1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

The "franchise player" debate has been settled. It's Amen.

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by OremLK, May 4, 2025.

  1. ksny15

    ksny15 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2013
    Messages:
    15,905
    Likes Received:
    8,998
    The issue with this list is 3 of those teams have legit MVP franchise leading guys and one of them has possibly found theirs in this draft.

    I wonder which team is the odd one out.
     
  2. bustamove

    bustamove Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2024
    Messages:
    2,044
    Likes Received:
    1,765
    one team aint gonna make the playoffs
     
  3. mac_got_this

    mac_got_this Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    12,275
    Likes Received:
    10,712
    We can’t still be in this group. Two years ago beased off potential but after this years postseason performance where it was primarily the youth core against old man LeBron and scrubs and we got washed…….
    For us it’s definitely quantity over quality at this point otherwise Orlando might have the better youth cote
     
    ksny15 likes this.
  4. Houston77

    Houston77 COOKIES AND CAKE, MY TEAM BAKED!
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2018
    Messages:
    8,873
    Likes Received:
    22,186
    So you don’t think our young is good because we didn’t advance past the first round of the playoffs and think the Magic’s core is better…a team that didn’t advance past the first round of the playoffs.
     
  5. ksny15

    ksny15 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2013
    Messages:
    15,905
    Likes Received:
    8,998
    The teams all have franchise guys. You won't win without that. The Rockets simply don't. The best player on OKC, SAS and Detroit is better than the Rockets two best players combined. It's a cute graph that might make a casual fan think they are close but it isn't close at all.
     
    harold bingo likes this.
  6. OremLK

    OremLK Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2010
    Messages:
    23,860
    Likes Received:
    24,244
    I will say I do think people really underestimate the impact of playoff experience. I don't think any of our young players are at that #1 option level yet, or particularly likely to get there. However, it's not because we crapped the bed against the Lakers in the playoffs. I would argue that's almost the expected outcome against a team with the most experienced #1 option in basketball history and plenty of other playoff experience on the roster, with a team that's barely scratched the playoffs before. The bigger issue is that we haven't seen much growth from Sengun over the past two seasons combined, and that Amen still hasn't shown any strong signs of developing the jump shot that may be the key to unlocking his potential.
     
    bustamove likes this.
  7. MystikArkitect

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2006
    Messages:
    17,216
    Likes Received:
    28,018
    Sengun and Amen dont complement each other on offense. One has to go unless Sengun learns to shoot. Ideally the team goes all in on Amen as the focal point because its the fastest way to a contender this team has. If Jabari could actually be the stretch 5 that was promised and we surround Amen with something like Reed/Jabari/Murphy/A Mikal Bridges Type, we'd have something resembling actual roster construction.

    Lots of ifs though.
     
    OremLK likes this.
  8. Houston77

    Houston77 COOKIES AND CAKE, MY TEAM BAKED!
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2018
    Messages:
    8,873
    Likes Received:
    22,186
    Meh. The Wizards don't really yet. The Magic don't - Paolo and Franz are not better than Sengun and Amen. I think Cade is pretty overrated - I could absolutely see Amen ending up better than him.
     
    bustamove likes this.
  9. Hemingway

    Hemingway Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2016
    Messages:
    15,221
    Likes Received:
    19,561
    Paolo sucks and is extremely over paid. Both Sengun and Amen are better than Paolo and Jabari is pretty close at less than half the cost. Franz and Cade are really good, but I wouldn’t trade Amen straight up for them, because of potential. I think Cade and Franz are about at their ceiling.
     
    Stephen_A likes this.
  10. Francis3422

    Francis3422 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2000
    Messages:
    9,766
    Likes Received:
    8,054
    I was looking at a list of contracts that are considered NBAs worst. it is basically DeAron Fox at the top and then a few top 20 level players that got super paid. and looking at some of those deals I was trying to see which player I would take on most happily, knowing that the deal is pretty underwater.

    you also have to keep in mind that that is seemingly not how we are operating on the contract front so it wouldn’t set us up Thompson. I would be trying to figure out a way to do Thompson’s extension ASAP. And it’s just way too early to speculate on what sort of contract Reed will end up deserving.

    I come back to Orlando a lot.

    Data and eye test generally point to Wagner as the better player, but I also feel like he is kind of been allowed to be secondary where the pressure has been on Paulo. personally I would be interested in acquiring one of the two or even Bane. They may be right, where we are at as far as allowing the young players to grow together, but it seems to me like they would break up Wagner and Banchero soon.

    I am not sure what their organizational plan is. I am under the impression that sucks is a terrible contract and that his health issues are likely to persist.

    so I just don’t know what direction they are heading. Carter stands out as another player on their roster that could probably have some purpose on our team.

    I wonder what Orlando would want in a trade for Banchero, Wagner or Bane?
     
  11. Hemingway

    Hemingway Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2016
    Messages:
    15,221
    Likes Received:
    19,561
    Banchero is a horrible fit on our team. He does nothing better than Alpi at a much higher price. Wagner is great and I like Bane as well.
     
    Stephen_A and OremLK like this.
  12. ksny15

    ksny15 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2013
    Messages:
    15,905
    Likes Received:
    8,998
    Not sure how Orlando ended up in the conversation but I agree. Cade is not overrated he is all the Pistons have and is a MVP caliber player and everyone in the NBA would take him over any 2 combination of players Houston has. I wish fans were realistic with their views of their own teams players.
     
  13. cheke64

    cheke64 Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2009
    Messages:
    27,838
    Likes Received:
    20,227
    Paolo has Jalen Green shot selection.
     
    bustamove and OremLK like this.
  14. J.R.

    J.R. Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    118,583
    Likes Received:
    190,092
    “Cade is overrated”

    Sht no one would say if he was Rocket :D

    Y’all’s boy Ameiz is pretty ****ing overrated. Be playin’ 25 minutes like his brother if his head coach wasn’t his basketball terrorist twin. At least Detroit ain’t dumb enough to “build around Ausar”.

    Anyways, Ameiz & this “core” need to focus on being able to beat Luke Kennard & Deandre Ayton, not the Spurs & Thunder or what the Pistons & Magic are doing.

    “We need to trade the starting center to accommodate the fun, explosive athlete who can’t shoot.”

    Sounds familiar.

    *laughs in Westbrick*
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    #734 J.R., Jul 13, 2026 at 8:20 PM
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2026 at 8:47 PM
    IvanLCPM, ksny15, Reeko and 2 others like this.
  15. Joe Rocket

    Joe Rocket Member

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2020
    Messages:
    7,476
    Likes Received:
    10,225
    They complement each other. Amen gets his points from Sengun more than anyone else. They don't have a coach or a team that complements them. If Sengun and Amen were the only two people on this roster and someone asked you to pick a coach and players to put with them (they can't be all-stars), how many players currently on our team would still be on the roster when you're done?
     
    Little Bit and MystikArkitect like this.
  16. Francis3422

    Francis3422 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2000
    Messages:
    9,766
    Likes Received:
    8,054
    Durant (to third team if necessary)
    2027 FRP and 2029 FRP the crappy the pics both year.

    For Wagner
     
  17. bustamove

    bustamove Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2024
    Messages:
    2,044
    Likes Received:
    1,765
    "they twins therefore they're exactly the same player" LOL

    so you're totally okay to swap Amen for Ausar to save money?
     
    Stephen_A and cbass like this.
  18. mac_got_this

    mac_got_this Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    12,275
    Likes Received:
    10,712
    Wonder what’s taking so Long for the extension?
     
  19. bustamove

    bustamove Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2024
    Messages:
    2,044
    Likes Received:
    1,765
    waiting for Ausar's extension
     
  20. Stephen_A

    Stephen_A Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2016
    Messages:
    8,514
    Likes Received:
    6,600
    the inferiority complex is unbelievable on this site
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now