Florida Pastor Terry Jones Burns Quran After Mock Trial (w/ video)

in what tangible way did the pastor "violate" the rights of hundreds of thousands of muslims? in what tangible way did the pastor prevent anyone from practicing their religion?

no its not - is it called exercising your 1st amendment rights. in what tangible way was the pastor "abusing" others rights?

the only people whose rights were violated were the UN workers who got murdered by a bunch of brainwashed, deranged muslims who had just come out of friday prayers. why dont any of you guys call out the imam who incited all these people to commit murder? or the media who gave this small-time pastor a national platform?

thats right, you cant!

"real" muslims also seem to think it is reasonable to murder b/c someone burned a book on the other side of the world.

and im pretty sure that god judges murders differently than book burners. unlike other posters here, i dont think burning a book is as immoral an act as murder.

 

you have a lack of understanding when it comes to our laws.

cruel and immoral, probably - illegal, no.

if you insulted victims of the holocaust and a bunch of jews went out and murdered 10 innocent people would that be your fault?

in america it is not against the law to be unnecessary and immature. it is against the law to murder though.

 

i dont have a problem at all with it - as long as you are not destroying others property.

 

Greenwald on the costs of endless war on freedom speech.

 

You could have picked an example name other than Bob.

 

I really don't see much of a free speech issue here. Jones was able to say what he said, and did what he did. In this country he has that right, and he was able to act. To be honest, despite all the chatter, that really never changed. Whether or not he could put on his show really was never a question.

Ultimately the 'blame' falls on those who actually committed the crime. There is no excusing them for their actions - though, ultimately, I don't think that anyone critical of Jones is really doing much of that. That fact doesn't, however, mean that Jones is somehow free of any considerations as to what results his show may bring about.

As human beings and members of society, we have to be able to rationalize and take responsibility for the repercussions of any actions we may take. Too many people fail to do that these days, or simply hide behind a cry of 'free speech' as a means to lack empathy or reasonable consideration of the other members of society around them.

There's nothing wrong with both having and protecting the right of free speech, yet still using it responsibly.

 

Free speech?
Just imagine what would happen to a Muslim, taking a holy bible to the site of WTC and burn it.

Hundreds, or thousands people would beat him to death and millions others would say it's his fault.

 

Removing the WTC factor from the equation (it is unfair to put that into this comparison, as we're speaking of religious symbols, and pissing on the site of the massacre of 3000 citizens is a little different than burning a book)

I kinda doubt burning a Bible would get you that result.

Sure, some people would get pissed off.

The guy himself might be in danger of verbally abused, harassed, or maybe even assaulted, but outright murdered?... even after 9/11, people didn't go around randomly killing muslims, or arab looking people.

He might have to keep a low profile, but I doubt he would get beaten to death in the streets... hell, the government would probably go out of it's way to protect him... land of the free, and such.

 

Are you purposely trying to be dense?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balbir_Singh_Sodhi
http://www.sikhspectrum.com/112006/denise.htm

And that's just the people that "looked" Muslim

 

I think this is why we haven't seen B-Bob post in a while.

 

Doubtful.

Keep in mind this pastor has protested at veterans' funerals & not one member of his group has been assaulted, stabbed or murdered.

 

That's unfortunate.

I didn't hear of any murders that happened, lots of harassment/intimidation though.

Still, no reason to be a jerk about it, adeel. Thanks for posting that.

I wonder how many cases were in total, but all that aside, it isn't unreasonable to think that a massacre like 9/11 is going to illicit a much more violent response (paranoia, fear for their safety, etc) than burning a book... not that any violence was justified, but it isn't an apples to apples comparison.

Now, how do you feel about rage's hypothetical?

 

I apologize for being a jerk, but its sad how many people ignore/turn a blind eye towards the same exact hatred when expressed towards Arabs/Muslims/Brown people.

http://www.jstor.org/pss/10.1525/sp.2011.58.1.21 <-- study on hate crimes post 9/11

If you don't think your life would be in jeopardy, Go burn a replica WTC model at the site of the Terrorist Acts, and see what becomes of your and your families life.

Freedom of Speech?

 

Even if I were to get ripped limb from limb by a crazed mob for doing that, would it have any impact on legality of the topic at hand?

Do two wrongs make a right? Am I missing something here?

 

Exactly the same.

 

No, but I doubt anyone would blame the Mob for their passion/aggression. You desecrated something sacred to them.

Yes, It is insane that someone in Afghanistan responds to Mr. Jones actions, however they have repressed anger already at America/The Troops/The West and anything else associated with that theme (Mr. Jones). This is just the spark needed for them. And thats all it is, a Spark. It may be legal, it may be within the bounds of American Law, but it is still stupid, immoral, pathetic, and definitely partially worthy of blame for the crimes that followed.

 

I'm not really concerned with what Joe the Plumber thinks. I'm concerned with what the law/constitution thinks.

I agree.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, and nope.

I refer you back to my post about blame.

If you think that the pastor is any way partially or wholly responsible for this result, you are saying that killing somebody as a response to burning a book, is at least somewhat of a reasonable/acceptable/expected response.

I'm not willing to justify the actions of the murderers even a little by claiming that the pastor's actions was .00001% of a reasonable cause for them to kill somebody. It was 0% reasonable for them to do what they did.

 

That post is Bogus. Your logic is flawed.

Kids are verbally bullied every day. Some bully them more than others. Many times teachers overlook the bullying and fail to report it. The bully notices the lack of action on the teacher's part and believes that he has a free reign to continue his bullying.

At the end of the day, The bully is definitely 100% responsible for his actions, but also the teacher shares the blame for failing to report or stop the bullying. In this scenario, even though the bully is completely responsible, the teacher also shares the blame. This does not justify even .0001% of the bully's actions?

 

When you think that Muslim person is pissing on the site ... it's only a small step toward justifying doing him bodily harm.

What he does, as you would say, is excersing his freedom of speech, why do you make rules that prevent him from doing so at certain places? What if other people make other rules, where do you draw the line?
Why does he have to keep a low profile?
Why does the goverment have to go out of it's way to protect him? Are you saying he may be in danger?

 

This is a total fabrication. At most, the guy would be arrested and then set free.