I just find it funny you are saying Green is being molded as a traditional shooting guard implying a more off ball usage role when all statistical trends to point to this phenomenon are the direct opposite of your claim such as unassisted rate on fgs made, amount of primary one ball handler possessions per game etc. You are making this claim in a time where Ime is explicitly making Green the primary ball handler for entire fourth quarters consistently for over a month now. Jalen Green has never been more on ball over the past couple of months than at any point of his career even under Silas.
Your mind is very linear. It's baffling. Just because you're the "primary ball handler" doesn't mean you can't develop your your off-ball attributes. Steph Curry is an on-ball player who is also the greatest off-ball player of all time. Just because you're the one bringing up the ball doesn't mean you're necessarily the one who always initiates the offense - Sengun and Green obviously are 1a and 1b in offense initiation, with Amen as a secondary initiation option. I've often argued that we should let FVV walk and make Green the "PG," but that's not because I think he's a traditional PG or because I want him in some ISO-centric role; rather, our team dynamic is one where our three best players can all initiate the offense, so I don't think it really matters who brings up the ball.
You are claiming Jalen Green is a complentary piece to Amen and I'm denying that claim and you are saying my denial of that claim is equivalent of saying we run a Jalen Green heliocentric offense. Do you understand the wide gap in claims between claiming Green is a complimentary piece to Amen and we run a heliocentric offense through Green? We don't and Green isn't a complentary piece to Amen on offense. I guess it depends on your definition of "complentary". Are you using it in a sense to say they both complement each other meaning you would agree with the term "Amen is complentary to Green" also or are you using the term "complentary" as in "role player". When you say he's being groomed as a traditional off ball sg to Amen I'm thinking it's the later and that's a unhinged claim then given how Green has been playing more on ball then ever before and that his biggest improvement on offense isn't shooting but being a competent primary ball handler who can run an offense for entire fourth quarters competently. That is his biggest improvement this season on offense so it can be said with more evidence backing the claim that Green is being groomed to be a primary ball handler more than anyone else on the team.
Honestly, at this point, it's like talking to a wall. You keep repeating the same things over and over, repeating lines I never actually said. I never said Green is developing as an offensive complement to Amen - you made that up in your weird mind. I said Green is developing skills that complement Amen and Sengun's skillsets, which he is. Green is not developing into more of an "on-ball player" in the sense that he's running more ISO plays - he's just initiating the offense more than FVV, who is taking a backseat as Green, Amen, and Sengun develop. That is why Green's usage rate hasn't gone up even though he's on-ball more - the last 20 games, his usage rate is 27.4%, which is exactly on par for the season. That is because, even though he is bringing the ball up, he generally initiates the offense after he does so through Sengun and/or Amen, after which he operates off-ball (like a SG). By the way, how is the term "complementary" an insult? That makes no sense to me. The ultimate "complementary" player to me is Curry - you can place in on any team with any offense in any modern era and he'd thrive AND make the team way better. That's just not true of non-complementary players like prime Harden, Westbrook, or even guys like Cade and Paolo. You have to build a team around those guys. The Pistons were terrible until they built the right team around Cade because you need to do that with someone like him.
These claims of Green being merely the one who brings up the ball to allow Amen and Sengun to operate their offense can easily be debunked with things like seeing who leads the team in primary one ball handler duties. Primary ball handlers don't iso a lot. They spam pnr ball handler possessions. Look at all the leading "primary ball handlers" in the league and see what possessions they are most frequent in. Wing scorers usually are the ones who have the most "iso" possessions. Think of prime Carmelo Anthony. Primary ball handling guards don't spam iso possessions. They spam primary pnr ball handler possessions. Jalen. green isn't just bringing the ball up and letting Amen create. Green instead is creating advantages for his teammates by breaking the initial perimeter defense and Amen takes advantage with the short roll or dunker spot.
lol so Green doesn’t bring up the ball to let Amen operate, he brings up the ball and Amen operates because Green brought the ball up. Good lord you make no sense.
If you understood how usage rate is calculated, you would avoid using that argument. Usage rate is at and output metric. That determines how many possessions a player uses up to produce the Field gold attempts, assists and turnovers they make. Jalen green being more on ball than ever before in his career and maintaining the same usage rate means that he's being more efficient with his possessions. Do you understand that?
lol sure, Green's usage rate hasn't gone up because he's more efficient with his possessions. That makes way more sense as opposed to his usage rate hasn't gone up because he's merely initiating the offense, which is a non-final act and thus doesn't factor into the calculation.
What are you exactly implying here? Be more granular with your word choice. What do you mean by Jalen Green brings the ball up and let's Amen operate? Like Green brings the ball up and a we draw up iso clear out plays for Amen? Or are you using the term "operate" differently like Harden beings the ball up to allow Clint Cappella to "operate" as a lob threat and screen roller? Because no, our offense resembles nothing like Green bringing the ball up and dumping it to Amen and doing iso clear outs. That rarely happens. Amen is used as a short roller or is in the dunker spot when Green operates as a primary ball handler.
Brah do you understand your initial claim is essentialy "Green is being groomed to be a traditional sg next to Amen".during a period where Green is on ball more than ever and Amen is being used as a dunker spot guy or short roller more than ever? Your claims are the complete opposite of the trajectory of the season.
I'll take a more explosive Jamal Murray for sure. Seems like hes developing in this way. Needs to add some bulk this offseason and work on his catch and shoot. Him, Jabari and Reed as satellites to Amen and Sengun is a dream scenario for me (so long as they all continue their trajectory and we don't land the #1 pick with the Phoenix pick).
I NEVER SAID HE WAS GROOMED TO BE A TRADITIONAL SG NEXT TO AMEN. I'm convinced you are insane, man. I'm done here.
This is exactly that I think - rather than Harden, Cade, etc., Green's developing more in the Murray mold, a SG who brings up the ball so we can run the offense through others - generally a center but sometimes a point-forward - while he operates offball. Now, it's not a perfect comparison as I expect Green rather than Sengun to be our leading scorer, but generally yes, that's what I'm saying.
You literally said he's being groomed to be a complimentary piece to Amen and you are saying the evidence is with a magical non existent off ball sg role that fits with Amen. You literally did and I bet most people who agree with you on this back and forth also are trying to push the same agenda as seen here. Amen thompson.a dude who plays the dunker spot and short roller on offense is going to have Jalen Green the dude dominating primary ball handler possessions the past month as a satalite to Amen. Jalen Green is doing what people addicted to a potential Amen led offense wish Amen was doing now. You can easily say I'm putting words in your litu of you simply just say you are using the term "complentary" interchangeably with "fits well together" which implies you would just as easily say Amen is complentary to Jalen Green. So is Amen complentary to Green also?
Are we running a offense through Amen now as we speak? Do you believe a player operating in the dunker spot or short roller is someone we "run the offense through". Is Jamal Murray bringing the ball up and letting Aaron Gordon(the guy who fits Amen's role the most on this team's offense) run the half court offense? Ya Murray brings the ball up to let Jokic run the offense a lot. Sure. And Green brings the ball up a lo.to initiate a Sengun post up where we run the offense through Alpi because again Jalen and Alpi are the two main focal points on offense. They are the fulcrum of the offense. But that isn't the case with Amen. Amen again when Jalen brings the ball up is almost solely used as a guy on the dunker spot or as a screener to set up a short roll situation especially when defenses blitz Green off the pnr
I will say what I said one final time, then I am done with you. I said Green is focusing on developing skills that complement Amen and Sengun's skillsets, on offense AND defense. I never said is focused on being a complementary offensive player to Amen. As someone else pointed out, Green seems to be developing in a Jamal Murray mold - a shooting guard who brings the ball up to initiate an offense, primarily through an offensive hub center. I expect Green to continue to be our lead scorer -- I just don't think he'll be a 27 - 28 ppg player. He'll probably end up more like a 24 - 25 ppg player, with Sengun as a 21 - 22/10 guy and Amen as a guy who averages like 17 - 20 ppg while filing up the stat sheet. Obviously I could be wrong - this is just a prediction. No, I don't think Amen can do what Green does offensively, just like I don't think Green can do what Amen does defensively. That doesn't mean they can't both work on the areas that can complement the other. In that vein, yes, Amen should try and complement Green by working on his 3 ball, ball handling, etc. Your mentality is strange. I'm convinced you're more of a Green fan than a Rockets fan.
