The "franchise player" debate has been settled. It's Amen.

he’s not a rookie dude. And its not hate. Its an assessment and critique. People saying jabari “sucks” is hate.

Again the team is in win now mode. Amen and Sheppard doesn’t fit if in this timeline. They can’t wait to develop players. Its go time.

 

Averages through the last 10 games:

Sengun - 21.9 PPG

Amen - 21.7 PPG

 

Okay, I'll bite. He's 6'7, 200lbs, and he's shooting 19% from 3. What is his position?

Is he a guard or a wing? If so, can you name another guard or wing in the league shooting under 20% from 3 and getting over 30 minutes a night?

Is he a PF or C? If so, can you name another PF or C in the league under 6'8 who is getting over 30 minutes a night?

Or is he square peg that you are desperately trying to shove into a round hole? How many deck chairs will you rearrange around this very limited player to make him work?

 

Ben Simmons is not in the nba anymore

That should be a warning to us and to Amen

 

the Ben Simmons comparisons for Amen are way too far

Amen can hardly shoot for sh*t, but at least he manages to shoot 79% from the line and is aggressive to score despite his limitations

Ben Simmons was scared to get fouled and eventually just stopped trying to score the ball…Ben Simmons also had his athleticism get completely zapped in his mid-20’s because of his back and is mentally weak

 

The problem the Rockets have is that Sengun and Amen have the same weakness, and it is hard to overcome with the players on the team (at least with how they are deployed) in certain games. It is obvious that the Rockets are better with Sengun and Amen. It is obvious that the Rockets are better with KD despite the protests by many on this board. The same for Reed. So far, the Rockets have had mixed success when playing them together, and when staggering them instead (mostly Reed).

I think defenses are getting better at helping off non-shooters. Amen has been punishing teams individually, but team's shooting has not been enough to punish defenses overall for this tactic, lately. I still think trying to play Amen, Reed, Durant, and Sengun together will be best for season overall to fight the spacing problems even if it has hiccups in the short term. I worry defenses on better teams are going to be copying what has worked for the weaker teams.

 

In retrospect, Jabari should've gone out instead of Dillon. Jabari needs to be that "Derrick White" or "Alex Caruso" or "Trevor Ariza" guy in the starting 5 and he just isn't. People look at Jabari and focus on the wrong things I feel. He isn't going to be a superstar for the same reason he isn't going to be an elite role player. Intelligence. I don't think he processes the game at a high enough level to justify the minutes he plays. Dillon is a much smarter player than Jabari Smith (and Tari Eason who is even less intelligent). This team would've probably been better served sending out Jabari - Tari - Jalen for KD and drafting Cedric Coward.

I don't worry much about the Sengun/Amen pairing because at the minimum, Amen will develop a decent enough outside shot. They are also both high IQ players (as is Reed and KD). The weak link is Jabari (and take your pick of whoever replaces him in the starting lineup). I've seen enough through 3.5 seasons to know that he just isn't going to be a high IQ guy. Reed is the tougher one to analyze because he is an absolute disaster on both sides of the ball recently. He and Jabari are single handedly the reason for our recent struggles. Neither is putting up much on defense or offense and that's how you lose to the Mavs, Kings and Blazers.

 

I agree that Reed, Jabari, and injuries are the reason for our recent struggles. Reed and Jabari are both super young, so you either have to live with their inconsistencies as they develop or trade them. Some of us are more patient than others and want us to continue the development process. Others want us to go for it now, mainly because of the Durant trade. I wouldn’t mind trading Jabari and/or Reed for younger players that are a better fit, but am totally against trading them for a rental or for an expensive vet that is going to have to deal with the same inadequate offensive scheme and coaching that we have now. The time for re-assessment is in the off-season, not a panic move at the deadline.

 

The deadline is a lot like the January Euro Transfer window in Euro football. Panic moves where you overpay and dont get much from it. I dont think we should trade Reed but Jabari and Tari should probably be on the block. Amen has shown more in less time than Jabari and just forces himself onto a game in a manner Jabari has never been capable of. I really wanted to give Jabari as many opportunities to succeed and I feel like they have. But its time to call a spade a spade.

 

It’s just about what the return is. Same with Tari. No use trading just to be trading out of frustration. Neither is untouchable, we only have 2 guys, Amen and Sengun, that meet that criteria.Trading them as salary dumps or draft picks is pretty much giving up on this season, since we have no replacements for either one.

 

JSJ is younger, and the contract would not have fit for trade purposes. The Rockets dealt Brooks and Jalen because they had to match salary. Even if Brooks was not in the trade, his salary would have been too big to keep if JSJ was dealt instead. JSJ in trade or not would not have affected whether Brooks was a Rocket.

I don't bank on Amen developing a three-point shot. I have much more faith in JSJ getting his percentage acceptable than I do in Amen. Mid range, he's much likelier to get much better there, but the three point shot is what is needed to keep defenders honest.

Two people can't be singlehandedly the reason, despite both sucking lately. If Reed is judged soley by the last 5 games, he is absolutely worthless. However, he had about a month and half when he was probably the 2nd or 3rd best Rocket if judged solely by that sample. I'm comfortable thinking he's the 4th best Rocket on the team with Tari and Adams really the only people with an argument that they could be the 4th best player.

 

Not sure the point of the comparison.

One gets spoon fed lobs and easy layups in the dunker spot.

The other is asked to ISO from the top of the key and post up with no spacing and double teams.

 

I didn't think Amen being better than JSJ was in question. JSJ is still a valuable rotation player.

 

No need for the comparison, but if you think Amen is getting spoon fed his points from the dunker spot you have not been watching the games or have really bad observation skills.

 

compare their assists, usage and offensive rating as well for the last 10 games

 

Dunker spot, on cuts, etc. I mean off-ball in general. Half his points are assisted, and that’s just a fact – 51.1% per bball ref and NBA.

And you know what’s interesting?

In wins, his points assisted % goes up to 55.6%

In losses, it’s 44%.

So basically, when Amen has the ball in his hands, we are a worse team.

 

This is what killed Ben Simmons. It wasn't that he couldn't shoot 3s. It's that he couldn't shoot free throws and that spiraled into him being to scared to drive because he was cared to get fouled and have to shoot free throws. Amen's free throw shooting is very very encouraging and honestly a little surprising even. He's safe from ever being like Ben.

 

These are unrelated to what I said.

I said that we moved him to a new position and his impact numbers suffered.

Do you acknowledge we voluntarily moved him to a new position? Do you get that the same exact shot blocker will get fewer blocks at the PG position? That if Wemby was chasing Steph Curry around he'd have fewer opportunities to leave his man to block someone else's shot at the rim?

He's getting fewer blocks, he's involved in fewer defensive plays, he's taking more difficult shots now that he's guarded by the best perimeter defender, etc.

I'm not here to fight you. I'm genuinely sincerely asking you this question. Do you know that these things happen? Because if you don't know or don't believe they happen, then I totally understand why you believe what you said.

 

Amen is scoring about 6 more points per game lately than he was earlier this season. Most of those extra points are from increasing on-ball reps. That said, he still gets a lot of dunker spot reps, cuts, and offensive rebounds. Also, there is nothing wrong with being an elite cutter/finissher from the dunker spot.

 

There's a lot of people in here that want to believe its "Sengun's team" when in actuality its both. Different dynamics. Sengun isnt an open court threat like Amen doesnt have a back to the basket game. They are our best prospects and I'd prefer they both get the most reps with Durant filling an ancillary role than this current Sengun/Durant two man game which is just a ret*rded version of the FVV/Sengun two man game. FVV wasnt Durant efficient but he also wasnt a turnover waiting to happen.

Sengun has gone away from his middies and Amen isnt putting them up either. Instead we waste a lot of time and get KD the ball with 7 seconds left for him to hurriedly chuck a shot that would be a bad shot for literally every other human on earth. Bad way to run an offense.