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[WOW] Should Klow7 be part of the MVP discussion??

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Hayesfan, Mar 22, 2011.

  1. Hayesfan

    Hayesfan Member

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    Should Kyle Lowry be part of the MVP discussion in 2011?

    link

    Andres Alvarez – of Nerd Numbers and the Automated Wins Produced – sent along the following observation:

    Kyle Lowry’s game on Sunday night was the 15th best of the season and better than any Derrick Rose has put up so far this season. Additionally, since the New Year, Kyle Lowry has put up .25 more wins than Derrick Rose in 50 less minutes of play time. Lowry also the most wins on his team (and once again, has been playing better than Rose for the last 3 months). So should he be considered a serious MVP candidate?

    Okay, this is just silly. Derrick Rose is clearly one of the best players in the game. Afterall, Rose

    * was the first player taken in the 2008 NBA draft
    * was voted as a starter in the 2011 All-Star game
    * scores 24.8 points per game, a mark that ranks 6th in the NBA
    * leads the Chicago Bulls – the team currently on top of the Eastern Conference standings – in Wins Produced
    * stars in television commercials

    In contrast, Lowry

    * was the 24th player taken in the 2006 NBA draft
    * prior to this season, has only started 21 games in the NBA (and may have seen an All-Star game but certainly has never been asked to play)
    * scores only 13.2 points per game, a mark that ranks 70th in the NBA

    Obviously Lowry can’t be compared to Rose.

    Then again….

    Let’s go back to that Wins Produced story. As noted, Rose leads the Chicago Bulls in Wins Produced. After 69 games, Rose has produced 9.8 wins. And his WP48 [Wins Produced per 48 minutes] is 0.184. So Rose is above average (average WP48 is 0.100).

    Now let’s look at Lowry. After 71 games, Lowry has produced 8.1 wins. This mark leads the Houston Rockets. And his WP48 of 0.172 is actually quite comparable to what we see from Rose. In other words, if Lowry and Rose switched places, the fate of each team would be quite similar (and before you say the Bulls need Rose to take all those shots, take a look at what I wrote a few weeks ago at The Huffington Post).

    Obviously Lowry doesn’t score as much as Rose. So what makes Lowry so productive?

    Wins in the NBA are driven by a team’s ability to gain and keep possession of the ball (i.e. rebounds and turnovers) and how well the team can turn possession of the ball into points (i.e. shooting efficiency and the ability to get to the free thow line). When we look at Lowry’s stats – reported below — we see that his career numbers (these are the career numbers before the 2010-11 season) indicate Lowry was below average with respect to shooting efficiency from the field. But his ability to get to the free throw line and grab rebounds allowed Lowry to be above average.

    [​IMG]

    This season, Lowry has been a more efficient scorer. He is also getting more assists while cutting down his turnovers. As a consequence, Lowry is now offering nearly as much are Rose.

    And just like Rose – as the following indicates — Lowry is the most productive player on his team.

    [​IMG]

    The Rockets’ record is 37-34 after 71 games, a mark that ranks last in the Southwest division and leaves this team currently on the outside of the top eight spots in the conference. When we look at efficiency differential (offensive efficiency minus defensive efficiency), though, we see a mark of 1.7. This is consistent with a team that would win between 39 and 40 of their first 71 games; or about 45 wins across an entire season. And those marks would actually rank 8th in the Western Conference. So the Rockets are not a “bad” team.

    Why are the Rockets “not bad”? As noted in early February, the Rockets have been able to find a collection of above average performers. Beyond Lowry, the Rockets are currently employing – as part of their rotation – the following above average players: Kevin Martin, Chuck Hayes, Chase Budinger, and Patrick Patterson. And Luis Scola, Courtney Lee, and Brad Miller are close to average.

    So why aren’t the Rockets as good as the Bulls? The above average players on the Rockets all have WP48 marks below 0.200. In other words, the Rockets don’t have anyone who is twice as good as average. In contrast, the Bulls employ Carlos Boozer [0.201 WP48], Ronnie Brewer [0.236 WP48], and Joakim Noah [0.264 WP48].

    In sum, Rose simply has somewhat better teammates than Lowry. And that means Rose gets to experience more wins. When we add in Rose’s scoring (driven by Rose’s propensity to take many shots), it is easy to see why Rose is considered an MVP candidate.

    Of course, Lowry is nearly as productive. So should Lowry get some consideration for the MVP award?

    Well, not exactly. There are still several players who offer more than Rose and Lowry (see Dwight Howard, LeBron James, Chris Paul, etc…). In fact, Howard, James, and Paul offer more than Lowry and Rose combined. And that means Lowry shouldn’t be an MVP candidate. But then again, Derrick Rose really shouldn’t be getting any votes either.
     
    1 person likes this.
  2. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Member

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    Part of the debate? Kyle Lowry is THE MVP, END OF STORY PERIOD ALL STOP.
     
  3. clutch citizen

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    Somebody forward this to Chicago's GM. We'll trade Lowry for Rose and a 1st round draft pick. Maybe a 2nd round pick instead if the Bulls don't make the playoffs.
     
  4. bejezuz

    bejezuz Member

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    LoL. The author makes a very solid case why Rose is NOT the MVP.
     
  5. Prince

    Prince Member

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    OP has a very valid point.

    [​IMG]
     
  6. Rockets2K

    Rockets2K Clutch Crew

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    Cue the herds of people who will miss the point entirely.


    OMGGGZZZZZ U CANT CUMPAR LOWRY TO ROSE YOU HOMEEEERRZ :rolleyes:
     
  7. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    Haha yeah, seems like the entire point of it.
     
  8. rockets934life

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    Kyle has had a great season, I hope and expect he will continue to build on it.

    As far as Rose goes, when I see him play...I see an MVP which is all I need to see. Stats are great and all but to often the old eye ball test is forgotten.
     
  9. RV6

    RV6 Member

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    Unfortunately (or fortunately for Rose), to be considered your team has to be a contender.
     
  10. mattrbowers

    mattrbowers Member

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    When was the last time an MVP did not make the all star game?
     
  11. conquistador#11

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    I read this as a cleverly written "yawl should not vote for rose as an MVP" piece.
     
  12. CDrex

    CDrex Member

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    Interesting.

    Rather oversimplified, but I think that was kind of the point, just a thinly veiled "Rose isn't as awesome as you think" article.

    I love Kyle, but let's see what happens when teams actually start gameplanning for him like a star point guard (coming real soon).
     
  13. Don FakeFan

    Don FakeFan Member

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    never could believe Rose can score 25 points a game. He is such a stud.
     
  14. spdngyns69

    spdngyns69 Member

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    Klowry reminds me a lot of CP3 since his offensive game started falling into place. Same build, similar finishing abilities and slightly less court vision. Both loves to occasionally flop. If he gets hyped more, I can see him being noticed around the league like some of these other PG's.
     
  15. Landry92

    Landry92 Member

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    This has gone overboard
    Wow
     
  16. RedStaag

    RedStaag Rookie

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    wtf, am i getting punked lol. mvp of what exactly?
     
  17. Spacemoth

    Spacemoth Member

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    Lowry has far more Deron in him than Paul. He's bigger, stockier, plays through contact better, and probably has the body type which unlike Paul will hold up better over time (see how people are saying the same things about Paul's knees that they used to say about Roy's two years ago?).

    Conversely, Lowry (and you can add Deron Williams to that ) is not as good a passer, consistent shooter (although they're all clutch shooters), or penetrator as Paul is. Paul is in the Nash model in that regard; he won't ever give up his dribble until it results in a shot or an assist. Defensively Lowry's also similar to Deron; they're both above average and will stay in front of you, but they won't play the passing lanes and go for steals the way Paul or Rondo will.
     
  18. spdngyns69

    spdngyns69 Member

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    Come to think of it, what you've just said put a picture in my head of Dwill's/KLowry and CP3/Nash game. I've changed my mind. Thanks.
     
  19. blackistan

    blackistan Member

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    talk about overreacting
     
  20. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    Definitely for me he's been the MVP of the Rockets this season.
     

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