LMAO republicans somehow never have the money to better the lives of Americans, but they’ve got millions to spend on Trump’s birthday parade and some damn ball room, and billions for Argentina and Israel matter of fact, we have to cut programs like SNAP, SS, and take away healthcare meanwhile, r****ded MAGA’s beg their daddy for more and think they’re winning they really convinced these lemmings that their healthcare needs to be cut because “illegals are getting free healthcare”
you said heavy crude was the "only thing" the US could refine. the largest consumer and refiner in world intaking and refining 30% of something else is a different reality.
What became of the false flag accusation? It was reported a month a go but it's been crickets since. https://www.latintimes.com/venezuel...leged-dea-agents-massive-drug-shipment-589688
I assume all this is because Trump is demanding some extreme concession that Maduro doesn't want to give on (that he step down? that he give up the oil industry?). But, I have a hard time feeling bad for Maduro, who is just another Trump himself.
Maduro agreed to cut off china/ru and allow us business to get in on the oil in his country and they still rejected
Then there is something else Trump is asking for. He fancies himself a genius negotiator. He is always trying to force people into a deal. It will not be something so straightforward as an outright invasion of Venezuela, unless Maduro refuses to the last. I'm not saying Trump is bluffing, but he has a concession he wants from Maduro in mind, and he'll stop all this sabre-rattling once he gets it.
As they say . . .. once you give in to him . . . he will start demanding more and more Are we moving to a Land War now? Rocket River
The USA doesn't need to and shouldn't declare war against Venezuela. Honestly, the USA doesn't need a lot of involvement with Venezuela. The USA has it's own issues to deal with and more pressing concerns with Europe and PRC when it comes to international relations.
One thing that shouldn't be underestimated about the US military is morale affecting mission long-term success. In cases like Normandy, when talking to veterans they truly believed what they were doing was right, and they believed in the mission. Say what you want about the back half of the war, but after 9/11 our troops really believed in stopping terrorism, and there was alot of initial success. I think with Venezuela this is so nakedly about oil, and corruption that I just can't for the life of me understand how the generals all the way down to the platoon leaders will really be able to inspire troops that what they are doing is fighting for freedom, and battling evil. I think they will ALL be proud to fight for their country and will ALL be proud to support each other as a band of brothers (yes and sisters). However I suspect the word "Fubar" will be used ALOT in terms of mission details, and understanding the why about their missions. That I think will not necessarily impact success in the short term in the shock and awe phase. I think you'll see that be successful, and you could even see Maduro be taken out relatively quick. However the insurgency phase will be really challenging with a country this vast, and with millions of angry Venezuelans looking to help out whoever takes up the insurgency mantle if and when Maduro is initially taken out. If the mission is just take out Maduro... whatever... you won't solve anything long term but you could see US get in and out relatively quick. However if they are actually going to go into Venezuela, and enact regime change in a way that actually allows the US and the oil and gas oligarchs to control the oil reserves, and natural minerals in order to seize that perceived gold mine... this war will be VERY ugly for the US, and will be just as if not more difficult than Afghanistan and Vietnam.... and do not underestimate troop morale when mission objectives are well... murky at best both strategically and morally.
If you are a US troop especially with the Army, and you have to ask yourself "why Venezuela"... I think you run a very huge risk of troop morale weighing down this war. Nobody will be out there wanting to jump on grenades. The commanding officers will be very focused on preserving lives and conservative with making ground gains. The intelligence folks will be really driving alot of the missions IMO with the focus on drug cartels being the new WMD's, and I think that'll frustrate the hell out of commanding officers supporting them on wild goose chase missions just looking for any justification for actually being there when we all know (and the troops won't take long to figure out as well) that they are there to secure the oil reserves more than anything.
I am not privy to what the US intelligence is but what I do know is that Venezuela is a massive country, with nearly 35 million people in it and lots of mountains, terrain and an infrastructure. Any effort to declare war would be very difficult. At first there would be support in Venezuela for an invasion or bombing, but that would change when dead bodies piled up. Anytime a country the size of Venezuela has a regime change that is violent, there is a power vacuum, chaos and a long period back to stability. It would also impact the rest of South America greatly and trickle into the USA. If the USA wants to take a hardline at the border to keep out Venezuelan and other refugee asylum seekers, they can do that. If they want to try and improve relations with Maduro - they can do that, but that isn't something a lot of Americans would support. This sounds like a really foolish and expensive cluster **** that really could damage the USA long term - the impact from the USA response to 9-11 and the endless wars in Iraq, Afghanistan and meddling in Israel, Syria and Libya are still eating at the United States.
Totally... and to be honest with you, even 5 or 6 years ago I think that version of Donald Trump doesn't seriously consider for two seconds taking out Maduro, and invading Venezuela with ground troops. The fact that this is even a possibility at this point tells us that something has gone array with Trump. I think it's a combination of things. Mental decline. Political intuition that they could do a war on drugs for politics. Insecurity in his power needing to show his dominance. Corruption and oil. Marco Rubio having more and more power, and having a personal agenda. Basically alot of different reasons but all extremely muddled, and none of it compelling to US citizens except for the super ignorant that will believe the company line if Trump comes out and says we are going to war because Venezuelans are killing millions of American with their drugs. But most importantly to my point, the troops and their commanding officers will very quickly get to the "Fubar" phase, and ground missions will be sllllooowwww.... which will lead to drawn out conflict, and a very very unpopular war.
Yeah, this is what the US does. The contented liberals keep trying to pretend this type of stuff was only done by Republicans or in the bad old days of overthrowing Mossadegh in Iran or Arbenz in Guatemals,, Allende or supporting the death squads back in Argentina etc. They forget or are intentionally ignorant (with help from the mainstream media, of course) that Obama supported the coup against the democratically elected President Zelaya of Honduras. Fortunately we now have his return from exile and his wife is president. The hawks of both parties support this stuff. It is interesting that some of the MAGA types are becoming less pro-war and this might cause some problems within the GOP, though some like Lidssy Graham and Hedsputh are still tslking about how we could have won in Vietnam, Afganistan etc. if it wasn't for those p***y libs. Like America's enabling of the Gazan genocide this is a hit to America's reputation that will e hard to overcome.
Addressing the largely practical complaints about US troop morale in another war, this time with Venezuela and perhaps Columbia, I think it is very doubtful that we will send troops. The current US strategy is not to lose American lives as it becomes unpopular. See Vietnam which ended the draftee army for elective wars. Iraq and Afghanistan have been putting limits on even the "volunteer" army which with the exception of only a few desk type positions, usually for resume building, our politcians kids don't fight in. The main strategy is to aggravate any internal tension usually by "NGO's allegedly to promote democracy or human rights and therebye create chaos and civil wars to overthrow governments we don't like, whether democratic or undemocratic. Huge amounts of deaths in the countries we do this to are a non-issue. Though there can be blowback such as refugees to Europe or even America as we have seen with Cuban and Venezuela etc. Examples of this are Ukraine, Syria, Sudan, Libya and numerous others. Like Trump has done with Venezuela Obama gave the CIA an order to overthrow Assad in Syria by any.means necessary. Trump of course did this publicly which was not as strategic as Obama's secrecy.relative
Invading Venezulea with troops for regime change is going to end Trump. Quagmire for years. Looking forward to it. It'll be disasterous for America long and short term, but so is essentially everything Trumpy has done in office. We'll be picking individual revolutionaries out of the jungle for however many years like ticks off a dog that loves to run in the woods until we give up and arbitrarily declare victory and bail. If its given that Trump is going to take **** all over America, I'd prefer he's stroke out on the toilet like Elvis. The ENTIRE HISTORY of Venezuela is a quagmire for everybody involved all the way back to Gran Colombia. It was a quagmire for Simon Bolivar. Trump is totally unburdened by the weight of things that didnt happen directly to him. He's the perfect idiot for this mistake. Do you think Trump could give you a synopsis of the history of Venezuela? LOL. Someone has convinced him it'll take 5 minutes and be totally clean, like Putin's 3 days to Kiev. Trump would NEVER punch somrone that might be able to put up resistance. He's in for a surprise and it will be glorious. Trump is trying to do is whole Bush in Iraq regime change thing and it will end just as well. But at least with GWB he had the dumb honesty to be straight with the public about the goals. Trumpy just contunues to lie to the public about everything, including motives. We're going to be in a full scale invasion and half the country won't even be aware what's happening.
Trump is now the daddy of OP. Baghdad Bob is the purveyor of fake news. For the last 4 and a half year in this forum, he’s trying to sell us that Biden is the greatest president that ever lived. Lol Trump is gonna make Venezuela prosperous again like in the 80s by going after these communists and narco terrorists. You woke shiithead are always a day late and a dollar short.
I'm just very doubtful he does that. He might be trying to force regime change and I'm sure he's not averse to military action, but the implication that he might send ground troops is TACO material. Its saber rattling. He might blow up some crap or assassinate Maduro with some cruise missiles, but he is not so dumb as to send ground forces. I don't believe it. He wants the kudos for making a deal. He doesn't want the reputation for starting a new endless war. He said he was going to bring fire and fury on North Korea and then pivoted. He has flip-flopped back and forth on Ukraine trying to put pressure on one side and then the other. He brings tariffs and then takes them off and then puts them back on to pressure countries to sign trade deals with him. He's just trying to undermine his counterparty's BATNA (best alternative to a negotiated agreement). In the case of Venezuela, he's shown he can take lawless actions with impunity and threatening to do more. He will do more until Maduro concedes. But occupying the country probably makes the concession a pyrrhic victory. So, that's one future I don't foresee.
