overall. OK, let's go with the 03-04 season Garnett/Cassell/Wally/Sprewell/Hudson/Hoiberg vs. Dirk/Finley/Nash/Jamison/Walker/Howard....are you kidding me??? The year before that KG led that same team minus Cassell and Sprewell to 51 wins. The truth is, you (and many more) hate Garnett's attitude and you refuse to give him credit unless it's painfully obvious (like saying he's a better rebounder/defender than Dirk)
Dirk is not better than McHale. McHale could score and was a damn good defender. Dirk can't spell defense. The same goes for KG, who is also a better passer. The only way you can choose Dirk over all Malone, Barkley, KG and McHale is if you care about scoring and scoring only. That's Dirk's only elite skill, and those other guys could score too.
