That doesn't make it right. And I remember your posts from the Islam-related threads, you are just as much of a wacko when it comes to that as Mathloom. So just because there are a few people who spew hate still doesn't make them right.
LOL, I'm the wacko? I'd love you to give me one example of how I fit this title. I'm not religious at all, I'll play the devil's advocate to posters like you and DD but I don't spill hate speech about any one group, unlike you.
Calling me a terrorist is not hate speech? I don't think my posts qualify as hate speech, unless you want to interpret them as such. I'm a rather peaceful guy. As with many things, it's in the eye of the beholder. Let me try and search, maybe I am confusing you with someone else re: cartoonist posts.
You seem to have at least concerned you with the Quran (Koran? what is the accepted correct spelling) in much detail (just to make it clear before someone puts words in my mouth again, I have no problem with that, I am just pointing out the inconsistency in your statements). Out of curiosity, are you a convert or on your path to being a convert? Seems like these are among the most passionate when it comes to "defending" their religion. You also said you wanted the Danish cartoonist to be fined at least (which indicates you don't have the same understanding of freedom of speech as the US constitution) and you downplayed many instances of barbaric acts in the name of Islam or which happened in predominantly Muslim countries (like the 8 year old girl that got married in Yemen, you blamed the media and said that is something that happens in many parts of the world instead of condemning it). Why do you say you are not religious, I searched and found hundreds of posts which indicate that you have quite strong feelings and in-depth knowledge about Islam and the Quran. Are you saying you are not religious so that you look more "objective"? http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showpost.php?p=2303449&postcount=14
Like an unchecked cancer, hate corrodes the personality and eats away its vital unity. Hate destroys a man's sense of values and his objectivity. It causes him to describe the beautiful as ugly and the ugly as beautiful, and to confuse the true with the false and the false with the true. - Martin Luther King Jr.
That's a good quote. I can fully agree with it. Pointing out the dangers of religious fundamentalism has nothing to do with hate, though. Actually, by engaging Mathloom et al. in discussion, they have made posts which pretty clearly show that they have a vastly different understanding of free speech and of "hate" from people who believe in the values of the US constitution (or the basic law of Germany for instance). And I am not the one who hates anyone. Mathloom just explicitly posted in another thread that the Danish cartoonist "should be hated". I don't think anyone should be hated, actually. http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showpost.php?p=5267430&postcount=41
Quran or Koran, don't think it really matters, due to how it is pronounced in Arabic people use the Qu, would be more accurate. I was born a Muslim, we all go through ups and downs in terms of our faith, I guess I must have posted that when I was trying to learn more about the religion. I still havn't read the Quran fully, the only time I do is when friends/strangers ask about it. The defensive attitude comes from the fact that I will be always be tied to Islam, when I go to the border or airport I get treated like one, this alienation forces me to identify with it more. It sucks to be treated like a suspect of a crime every time (even though I understand why it has to happen). Also, don't get me wrong, more times than not the agents have been very friendly, sometimes even more so than necessary. I'm not trying to play the victim card, I just want us to integrate better, we could do without the kind of hate you spread, as its someone like me who ends up being on the receiving end when you succeed. Yes it is wrong, I don't see how me condemning it means ***** to anyone. I'm not much of a D&D poster, I rather enjoy reading, but when I see posts like yours I like to balance it out by playing the other end (regardless of my true beliefs) There are thousands of things that are f'd up in this world, always focusing only on one groups wrong doings won't make it better. Just not very constructive IMHO. I've never been religious, doesn't mean I don't know anything about the religion...lol at the in-depth knowledge, its called good researching. I don't know about my "strong feelings", I guess only someone with your point of view would feel that way
I think people should condemn the stereotyping of Muslims as terrorists. There has to be a reason why so few terrorist attacks in the US and Europe are carried out by Muslims, yet folks ATW believe the group most responsible for terrorism. I'm curious why someone like ATW won't condemn that. Does it mean that his religion/lack of religion has taught him to hate anyone different? Does it mean that he doesn't believe in justice, and would rather just perpetuate a stereotype? He's had strange diatribes against beards before, and now this latest fetish. It's outrageous. He hasn't strongly enough criticized people who perpetuate negative stereotypes of Muslims despite having seen the reports that show in Europe they are responsible for less than 1% of terrorist attacks and in the US they are responsible for only around 6%. He doesn't seem to care about facts but would rather continue to feed into a stereotype. ATW why don't you condemn the unfair negative media image being portrayed?
Your statistics are false. You danced around my question to rank terror attacks by number of casualties. Here are the actual facts, in contrast to your made up numbers. Out of the top 25 terrorist attacks ever ranked by number of deaths, only 6 were not committed by Muslims. Now it can certainly be argued whether religion was the main or sole motivating factor for the terrorist attacks, but these are the facts, and your constant spouting of completely fabricated 1 % and 6 % numbers does not change that fact. I marked the ones in italics which were not committed by Muslims. Again, I don't think that all or even a majority or even more than a small minority of Muslims are bad, but facts are facts - out of the top 25 terrorist attacks, 19 were committed by Muslims, and in many or most of these cases, they (not I) specifically cited their religion or what they perceive it to be as a motivating factor. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20287932/ns/world_news-terrorism/ FACT FILE 25 highest terrorist attack death tolls 2,974 KILLED New York and Washington, D.C. Sept. 11, 2001 Four planes plunge into the World Trade Center, Pentagon and a Pennsylvania field. 477 KILLED Abadan, Iran. Aug. 20, 1978 Anti-shah radicals commit arson in a movie theater during the Iranian revolution. 400 KILLED, AT LEAST Yazidi villages, Iraq. Aug. 14, 2007 Al-Qaida uses four suicide bombs to kill members of the Yazidis, a small religious group. The death toll is mounting and could be as high as 500. 334 KILLED Beslan, Russia. Sept. 1, 2004 Armed Chechen rebels take more than 1,200 schoolchildren and adults hostage. Of those killed, 186 are children. 329 KILLED Irish Sea. June 23 1985 A terrorist bomb explodes on an Air India plane. The attack is blamed on Sikh radicals. 299 KILLED Beirut, Lebanon. Oct. 23, 1983 Suicide truck bombings strike U.S. and French marine compounds. Hezbollah claims responsibility. 270 KILLED Mumbai, India. March 12, 1993 Twelve bombs and a grenade explode in India’s financial district. Muslim radicals are found responsible, with possible collusion of a Pakistani intelligence service. 270 KILLED Lockerbie, Scotland. Dec. 21, 1988 Libyan terrorists bomb a Pan Am plane as it flies from London to New York. 224 KILLED Nairobi, Kenya, and Dar Es Salaam. Tanzania, Aug. 8, 1998 Al-Qaida suicide truck bombs explode at U.S. embassies in the two capitals. The Nairobi attack kills 212. 215 KILLED Baghdad, Iraq. Nov. 23, 2006 Mortar fire and five car bombs detonate in Baghdad's Shiite Muslim enclave of Sadr City. 202 KILLED Bali, Indonesia. Dec. 2, 2002 Truck bombs explode outside Indonesian nightclubs. Al-Qaida finances the attack, and Indonesia terrorists carry the plot out. 191 KILLED Madrid, Spain. March 11, 2004 Eleven knapsack bombs placed by Muslim radicals explode on four commuter trains. This is Europe's worst terrorist attack. 183 KILLED Mumbai, India. July 11, 2006 Seven bombs placed by Muslim radicals in first-class carriages of commuter trains rock the financial center. 181 KILLED Karbala and Baghdad, Iraq. March 2, 2004 At least six bombs kill Shiite worshippers at holy sites in the two cities. Al-Qaida in Iraq is blamed. 170 KILLED Tiniri Desert, Niger. Sept. 19 1989 Libya admits responsibility for a bomb aboard a Union de Transportes Airiens plane. 168 KILLED Oklahoma City, Okla. April 19, 1995 A domestic terrorist truck bomb destroys a federal building. Tim McVeigh is later executed, and his compatriot given a life sentence. 150 KILLED Luanda, Angola. Aug. 10, 2001 Rebels attack a train south of the Angola capital. 150 KILLED Anuradhapura, Sri Lanka. May 14, 1985 Tamil Tigers militants attack a civilian crowd in the city streets. 143 KILLED Budennovsk, Russia. June 14-19, 1996 Hostage-taking and failed rescue attempts in an area near Chechnya leave scores dead. 140 KILLED Kattankudy, Sri Lanka. August 1990 Attacks on two mosques by Tamil rebels occur during Sri Lanka's long civil war. 130 KILLED Lubango, Angola. Nov. 8 1983 A TAAG-Angola Airlines plane is shot down by guerrillas. 130 KILLED Moscow, Russia. Sept. 13, 1999 Chechen rebels blow up an apartment building. 129 KILLED Moscow, Russia. Oct. 26, 2002 Hostage-taking by Chechen rebels and a failed rescue attempt at a Moscow theater leave scores dead. 125 KILLED Karbala, Iraq. Aug. 29, 2003 Two car bombs explode outside the Imam Ali Shrine. 125 KILLED Hilla, Iraq. Feb. 28, 2005 A suicide car bomb attack strikes Hilla, a city south of Baghdad. Source: NBC's Robert Windrem
I have a couple of questions, I'd appreciate if you gave me an honest answer. During the times of the Muslim empire, how come there were no Muslim terrorists? Also, what do you see being the common factor/characteristic in the passing of the torch of "most terrorist people" throughout history? Basically, each time a large group of people became violent and known for terrorism, what was the distinguishing characteristic of this group (be it a specific religion or whatever)?
Listing a bunch of individual incidents does not change the FACT that less than 1 % of European terrorism comes from Islamic groups, and around 6% in the US come from Islamic groups. Unless you are going to list ALL the attacks and then show that indeed a greater percentage are carried out by Muslims, then you are wrong. I've already mentioned that because some Islamic attacks may be more successful doesn't mean more Muslims are terrorists. Please follow the links and read the reports.
I don't know the answer to either one of your questions, but I promise I'll try to think about it when I'll be sober again.
You call it "successful". I call it inexcusable and sad, to use mild words. You go and tell the relatives of victims of 9/11 that the attack was "successful". Really. Go ahead and do that. Different perspective. Your veil has been lifted. And your numbers are still completely made up. What's your source again? "Looneyfreaks.cc"? Mine is MSNBC. 19 out of the top 25. Explain this. What's the common denominator again? You're clutching at straws and everyone can see it.
When one person calls you drunk, they could be wrong. When a whole bunch people people tell you that you are drunk, you might want to hand them your car keys and lie down.
What a fail list. Where's this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_Nedelya_Church_assault or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xiamen_Airlines_Flight_8301 or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001_Angola_train_attack And your list doesn't even have state-sponsored terrorism on it. We all know what event would take first place for most deaths.
The website I posted links to the actual reports which are the FBI and Europol What is your source for saying the FBI is making up numbers? Yes I call it successful. When a group is trying to inflict lots of civilian casualties and they do it, that is a success for them. It is a tragedy for the rest of us, but since we were talking about the actual attack, then success is the right word. If you aren't old enough or capable of talking about the subject at hand and using appropriate vocabulary, then perhaps you shouldn't be in the discussion. In the meantime maybe you can go learn what the FBI is. If you can't do that at least back up your claim that the numbers are made up. You may also want to study how percentages work. And why they are relevant to which groups commit the most terrorist acts. Because so far you've shown no understanding of this.
Franchise Blade, what is your personal interest in downplaying the fact that 19 of the top 25 terrorist attacks by number of casualties in recent history have been committed by Muslims or in the name of Islam? What you consider a success, I consider a tragedy. It is offensive to all victims and their relatives of these terrorist attacks that you consider them a success.
