This. To act like this theory is far-fetched or could never happen is just silly. Is it conventional? Is it the way teams traditionally rebuild? No. But you are absolutely right that this idea is worth pitching to a team like Minnesota that can't seem to get it done the conventional or traditional way. Not to mention, they project to get the 1-2 picks and already have potential franchise players at both positions (Rubio at PG, Johnson at SF). Barring anything unexpected, you don't think they'll consider moving that pick at some point? Get real if you think that's unreasonable.
This list says it all. The number of the trades involving top picks is even less than the trades of all star players. Trading up into top 5 in a draft is pretty much a waste of time and effort.
If I were the Timberwolves GM, I'd rather try to keep the pick and trade Rubio for both Lowry and Martin. Given Morey was willing to give up two starters (Brooks and Battier) two seasons ago, he might be willing to do it again. Then Minny can use the pick to strengthen another position. Houston doesn't get a top 5 pick, but they get the star player Morey covets.
There is absolutely no way the Rockets entertain that offer. I think the Timberwolves need to add veterans/experience to their young core, not more rookies to continue the losing. I would target them as a team willing to trade a high pick. The Rockets very well might just do that. There are some intriguing prospects in the top five. With that said, we need to root like hell that Minnesota doesn't land a top two pick. I'm not sure they pass on either of those guys, but if they were the fourth pick? I think we'd have a shot.
Except, that wasn't what the list was about, at all. In fact, intentionally or unintentionally, the only thing you didn't quote me on was the description of what that list actually is about. A list of past examples of teams trading up for high picks, without the use of their own high picks. If you want a list of all top picks being traded, it would be much longer. An apples to apples comparison would be all star players traded, without receiving an all star in return. Look people, this is starting to get annoying. If you want to disagree like heypartner that is totally fine. If you think I am an idiot or stupid that's okay too, get in line. But please, at least read and re-read what you are about to disagree with before you start responding, to make sure you understand what the hell you are disagreeing with first. As far as I know this is a written forum not every post must have a picture v3.0. But maybe I should start drawing some diagrams or some **** because this is getting ridiculous.
I get what you're saying. In a draft this week Kyrie and Derrick are going to look that much stronger. But at the same time, it's hard to ignore the potential franchise players they already have at those positions. Sure, generally speaking you draft the BPA -- but happens when the BPA creates a logjam rather than addressing either needs? Maybe they select Irving then look to move Rubio. Our interest in Rubio is well documented. Maybe they decide to trade down. Maybe they look to move the pick altogether. There's definitely a lot of possibilities there regardless of their draft position, IMO.
Good point. jopatmc started a thread about as much here: http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=203866 If they land the #2 and view Derrick Williams as a PF, they may look to deal him. Or I suppose, if they feel Williams @SF is redundant to Wesley Johnson, they may deal one or the other. I think they'd take Kyrie over Rubio, but I'm unsure of the 2011 trade value of Ricky Rubio. He's gotten a lot of negative press since being drafted, so I'm not sure how scouts view him currently.
Timberwolves trading their 2011 pick for Martin is reasonable possibility. Timberwolves are in unique situation next season. Their fans are tired of losing already, but if they are losers next season it will look even worse and be even more painful…because their unprotected 2012 pick in very deep draft will be going to the Clippers. So I know their management would desperately like to make team competitive next season. If they are not so excited with prospect they would choose with pick, they could very well look to trade it for proven player to help win now. However, I’m not sure I trust Morey’s ability to pick player that will end up better than Martin in such an unpromising and uncertain draft. I mean, he was willing to give three starters for garbage player in Rubio, who everyone here says they would not even trade one starter in Lowry for. But yes, whoever said Timberwolves, that is good example of unique situation this type of thing occurs.
I totally forgot about that. While I mentioned that the Wolves were the type of team we could target, this fact makes them THE team for us to target. Basketball knowledgeable, female, and a dragon. That's the triple threat right there boys. Beyond the Wolves, this is the type of teams we would target, not necessarily THIS year, but whenever the opportunity arises: A team with an established franchise player in place, yet still losing constantly. These teams are more likely to want help NOW as opposed to another green prospect especially if they don't see someone with superstar potential available. The reason they would like to start winning sooner rather than later is for fear that their already established franchise player would get tired of a losing situation and wiggle their way out of town once their rookie deal is up. These teams include- Timberwolves. Kevin Love. Clippers. Blake Griffin. Wizards. John Wall. Bucks. Brandon Jennings, Andrew Bogut. Warriors. Stephen Curry. Nets. Deron Williams. Kings would be on the list too if they weren't the ones who traded away Martin in the first place. We could always target them with a different package, but the whole point of the OP was that Martin had the most value to even have a shot at a high pick. On the other hand, teams like the Cavs, Raptors, and Jazz would not be interested in any type of immediate help since they would rather gamble for a franchise player that they don't yet have.
Probably not, but from Minny's POV, I don't think Martin alone would get them interested. Martin's an efficient scorer, but outside Adelman's system, not a proven winner. I'd be worried his weak defense could prove deadly to an already defensively challenged team like the Wolves. If Minny can't pry Lowry along with Martin from Houston, they'd be better off trying to outbid for Hayes and/or Battier. Adding tough veteran leaders who know defense would probably help their winning percentage, without having to give up the draft pick.
