The "franchise player" debate has been settled. It's Amen.

And now not only is Cade overrated but we might actually have a Brunson or Hali on this team.


I love this place. It's honestly the best comedy out there.

 

Who is the Brunson or Hali people are talking about?

 

Reed or Amen

 

I think the Knicks are more of a sum of the total parts. All due respect to Brunson, but he has a lot around him. The parts perfectly complement him. You could make the argument that they have the two best 3ND players in the entire league. along with the player that used to be on the franchise player list, but flunked out.

Cade is better than Amen right now overall. Cade is almost 1.5 years older than Amen. Thompson is the franchise player that you guys are all pining for, give him some time. I think it’s gonna be pretty clear in about six months.

 

Thornton. Put some respect on his name

 

Okur was a 23 year old rookie though. And while he was in Detroit he wasnt the player he later became which lends to my other point about not knowing what some of these guys could become. And just for comparison sake, Sengun has already made more All Star games thank Okur did in his career and Sengun is only 23 right now.

As far as Rasheed, he was a really good player but he wasnt even an all star when Detroit won the finals. Matter of fact he was only in Detroit for about 20 games after he was traded from Portland to Atlanta and then Atlanta traded hin to Det as a salary dump after he appeared in only 1 game. That was one of the worst years he had as a NBA player from a production standpoint. He was a fine player, but certainly not the 1A generational player that I referenced... Especially not the year they won their ring.


As far as Amen vs Simmons, look at the team Simmons was on as a Rookie: https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/PHI/2018.html

Simmons was pretty much always surrounded by Shooters...really good shooters. 5 out spacing.

Also, I just dont agree about Amen not being able to get to spots. I think the problem is that he's just not able to hit shots from the spots he can consistently get to.

But back to the Simmons thing...Amen took more 3pt shots in his first few games as a rookie than Simmons has in his entire career. Amen will also take short middies. Ben took 36 3s in about 7 years and shot 13%...Amen has taken 265 in just 3yrs at 21%. And again. Thats without the 5 out spacing and elite shooters Simmons had. Ive said before that guys like Westbrook and Giannis are Curry compared to Amen, but Amen is Curry and Ray Allen's lab built child compared to Simmons from a shooting perspective.

 

No, you are making stuff up and hoping no one checks you on it.

Amen Thompson 2024-25 Shooting | Basketball-Reference.com
Amen Thompson 2025-26 Shooting | Basketball-Reference.com



24/25 FG.557 2pFG .599 3pFG.275
25/26 FG.534 2pFG .573 3pFG.216

The numbers show that he did not improve - he declined.

Now if you wanna move the goal posts around, cherry pick this stat or that or change the timeline to suit your narrative .... by all means go ahead. Jalen Green Only Fans use to point to an 11 game hot stretch.

 

would leaving his free throw percentage out be cherry picking? I’m not some giant data junkie. I just watched the games. His form improved and his confidence improved. I have zero reason to believe that that’s just gonna stop. if we get him a few extra minutes of rest per game, that might help as well.

He is the future.

 

You might be underestimating what guys like Brunson/Cade do. Both players are the literal engine for their teams. Without them they just don't go. Do you really believe KAT ( who was the running joke of the league before Brunson saved him ) plays like he did without Brunson there giving him easy looks and taking the majority of the opposing teams defensive gameplan? Same goes with Cade. That pistons team is probably a play in team without Cade. Unless Amen magically learns to shoot he is never going to be Cade or Brunson and he's never going to be Giannis because Giannis is an outlier. One of the only franchise players that can't shoot. Your franchise guy has got to be able to shoot the ball in this modern NBA. Just look at every NBA champion they all have a dude that can shoot and do it well. Amen is a terrible terrible shooter and I'm sorry but guys like him that are this bad at shooting very rarely figure it out. How many years did we have to hear "just wait till Giannis finds a shot" until people finally realized that wasn't going to happen?

This isn't about dragging Amen down, I like Amen but we don't need to pretend like he is a cornerstone piece. This team doesn't have one and they should always be looking to move pieces until they find that true guy they can build around.

 

Amen and Sengun are dragging each other down. It is very clear that our two best young players have significant flaws and are not compatible, but Stone, for some reason, is in denial and unwilling to give up one of them.

 

Are you seriously not self-aware enough to grasp the irony of saying Amen isn't a cornerstone piece immediately after describing why, in your mind, Brunson is a franchise player?

Brunson at 23: 8/2/3 on a .55 TS%
Amen at 23: 18/8/5 on a .59 TS%

So many on this board are shockingly either oblivious of, or purposely ignorant to, the typical development of an NBA prospect.

 

Year 1 Brunson shot 34.8% from 3. Year 2 Brunson shot 35.8% from 3. Year 3 Brunson shot 40% from 3. Amen has never even sniffed 30%.

Do you really think Amen is going to magically become a shooter? You really think teams are game planning for Amen like they do Brunson? At no point in Brunson's time in the NBA has a team decided to literally not guard him because he can't shoot the ball like the way the Warriors and Lakers did to Amen.

 

lol whatever you say. I’m sure many people said, “Brunson will never be a franchise player - he’s too small and unathletic.” Thankfully, guys with the mentality of Amen and Brunson tend to overcome such myopic takes.

 

It's not a mentality issue. It's a skill issue (shooting) Brunson could/can literally shoot the ball. Amen can't. It starts and ends right there. History shows us dudes that are terrible shooters like Amen don't get substantially better.

 

We’ll see. Again, I think people who write off players due to a single weakness are shortsighted. But you do you.

 

Those 2 are cornerstone players, the supporting cast is not helping.

 

I mean Amen's weakness is pretty large in todays NBA. Look at the top 25 players in the league right now. The only one to enter the league (and still remain) a bad shooter like Amen is Giannis. Everyone else came into the league at minimum an average NBA shooter.

I like Amen and I'm not saying I would trade him because he sucks or anything of that nature. I'm saying if the right trade came along like say if we could have landed in the top 7 of this past draft for Amen I'm doing it no questions asked.

 

Trading Amen for a guy like Acuff is so dumb I’m not sure what to say. Other than…that’s one of the dumbest things I’ve ever read.

 

You can’t have 2 cornerstone players who can’t shoot, and they were trying to pair Sengun with Adams who can’t shoot either. It will never work. One gotta go.

 

Don't forget Smart