Ok so to put this in to context, I've watched 15 NBA games in the last 3 days, I am watching the games. I grew up playing the sport in organised leagues with a parent who played the sport at college in the US. I was better at other sports (Rugby, Lacrosse, Track) but I have represented my country as a teenager in international play against kids from Germany, France, Spain, Italy and most other northwestern Europe countries. Now, this is back in the 90's when most of those teams still sucked and had a long way to go but I do understand the game of basketball having been watching the NBA since 1992 and it being literally the only non-video game or music form of entertainment I partake in. Games, podcasts, sports shows etc. It's all I do. And I'm not saying "no metrics." I'm saying Stats (real numbers matter) + metrics + eye test. You need to look at it all holistically and judge which of those things will give you the best results in evaluation. Metrics and "moreyball" works great like money ball in baseball if you're able to identify players with freak statistical advantages to maximise lower talent. Metrics alone can not find Michael Jordan though, same as advanced stats. You can't record in numbers what it is to be able to play through something like the flu game and do what that man did. You can't just record in numbers the poetry of Hakeem dream-shaking the ****ing ADMIRAL out of his boots and making him not only look like a rookie, but flat out shell shocked in his post game interview. Sports isn't just numbers, it's art, flair, poetry, trust in your team mates, and maybe most of all HEART.
Also as a side note, Castle aint **** either. The god damn disrespect of people comparing him to Amen deserves a backhand slap tbh.
Again I don’t watch Castle and don’t give a F if he’s good or bad. Matter of fact I hope he’s a bust since he plays for the Spurs. I just don’t agree with xxx must be a bad player because he can’t shoot. There’re plenty of bad shooters having big impact in the game.
Even you, watching 15 games outa 26 or whatever if you do that consistently are not spending time on synergy and all that to watch the individual players, are you? The amount you watch would put you in the top 99.99% of nba fans though. Jordan has basically the best metrics/advanced stats in history though.
That's fair, but yeah I hope he's a bust too. He probably does have potential like all of them, but people definitely can't prop him up any more than they can Reed yet. I hope Reed starts to break through (like I say, find a guard, put him in the G-league with Fred mentoring and let him actually develop without ****ing up our run) and Castle turns out like Josh Christopher (sorry Williamson.)
I genuinely consume almost nothing but basketball tbh, but I don't sit reading every single metric all the time because that's a frivolous waste of time to me on something I don't consider anything like the be all and end all. Michael Jordan is 140th in TS% Kevin Martin is 76th. Jimmy Butler is 59th Mikal Bridges is 44th (isn't it strange that the higher the TS% the worst the scorer?) I'm very lucky to have a job where I don't deal with other people, when I'm having to do stuff that requires eyes I listen to pundits. When I have free eyes and I'm not working I'm watching basketball. I'm still recovering from a pretty serious accident, you'd be surprised how much content you consume when it's the only hobby you're able to do. Numbers can tell us a lot, they can't tell us everything. Kobe's one of the GOATs, more rings and accolades than most of your metric darlings. Real NBA players hold him in the highest esteem. If you're arrogant enough to believe you know more about basketball than the greatest people to play the game that's on you, it's a conceit I wouldn't afford myself.
i would never value the opinion of someone like kendrick perkins over someone like sam presti because one of them played, but i know a lot of people feel the other way. Who are my metrics darlings that i consider above kobe?
(That one stat - 3 point shooting - is exactly why Reed was drafted) My original point was that Reed's sample size is very small ..... all I'm saying is let's give him half a season or so to show us something before we write him off as a loss. He has shown signs of improvement. He was really never expected to contribute much this season anyway, before the injury to FVV, that just sped up the timeline for him. He might be found money .... and even if not, what have we lost?
If you live by the metrics then there's several mediocre ringless players who don't come close but absolutely destroy him according to "the data." But yeah I agree, don't listen to Kendrick Perkins or Gilbert ****ing Arenas and his Jerry Springer ****. But you don't think people like LeBron, KD, Steve Nash, Melo etc might know something about the game? Man I can't wait for Chris Paul to retire, I know a lot of players don't like him but could imagine if we start getting insights from that basketball mind into the game? Even the ones who may not seem the most erudite can give you a perspective you've never had. When good players actually talk about the details of the game it's really worth listening, you'll learn something.
Lebron is pretty good, nash is good, kd is actually not bad. Never heard melo but in general i don't find most of their stuff too interesting. Jordan, Magic are absolutely terrible. Who are the ringless mediocre players who destroy kobe according to the "data"? Are you talking about Garnett? I absolutely think he's above kobe and i don't think it's particularly close but he's the only name i can think of.
I think the main point we disagree on is I just think he'd be better off going to the G-league and getting a lot more playing time to really learn to play the point. There's clear potential, but we're all-in on KD. I genuinely don't think it's an insane take to want to see if we can get a PG who can actually fill Fred's role to plug the glaring weak spot in the team that Reed actually is right now. If we could move a few other players and get back a real primary ball handler to keep it steady when Alpi's resting and then Reed comes back after ASB full of confidence and knowing where the **** he's supposed to be instead of doing suicides between the court markings on every possession is that a bad thing?
Dude listen to yourself "LeBron is pretty good" are you crazy? Take a step back and realise you are not as knowledgeable as probably the second greatest player to lace up a pair of sneakers. The arrogance is genuinely astonishing.
I don't think i'm more knowledgeable... i meant in terms of being interesting to listen to. Shaq is a top 10 all time guy, do you think he can tell you anything? I sure haven't heard him, granted i stopped watching that kinda stuff years ago. Have you listened to jordan or magic? They provide absolutely nothing. Completely useless.
At the same time, anyone comparing Nash to a HOFer during his first 5 yrs in the league would have probably been ridiculed as well. As long as Reed shows a positive attitude and a willingness to learn with good work ethic, he'll end up being a decent NBA player, and maybe even more. I doubt he'll do stupidass things like Jalen did during his time here, and Jalen never showed any improvement in all 4 of his seasons here. Those are the type of players you need to get rid of.
right now he's an awful offensive player, but he's also very young. You should always expect young guards to suck, they almost always do.
I have league pass, I've watched a few full Spurs games. The way handles the ball and facilitates their offense is ahead of where Reed is right now. He also gets into the lane fairly easily and can finish. I understand he isn't a great shooter yet, but RIGHT NOW, he is more polished than Reed, I can promise you that. Will that be true in 2 years??...hopefully not. Think about Jabari, for his first couple of years, the gap between him and Banchero was veerry wide, but Jabri is closing in....
Wait do people seriously put Castle and Amen on the same sentence? For real? lmao do we not know that Amen Thompson is 9th overall in the entire League in EPM now? Can we stop this madness and just be normal fans and normal people, please?
